Hi everyone,
There's been some comments that the phrasing for a -1 vote in Gerrit ("I'd prefer that you didn't submit this") is kind of personal and we can do better.
I did some testing and this is totally configurable :) It won't change for old comments that were already submitted, but we can pick some nicer wording going forward.
I really don't have any good suggestions for this, so I'm opening this up to the list for a bit of good old fashioned bikeshedding.
Thanks!
-Chad
* I found a problem in this revision
* There is a problem in this revision
* Thank you for submitting your revision, but there is some error in your code
Some suggestions :)
On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 3:10 PM, Chad innocentkiller@gmail.com wrote:
Hi everyone,
There's been some comments that the phrasing for a -1 vote in Gerrit ("I'd prefer that you didn't submit this") is kind of personal and we can do better.
I did some testing and this is totally configurable :) It won't change for old comments that were already submitted, but we can pick some nicer wording going forward.
I really don't have any good suggestions for this, so I'm opening this up to the list for a bit of good old fashioned bikeshedding.
Thanks!
-Chad
Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
+1 for There is a problem with this revision. as it doesn't make use of any personal words like 'you' or 'i'
Maybe even append 'Please fix' to give an action to the sender.
e.g. There is a problem with this revision. Please fix.
On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 2:17 PM, Petr Bena benapetr@gmail.com wrote:
I found a problem in this revision
There is a problem in this revision
Thank you for submitting your revision, but there is some error in your code
Some suggestions :)
On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 3:10 PM, Chad innocentkiller@gmail.com wrote:
Hi everyone,
There's been some comments that the phrasing for a -1 vote in Gerrit ("I'd prefer that you didn't submit this") is kind of personal and we can do better.
I did some testing and this is totally configurable :) It won't change for old comments that were already submitted, but we can pick some nicer wording going forward.
I really don't have any good suggestions for this, so I'm opening this up to the list for a bit of good old fashioned bikeshedding.
Thanks!
-Chad
Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
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"This patch cannot be merged in the current state" or something like that.
—vvv
On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 5:10 PM, Chad innocentkiller@gmail.com wrote:
Hi everyone,
There's been some comments that the phrasing for a -1 vote in Gerrit ("I'd prefer that you didn't submit this") is kind of personal and we can do better.
I did some testing and this is totally configurable :) It won't change for old comments that were already submitted, but we can pick some nicer wording going forward.
I really don't have any good suggestions for this, so I'm opening this up to the list for a bit of good old fashioned bikeshedding.
Thanks!
-Chad
Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
I support the less personal wording, but "cannot" is more like -2.
-1 is more like "should not".
-- Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי http://aharoni.wordpress.com “We're living in pieces, I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore
2012/3/28 Victor Vasiliev vasilvv@gmail.com:
"This patch cannot be merged in the current state" or something like that.
—vvv
On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 5:10 PM, Chad innocentkiller@gmail.com wrote:
Hi everyone,
There's been some comments that the phrasing for a -1 vote in Gerrit ("I'd prefer that you didn't submit this") is kind of personal and we can do better.
I did some testing and this is totally configurable :) It won't change for old comments that were already submitted, but we can pick some nicer wording going forward.
I really don't have any good suggestions for this, so I'm opening this up to the list for a bit of good old fashioned bikeshedding.
Thanks!
-Chad
Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Le 28/03/12 15:10, Chad a écrit :
There's been some comments that the phrasing for a -1 vote in Gerrit ("I'd prefer that you didn't submit this") is kind of personal and we can do better.
Better as make it even more personal ? :-D
My suggestion is:
"This patchset needs to be improved"
That sounds positive to me. At least improving something is probably more of a reward than fixme.
Sometime, we might have a patch which is fine to merge but not perfect yet, so I guess that case is covered by my suggestion.
A fun one would be:
"Much to learn you still have...my old padawan."
Would probably make a Yoda job in Jenkins just for that :-D
I agree. Having 'you' or 'i' makes the message personal when the focus should remain on the commit itself.
+ 1 This patch needs improvement. | Needs improvement, this patch does. ( if we go with the yoda job )
On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 8:29 AM, Antoine Musso hashar+wmf@free.fr wrote:
Le 28/03/12 15:10, Chad a écrit :
There's been some comments that the phrasing for a -1 vote in Gerrit ("I'd prefer that you didn't submit this") is kind of personal and we can do better.
Better as make it even more personal ? :-D
My suggestion is:
"This patchset needs to be improved"
That sounds positive to me. At least improving something is probably more of a reward than fixme.
Sometime, we might have a patch which is fine to merge but not perfect yet, so I guess that case is covered by my suggestion.
A fun one would be:
"Much to learn you still have...my old padawan."
Would probably make a Yoda job in Jenkins just for that :-D
-- Antoine "hashar" Musso
Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 2:05 PM, Rob Moen rmoen@wikimedia.org wrote:
I agree. Having 'you' or 'i' makes the message personal when the focus should remain on the commit itself.
- 1
This patch needs improvement. | Needs improvement, this patch does. ( if we go with the yoda job )
I've combined a little bit of everyone's suggestions so far (other than Yoda).
How does "There is a problem with this patchset, please fix" sound?
-Chad
On 03/29/2012 09:20 AM, Chad wrote:
On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 2:05 PM, Rob Moen rmoen@wikimedia.org wrote:
I agree. Having 'you' or 'i' makes the message personal when the focus should remain on the commit itself.
- 1
This patch needs improvement. | Needs improvement, this patch does. ( if we go with the yoda job )
I've combined a little bit of everyone's suggestions so far (other than Yoda).
How does "There is a problem with this patchset, please fix" sound?
-Chad
Sounds good to me.
2012/3/29 Chad innocentkiller@gmail.com:
On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 2:05 PM, Rob Moen rmoen@wikimedia.org wrote:
I agree. Having 'you' or 'i' makes the message personal when the focus should remain on the commit itself.
- 1
This patch needs improvement. | Needs improvement, this patch does. ( if we go with the yoda job )
I've combined a little bit of everyone's suggestions so far (other than Yoda).
How does "There is a problem with this patchset, please fix" sound?
Better: please fix it.
Or: please improve it.
-- Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי http://aharoni.wordpress.com “We're living in pieces, I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore
It sounds better. Shame on your that you don't like Yoda
On Thu, Mar 29, 2012 at 3:20 PM, Chad innocentkiller@gmail.com wrote:
On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 2:05 PM, Rob Moen rmoen@wikimedia.org wrote:
I agree. Having 'you' or 'i' makes the message personal when the focus should remain on the commit itself.
- 1
This patch needs improvement. | Needs improvement, this patch does. ( if we go with the yoda job )
I've combined a little bit of everyone's suggestions so far (other than Yoda).
How does "There is a problem with this patchset, please fix" sound?
-Chad
Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
+1 for There is a problem with this patchset, please improve.
Fix suggests you've broken something (Yoda version would be Problem to be improved with this patchset there is.) Does Gerrit support a yoda speak language... would make reviewing even more fun ;-)?
On Thu, Mar 29, 2012 at 2:34 PM, Petr Bena benapetr@gmail.com wrote:
It sounds better. Shame on your that you don't like Yoda
On Thu, Mar 29, 2012 at 3:20 PM, Chad innocentkiller@gmail.com wrote:
On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 2:05 PM, Rob Moen rmoen@wikimedia.org wrote:
I agree. Having 'you' or 'i' makes the message personal when the focus should remain on the commit itself.
- 1
This patch needs improvement. | Needs improvement, this patch does. ( if we go with the yoda job )
I've combined a little bit of everyone's suggestions so far (other than Yoda).
How does "There is a problem with this patchset, please fix" sound?
-Chad
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On Thu, Mar 29, 2012 at 9:42 AM, Jon Robson jrobson@wikimedia.org wrote:
+1 for There is a problem with this patchset, please improve.
Alright, sounds good to me. Thanks for the input everyone. I'll get this fixed soon.
-Chad
+1 for "There is a problem with this patchset"
(without ", please improve").
I think that keeps it more neutral without saying anything the user doesn't intend to say. It also keeps free ambiguity in the intention (to be disambiguated in a comment) between 'wontfix' and 'fixme'.
-- Krinkle
On Mar 29, 2012, at 4:07 PM, Chad wrote:
On Thu, Mar 29, 2012 at 9:42 AM, Jon Robson jrobson@wikimedia.org wrote:
+1 for There is a problem with this patchset, please improve.
Alright, sounds good to me. Thanks for the input everyone. I'll get this fixed soon.
-Chad
Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
On Thu, Mar 29, 2012 at 7:07 AM, Chad innocentkiller@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Mar 29, 2012 at 9:42 AM, Jon Robson jrobson@wikimedia.org wrote:
+1 for There is a problem with this patchset, please improve.
Alright, sounds good to me. Thanks for the input everyone. I'll get this fixed soon.
This was done about an hour ago. Chad made the change and I restarted Gerrit.
The text was changed to "There's a problem with this change, please improve" to get it to fit in the 50-character DB field.
Roan
On 29/03/12 00:10, Chad wrote:
Hi everyone,
There's been some comments that the phrasing for a -1 vote in Gerrit ("I'd prefer that you didn't submit this") is kind of personal and we can do better.
I did some testing and this is totally configurable :) It won't change for old comments that were already submitted, but we can pick some nicer wording going forward.
I really don't have any good suggestions for this, so I'm opening this up to the list for a bit of good old fashioned bikeshedding.
I don't really want Gerrit putting words into my mouth regardless of how nice they sound. There will always be cases where the phrase is inappropriate and offputting, regardless of which one you choose.
How about "Set code review score to -1"? Then a more personal message can be typed by the human doing the review.
-- Tim Starling
No offense to those who have chimed in, but seriously, this is a silly discussion.
Do we really have the bandwidth to be 15 messages deep on this thread?
- Trevor
On Thu, Mar 29, 2012 at 5:24 PM, Tim Starling tstarling@wikimedia.orgwrote:
On 29/03/12 00:10, Chad wrote:
Hi everyone,
There's been some comments that the phrasing for a -1 vote in Gerrit ("I'd prefer that you didn't submit this") is kind of personal and we can do better.
I did some testing and this is totally configurable :) It won't change for old comments that were already submitted, but we can pick some nicer wording going forward.
I really don't have any good suggestions for this, so I'm opening this up to the list for a bit of good old fashioned bikeshedding.
I don't really want Gerrit putting words into my mouth regardless of how nice they sound. There will always be cases where the phrase is inappropriate and offputting, regardless of which one you choose.
How about "Set code review score to -1"? Then a more personal message can be typed by the human doing the review.
-- Tim Starling
Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
"The doctrine of toleration requires a positive as well as a negative statement. It is not only wrong to burn a man on account of his creed, but it is right to encourage the open avowal and defence of every opinion sincerely maintained. Every man who says frankly and fully what he thinks is so far doing a public service."
Leslie Stephen in The Nineteenth Century, via Wikiquote.
On 30/03/12 17:10, Trevor Parscal wrote:
No offense to those who have chimed in, but seriously, this is a silly discussion.
Do we really have the bandwidth to be 15 messages deep on this thread?
- Trevor
On Thu, Mar 29, 2012 at 5:24 PM, Tim Starling tstarling@wikimedia.orgwrote:
On 29/03/12 00:10, Chad wrote:
Hi everyone,
There's been some comments that the phrasing for a -1 vote in Gerrit ("I'd prefer that you didn't submit this") is kind of personal and we can do better.
I did some testing and this is totally configurable :) It won't change for old comments that were already submitted, but we can pick some nicer wording going forward.
I really don't have any good suggestions for this, so I'm opening this up to the list for a bit of good old fashioned bikeshedding.
I don't really want Gerrit putting words into my mouth regardless of how nice they sound. There will always be cases where the phrase is inappropriate and offputting, regardless of which one you choose.
How about "Set code review score to -1"? Then a more personal message can be typed by the human doing the review.
-- Tim Starling
Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
I disagree, the previous message would sound really bit offensive to people who submitted the patch, and is nothing motivating for the volunteers who spend their time trying to help with the project. Imagine you send a code to open source project in a good faith and get the reply: I'd be more happy if you didn't put your nose in our code, because that's exactly how the previous message appeared to me.
On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 8:10 AM, Trevor Parscal tparscal@wikimedia.org wrote:
No offense to those who have chimed in, but seriously, this is a silly discussion.
Do we really have the bandwidth to be 15 messages deep on this thread?
- Trevor
On Thu, Mar 29, 2012 at 5:24 PM, Tim Starling tstarling@wikimedia.orgwrote:
On 29/03/12 00:10, Chad wrote:
Hi everyone,
There's been some comments that the phrasing for a -1 vote in Gerrit ("I'd prefer that you didn't submit this") is kind of personal and we can do better.
I did some testing and this is totally configurable :) It won't change for old comments that were already submitted, but we can pick some nicer wording going forward.
I really don't have any good suggestions for this, so I'm opening this up to the list for a bit of good old fashioned bikeshedding.
I don't really want Gerrit putting words into my mouth regardless of how nice they sound. There will always be cases where the phrase is inappropriate and offputting, regardless of which one you choose.
How about "Set code review score to -1"? Then a more personal message can be typed by the human doing the review.
-- Tim Starling
Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
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On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 2:10 AM, Trevor Parscal tparscal@wikimedia.org wrote:
No offense to those who have chimed in, but seriously, this is a silly discussion.
I personally don't care what it says (the development version currently says THIS IS THE WORST PATCH EVER!!!). I was fine with "I'd prefer you didn't submit this" too.
Other people seem to disagree and think its important, and it's a 1 minute change.
-Chad
Le 30/03/12 08:10, Trevor Parscal a écrit :
No offense to those who have chimed in, but seriously, this is a silly discussion.
I guess that is how our community has always ran. That is very much alike the diff colors drama we had when deploying 1.19 on enwiki.
Do we really have the bandwidth to be 15 messages deep on this thread?
Bandwith is cheap nowadays :-D
On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 7:58 AM, Antoine Musso hashar+wmf@free.fr wrote:
Le 30/03/12 08:10, Trevor Parscal a écrit :
No offense to those who have chimed in, but seriously, this is a silly discussion.
I guess that is how our community has always ran. That is very much alike the diff colors drama we had when deploying 1.19 on enwiki.
No, I really don't think these two events are alike at all.
But we're quickly digressing...
-Chad
On Thu, Mar 29, 2012 at 8:24 PM, Tim Starling tstarling@wikimedia.org wrote:
I don't really want Gerrit putting words into my mouth regardless of how nice they sound. There will always be cases where the phrase is inappropriate and offputting, regardless of which one you choose.
How about "Set code review score to -1"? Then a more personal message can be typed by the human doing the review.
That doesn't work well the other terms. If you look at the list, they're all talking about the change.
- This looks good to me, approved - Looks good to me, but someone else must approve - Set code review score to -1 - Do not submit
*sings* One of these is not like the others...unless you're suggesting we change all of them to "Set code review score to +2," etc.
-Chad
On Mar 30, 2012, at 2:24 AM, Tim Starling wrote:
On 29/03/12 00:10, Chad wrote:
Hi everyone,
There's been some comments that the phrasing for a -1 vote in Gerrit ("I'd prefer that you didn't submit this") is kind of personal and we can do better.
I did some testing and this is totally configurable :) It won't change for old comments that were already submitted, but we can pick some nicer wording going forward.
I really don't have any good suggestions for this, so I'm opening this up to the list for a bit of good old fashioned bikeshedding.
I don't really want Gerrit putting words into my mouth regardless of how nice they sound. There will always be cases where the phrase is inappropriate and offputting, regardless of which one you choose.
How about "Set code review score to -1"? Then a more personal message can be typed by the human doing the review.
-- Tim Starling
I couldn't agree more. So far all proposal make implications that sometimes simply aren't appropriate. Either they leave no room for fixing it ("Don't submit it"), or are too much foccused on fixing something small, but implying the overal intention is wanted ("Needs improvement") etc. etc.
Just say what you want to say in a comment, the numbers don't add up and are only a brief summary (also note that you can submit a different score at anytime and it will replace your previous score).
Can we just set it to an empty string and let the numbers and hand-written comment speak for themselves?
-- Krinkle
On Mar 29, 2012, at 11:23 PM, Krinkle wrote:
+1 for "There is a problem with this patchset"
(without ", please improve").
I think that keeps it more neutral without saying anything the user doesn't intend to say. It also keeps free ambiguity in the intention (to be disambiguated in a comment) between 'wontfix' and 'fixme'.
-- Krinkle
On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Krinkle krinklemail@gmail.com wrote:
Can we just set it to an empty string and let the numbers and hand-written comment speak for themselves?
I think this will be more confusing. You need some text for the radio field.
In any case these summaries are not meant to replace a comment and I've never implied that they should. You should always take time to explain your review, especially if it's a -1/-2.
-Chad
On Mar 30, 2012, at 3:07 PM, Chad wrote:
On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Krinkle krinklemail@gmail.com wrote:
Can we just set it to an empty string and let the numbers and hand-written comment speak for themselves?
I think this will be more confusing. You need some text for the radio field.
In any case these summaries are not meant to replace a comment and I've never implied that they should. You should always take time to explain your review, especially if it's a -1/-2.
-Chad
On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Krinkle krinklemail@gmail.com wrote:
Can we just set it to an empty string and let the numbers and hand-written comment speak for themselves?
Yes the radio buttons would have the +2/+1/0/-1/-2, just like they after submission.
On Mar 30, 2012, at 3:09 PM, Chad wrote:
On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Krinkle krinklemail@gmail.com wrote:
I couldn't agree more. So far all proposal make implications that sometimes simply aren't appropriate. Either they leave no room for fixing it ("Don't submit it"), or are too much foccused on fixing something small, but implying the overal intention is wanted ("Needs improvement") etc. etc.
Perhaps we could go back to the all-encompassing "fixme." If we did that, I'd suggest adjusting the other ones to one-word summaries as well.
-Chad
I'm not sure "fixme" is entire appropiate either :D
A gerrit review rejection (which is what a down vote suggests if it is unfixable or not fixed) effectively covers both "fixme" and "reverted" (when compared to how we review SVN).
"fixme" is no different than "Needs improvement" (except stronger, maybe).
-- Krinkle
On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 9:27 AM, Krinkle krinklemail@gmail.com wrote:
On Mar 30, 2012, at 3:07 PM, Chad wrote:
On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Krinkle krinklemail@gmail.com wrote:
Can we just set it to an empty string and let the numbers and hand-written comment speak for themselves?
I think this will be more confusing. You need some text for the radio field.
In any case these summaries are not meant to replace a comment and I've never implied that they should. You should always take time to explain your review, especially if it's a -1/-2.
-Chad
On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Krinkle krinklemail@gmail.com wrote:
Can we just set it to an empty string and let the numbers and hand-written comment speak for themselves?
Yes the radio buttons would have the +2/+1/0/-1/-2, just like they after submission.
On Mar 30, 2012, at 3:09 PM, Chad wrote:
On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Krinkle krinklemail@gmail.com wrote:
I couldn't agree more. So far all proposal make implications that sometimes simply aren't appropriate. Either they leave no room for fixing it ("Don't submit it"), or are too much foccused on fixing something small, but implying the overal intention is wanted ("Needs improvement") etc. etc.
Perhaps we could go back to the all-encompassing "fixme." If we did that, I'd suggest adjusting the other ones to one-word summaries as well.
-Chad
I'm not sure "fixme" is entire appropiate either :D
A gerrit review rejection (which is what a down vote suggests if it is unfixable or not fixed) effectively covers both "fixme" and "reverted" (when compared to how we review SVN).
If something is unfixable, not fixed, or flat out not acceptable, then that's what Abandon is for.
"fixme" is no different than "Needs improvement" (except stronger, maybe).
Perhaps, but it does help blur the line between "this is broken" and "this needs improvement."
-Chad
On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Krinkle krinklemail@gmail.com wrote:
I couldn't agree more. So far all proposal make implications that sometimes simply aren't appropriate. Either they leave no room for fixing it ("Don't submit it"), or are too much foccused on fixing something small, but implying the overal intention is wanted ("Needs improvement") etc. etc.
Perhaps we could go back to the all-encompassing "fixme." If we did that, I'd suggest adjusting the other ones to one-word summaries as well.
-Chad
Tim Starling wrote:
I don't really want Gerrit putting words into my mouth regardless of how nice they sound. There will always be cases where the phrase is inappropriate and offputting, regardless of which one you choose.
I agree with Tim here, I was thinking the same on this thread. Gerrit makes it look as if the users really said that, where it's just a predefined text, and you can't even edit it.
How about "Set code review score to -1"? Then a more personal message can be typed by the human doing the review.
I was thinking something like «Changed state to "Needs to be improved"», but that of course is confusing when there are several people involved, as all of them are taken into account (until someone removes them and they vanish into the ether).
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