The 'deleterevision' permission is an instrumental supply if you want to delete a revision of a page due to adding libelous information. But it also allows suppressing log entries and some sysadmins don't want to grant their administrators this possibility.
'deleterevision' as "delete a revision" is no additional possibility. Revisions can also be deleted with 'delete' and 'undelete' permission (but it's more difficult than 'deleterevision' process).
My suggestion is splitting 'deleterevision' permission into:
deleterevision: (un)deleting revisions only suppresslogentry: (un)hiding log entries only
Cheers, Tim
On Mon, Jun 18, 2012 at 4:48 PM, Tim Weyer (SVG) wikitech-l@svg.name wrote:
The 'deleterevision' permission is an instrumental supply if you want to delete a revision of a page due to adding libelous information. But it also allows suppressing log entries and some sysadmins don't want to grant their administrators this possibility.
(1) It's not possible to suppress log entries ; it's possible to mask the IP address / username or the edit summary. The entries with the date and the fact data has been masqueraded are still there.
(2) A sample about technical versus social rules enforcement. On the French Wikipedia, we use these social rules: - Admins use deleterevision for copyvio (yes, on fr.wikipedia, we always had a very strong attitude against copyright and never reverted it, we deleted articles and restore good versions in the past before deleterevision) - Oversights, a group especially created for this use, and so especially trusted, could mask diffamation/libelous /confidential personal information revisions. - But technically, an admin could use its deleterevision right to mask a libellous entry.
'deleterevision' as "delete a revision" is no additional possibility. Revisions can also be deleted with 'delete' and 'undelete' permission (but it's more difficult than 'deleterevision' process).
My suggestion is splitting 'deleterevision' permission into:
deleterevision: (un)deleting revisions only suppresslogentry: (un)hiding log entries only
Fine rights are always a good idea, up to the point extra rights means unmanageable complexity for the people having to configure a MediaWiki setup.
By the way, is it really useful to be able to text content but not the IP/username or the edit comment now I clarified a little bit how the right work?
Cheers, Tim
-- Tim Weyer MediaWiki user "SVG" Git/SVN committer "cervidae"
Wait. Tim are you refering to "hide entries at history tab", or hide entries at Special:Log?
On 06/19/2012 01:44 AM, Platonides wrote:
Wait. Tim are you refering to "hide entries at history tab", or hide entries at Special:Log?
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I don't know what you mean. I just know that I know what I wrote and that I know how does 'deleterevision' permission work.
On 06/18/2012 07:56 PM, Sébastien Santoro wrote:
On Mon, Jun 18, 2012 at 4:48 PM, Tim Weyer (SVG) wikitech-l@svg.name wrote:
The 'deleterevision' permission is an instrumental supply if you want to delete a revision of a page due to adding libelous information. But it also allows suppressing log entries and some sysadmins don't want to grant their administrators this possibility.
(1) It's not possible to suppress log entries ; it's possible to mask the IP address / username or the edit summary. The entries with the date and the fact data has been masqueraded are still there.
(2) A sample about technical versus social rules enforcement. On the French Wikipedia, we use these social rules:
- Admins use deleterevision for copyvio (yes, on fr.wikipedia, we
always had a very strong attitude against copyright and never reverted it, we deleted articles and restore good versions in the past before deleterevision)
- Oversights, a group especially created for this use, and so
especially trusted, could mask diffamation/libelous /confidential personal information revisions.
- But technically, an admin could use its deleterevision right to mask
a libellous entry.
'deleterevision' as "delete a revision" is no additional possibility. Revisions can also be deleted with 'delete' and 'undelete' permission (but it's more difficult than 'deleterevision' process).
My suggestion is splitting 'deleterevision' permission into:
deleterevision: (un)deleting revisions only suppresslogentry: (un)hiding log entries only
Fine rights are always a good idea, up to the point extra rights means unmanageable complexity for the people having to configure a MediaWiki setup.
By the way, is it really useful to be able to text content but not the IP/username or the edit comment now I clarified a little bit how the right work?
Cheers, Tim
-- Tim Weyer MediaWiki user "SVG" Git/SVN committer "cervidae"
'deleterevision' in its function of deleting revisions of a page or removing IP/username/comment is what I want it to be only. And if you tell it masking or suppressing is not a big difference. Okay, you only suppress the content of the log entry, so you mask it. But I know what I'm speaking about. If you wouldn't have 'deleterevision' permission, you would have to delete and undelete the page without the revision(s) you wanted to remove. If you have 'deleterevision' permission, you can easily remove the content (and the comment if needed; and if you want to remove the editor's name, you can do it too).
Masking log entries is another part and that's why I want to give it an extra permission called 'suppresslogentry'. You could also name it 'hidelogentry', but I think we should use it because of 'suppressrevision'. This permission's name does also include 'suppress' in its name even you can only hide log entries and revisions for administrators too.
On 20/06/12 17:28, Tim Weyer (SVG) wrote:
'deleterevision' in its function of deleting revisions of a page or removing IP/username/comment is what I want it to be only. And if you tell it masking or suppressing is not a big difference. Okay, you only suppress the content of the log entry, so you mask it. But I know what I'm speaking about. If you wouldn't have 'deleterevision' permission, you would have to delete and undelete the page without the revision(s) you wanted to remove. If you have 'deleterevision' permission, you can easily remove the content (and the comment if needed; and if you want to remove the editor's name, you can do it too).
Masking log entries is another part and that's why I want to give it an extra permission called 'suppresslogentry'. You could also name it 'hidelogentry', but I think we should use it because of 'suppressrevision'. This permission's name does also include 'suppress' in its name even you can only hide log entries and revisions for administrators too.
Sébastien reply seemed to refer to the other. I think it's fine to make the separation you propose. Please open a bug for that if one doesn't already exist.
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