On Sat, Jun 9, 2018 at 10:21 AM Alex Monk krenair@gmail.com wrote:
On 9 June 2018 at 18:14, Brion Vibber bvibber@wikimedia.org wrote:
On Sat, Jun 9, 2018 at 10:00 AM Alex Monk krenair@gmail.com wrote:
This is outrageous. Not only are you blatantly misrepresenting what
various
people are saying in the other thread and their intentions,
Perhaps. I've tried to go by the plain readings of position statements
and
I could have made a mistake?
For example where you said "IMHO specifically because some people are trying to avoid being bound by it or protesting its existence by looking for loopholes to avoid it", which is not at all what that thread is about as has been made very clear in that thread.
I disagree that it has been made clear. I found the opposite to be true in my experience of reading that thread -- for instance the ability to exclude the code of conduct from some interactions between developers and users was cited as a desired feature, and thus a reason to want to avoid advertising the code of conduct in the repo.
Perhaps I'm reading too much into the idea of wanting to avoid the code of conduct as a proxy for not liking it?
On 9 June 2018 at 18:14, Brion Vibber bvibber@wikimedia.org wrote:
you are now
suggesting that repository owners do not in fact get to decide what
goes
in
their repository and what does not, as if this has been the case all
along.
Yes I'm definitely explicitly saying that. Same applies to pages on Wikipedia: you don't get to own them and veto others' clarifications. And sometimes an admit makes an edit stick that you don't like.
This is a bad analogy. Repository owners *are* essentially the admins, and in this case get content control. The people involving themselves are more akin to global users like stewards trying to override local admin actions, and in this case they're not really supposed to have such control of content. Like with on-wiki stuff, it's not really so bad when a global user comes and does uncontroversial cleanup, but global permissions are not for the purpose of involving oneself in local controversy.
I'll let that one stand. Sounds like a good analogy except that this is exactly the sort of thing a steward might have to intervene for.
On 9 June 2018 at 18:14, Brion Vibber bvibber@wikimedia.org wrote:
It is incredibly ironic how against the spirit of the CoC this all is.
Can you clarify?
Making Wikimedia technical spaces less welcoming to outsiders.
Not just outsiders generally, but outsiders who have not had a fair shake in the past because the place has been unwelcoming or full of toxic interactions.
Reducing toxic interactions is an important part of that, and sometimes that means telling people who cause toxic interactions that they are not welcome because we would rather have other people who are less toxic and can bring different perspectives and representation.
-- brion
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