On Mon, Nov 25, 2013 at 9:55 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote:
Hi,
so how things are going? Anything for testing already?
Nothing to test yet. As soon as there is I will send an email to this list. The current status is that we still need to make some final adjustments on the database schema and finish the java script part of the user interface as well as ranks.
Cheers Lydia
Ok.
One is a bit disappointed seeing various projects to fail to deliver according to their original timelines... seems like there is not enough money in? Do you need more developers to perform better?
2013/11/26 Lydia Pintscher lydia.pintscher@wikimedia.de
On Mon, Nov 25, 2013 at 9:55 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote:
Hi,
so how things are going? Anything for testing already?
Nothing to test yet. As soon as there is I will send an email to this list. The current status is that we still need to make some final adjustments on the database schema and finish the java script part of the user interface as well as ranks.
Cheers Lydia
-- Lydia Pintscher - http://about.me/lydia.pintscher Product Manager for Wikidata
Wikimedia Deutschland e.V. Obentrautstr. 72 10963 Berlin www.wikimedia.de
Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e. V.
Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 Nz. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Jan,
my suspicion is that my predictions from last year hold true: it is a far more complex task to design a scalable and performant data model, query language and/or query engine solely for Wikidata than the designers of this project anticipated - unless they did anticipate and now knowingly fail to deliver.
You can check some threads from december last year, and they relate to even older ones: http://www.mail-archive.com/wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org/msg01415.html
Martynas
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote:
Ok.
One is a bit disappointed seeing various projects to fail to deliver according to their original timelines... seems like there is not enough money in? Do you need more developers to perform better?
2013/11/26 Lydia Pintscher lydia.pintscher@wikimedia.de
On Mon, Nov 25, 2013 at 9:55 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote:
Hi,
so how things are going? Anything for testing already?
Nothing to test yet. As soon as there is I will send an email to this list. The current status is that we still need to make some final adjustments on the database schema and finish the java script part of the user interface as well as ranks.
Cheers Lydia
-- Lydia Pintscher - http://about.me/lydia.pintscher Product Manager for Wikidata
Wikimedia Deutschland e.V. Obentrautstr. 72 10963 Berlin www.wikimedia.de
Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e. V.
Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 Nz. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Hoi, Please understand that providing functionality like query is something that has to fit into a continuously live environment. This is an environment where the Wikidata functionality is used all the time and where some of the underlying functionality is changed as well. The Wikidata development is not happening in a vacuum.
Given that we hope to get next week a new type of property, it should be obvious that Wikidata is not feature complete. When you add on extra functionality like a query engine, you add extra complications while the work is ongoing to get to the stage where Wikidata is feature complete for the data types.
Another aspect is that it is NOT the Wikidata team to decide what goes into production on Wikipedia projects. The Ask 1.0 functionality for instance is at its release level. It is now for other people to determine if they want to include it in. They have their own road maps and, it is not obvious for an observer what the rationales are. NB Ask 1.0 is also used in Semantic MediaWiki and it provides a query kind of functionality. Query does require some performance <grin> and what is too much </grin>.
So in one aspect there is a query functionality to be used in Wikipedia ea. What the query functionality will deliver that is still being build is not clear to me.
On another note, there are other projects that have lingering before they were implemented. Nothing new here. There have been other projects that had to change because of external pressures. Nothing new here.
If you want query functionality on the existing data now, there is a hack that works quite nicely. It makes use of data replicated to the labs environment. The replication is broken and given the holidays it has not been picked up for the third day now so the data is three days old. Thanks, GerardM
On 29 November 2013 14:03, Martynas Jusevičius martynas@graphity.orgwrote:
Jan,
my suspicion is that my predictions from last year hold true: it is a far more complex task to design a scalable and performant data model, query language and/or query engine solely for Wikidata than the designers of this project anticipated - unless they did anticipate and now knowingly fail to deliver.
You can check some threads from december last year, and they relate to even older ones: http://www.mail-archive.com/wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org/msg01415.html
Martynas
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote:
Ok.
One is a bit disappointed seeing various projects to fail to deliver according to their original timelines... seems like there is not enough money in? Do you need more developers to perform better?
2013/11/26 Lydia Pintscher lydia.pintscher@wikimedia.de
On Mon, Nov 25, 2013 at 9:55 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote:
Hi,
so how things are going? Anything for testing already?
Nothing to test yet. As soon as there is I will send an email to this list. The current status is that we still need to make some final adjustments on the database schema and finish the java script part of the user interface as well as ranks.
Cheers Lydia
-- Lydia Pintscher - http://about.me/lydia.pintscher Product Manager for Wikidata
Wikimedia Deutschland e.V. Obentrautstr. 72 10963 Berlin www.wikimedia.de
Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e. V.
Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 Nz. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
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Hm,
nice to read all the reasoning why queries are yet still not possible, but I think we live in 2014 not and not 1914 actually... seems like the problem is too small budget or bad management... can not really think of another reason. How much do you think would it cost to make queries reality for production at Wikidata?
Regards, Jan
2013/11/29 Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijssen@gmail.com
Hoi, Please understand that providing functionality like query is something that has to fit into a continuously live environment. This is an environment where the Wikidata functionality is used all the time and where some of the underlying functionality is changed as well. The Wikidata development is not happening in a vacuum.
Given that we hope to get next week a new type of property, it should be obvious that Wikidata is not feature complete. When you add on extra functionality like a query engine, you add extra complications while the work is ongoing to get to the stage where Wikidata is feature complete for the data types.
Another aspect is that it is NOT the Wikidata team to decide what goes into production on Wikipedia projects. The Ask 1.0 functionality for instance is at its release level. It is now for other people to determine if they want to include it in. They have their own road maps and, it is not obvious for an observer what the rationales are. NB Ask 1.0 is also used in Semantic MediaWiki and it provides a query kind of functionality. Query does require some performance <grin> and what is too much </grin>.
So in one aspect there is a query functionality to be used in Wikipedia ea. What the query functionality will deliver that is still being build is not clear to me.
On another note, there are other projects that have lingering before they were implemented. Nothing new here. There have been other projects that had to change because of external pressures. Nothing new here.
If you want query functionality on the existing data now, there is a hack that works quite nicely. It makes use of data replicated to the labs environment. The replication is broken and given the holidays it has not been picked up for the third day now so the data is three days old. Thanks, GerardM
On 29 November 2013 14:03, Martynas Jusevičius martynas@graphity.orgwrote:
Jan,
my suspicion is that my predictions from last year hold true: it is a far more complex task to design a scalable and performant data model, query language and/or query engine solely for Wikidata than the designers of this project anticipated - unless they did anticipate and now knowingly fail to deliver.
You can check some threads from december last year, and they relate to even older ones: http://www.mail-archive.com/wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org/msg01415.html
Martynas
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote:
Ok.
One is a bit disappointed seeing various projects to fail to deliver according to their original timelines... seems like there is not enough money in? Do you need more developers to perform better?
2013/11/26 Lydia Pintscher lydia.pintscher@wikimedia.de
On Mon, Nov 25, 2013 at 9:55 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com
wrote:
Hi,
so how things are going? Anything for testing already?
Nothing to test yet. As soon as there is I will send an email to this list. The current status is that we still need to make some final adjustments on the database schema and finish the java script part of the user interface as well as ranks.
Cheers Lydia
-- Lydia Pintscher - http://about.me/lydia.pintscher Product Manager for Wikidata
Wikimedia Deutschland e.V. Obentrautstr. 72 10963 Berlin www.wikimedia.de
Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e. V.
Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 Nz. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
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The main reason why Queries are not done yet is because in the beginning of 2013 I deprioritized them compared to the original plan. Only a single developer kept working on them, instead of a major part of the team, as was originally planned.
I made this decision because it became clear to me that we will likely be able to continue the Wikidata development beyond the original 12-month plan (as was indeed the case) and that, in the medium run, rushing this functionality would only hurt the project. I thus decided to increase the priorities on tasks which had a higher short-term benefit and were more immediate, e.g. many smaller things, but also more datatypes, ranks, and clean-ups, but also reactions to the roll-outs which had begun back then. This made us highly responsive to the current needs of the community, and lead to a sustained growth of Wikidata.
If it would be needed, queries could be rushed. But that would have a negative impact on the longer sustainability of the project. If it would be deemed a higher priority, the development of queries could be sped up. But this comes with a sacrifice regarding other functionalities. Thus yes, more resources would lead to a faster development of queries (if it were decided that this would be the appropriate priority).
The latter especially means that a sustained contribution from external developers can also lead to a faster development of the query functionality. We have seen with the sustained support of Benestar for the Badges functionality that this is feasible and possible. So instead of simply expressing complaints about features not being developed fast enough, how about actually helping with making them real? it is Open Source after all. Or at least simply make a case for the importance of this functionality? The development team keeps listening to the community like no other that I know of, and prioritizes their effort with respect to that.
So, in short, blame me.
Cheers, Denny
On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 2:08 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote:
Hm,
nice to read all the reasoning why queries are yet still not possible, but I think we live in 2014 not and not 1914 actually... seems like the problem is too small budget or bad management... can not really think of another reason. How much do you think would it cost to make queries reality for production at Wikidata?
Regards, Jan
2013/11/29 Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijssen@gmail.com
Hoi, Please understand that providing functionality like query is something that has to fit into a continuously live environment. This is an environment where the Wikidata functionality is used all the time and where some of the underlying functionality is changed as well. The Wikidata development is not happening in a vacuum.
Given that we hope to get next week a new type of property, it should be obvious that Wikidata is not feature complete. When you add on extra functionality like a query engine, you add extra complications while the work is ongoing to get to the stage where Wikidata is feature complete for the data types.
Another aspect is that it is NOT the Wikidata team to decide what goes into production on Wikipedia projects. The Ask 1.0 functionality for instance is at its release level. It is now for other people to determine if they want to include it in. They have their own road maps and, it is not obvious for an observer what the rationales are. NB Ask 1.0 is also used in Semantic MediaWiki and it provides a query kind of functionality. Query does require some performance <grin> and what is too much </grin>.
So in one aspect there is a query functionality to be used in Wikipedia ea. What the query functionality will deliver that is still being build is not clear to me.
On another note, there are other projects that have lingering before they were implemented. Nothing new here. There have been other projects that had to change because of external pressures. Nothing new here.
If you want query functionality on the existing data now, there is a hack that works quite nicely. It makes use of data replicated to the labs environment. The replication is broken and given the holidays it has not been picked up for the third day now so the data is three days old. Thanks, GerardM
On 29 November 2013 14:03, Martynas Jusevičius martynas@graphity.orgwrote:
Jan,
my suspicion is that my predictions from last year hold true: it is a far more complex task to design a scalable and performant data model, query language and/or query engine solely for Wikidata than the designers of this project anticipated - unless they did anticipate and now knowingly fail to deliver.
You can check some threads from december last year, and they relate to even older ones: http://www.mail-archive.com/wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org/msg01415.html
Martynas
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote:
Ok.
One is a bit disappointed seeing various projects to fail to deliver according to their original timelines... seems like there is not enough money in? Do you need more developers to perform better?
2013/11/26 Lydia Pintscher lydia.pintscher@wikimedia.de
On Mon, Nov 25, 2013 at 9:55 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com
wrote:
Hi,
so how things are going? Anything for testing already?
Nothing to test yet. As soon as there is I will send an email to this list. The current status is that we still need to make some final adjustments on the database schema and finish the java script part of the user interface as well as ranks.
Cheers Lydia
-- Lydia Pintscher - http://about.me/lydia.pintscher Product Manager for Wikidata
Wikimedia Deutschland e.V. Obentrautstr. 72 10963 Berlin www.wikimedia.de
Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.
V.
Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 Nz. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
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I agree with Dennys decision that Queries should be deprioritized compared to other more urgent needs. A fully working data model is obviously more important than a query system utilizing that data model.
I have stuff I really had hoped that the team prioritized a bit higher, but I also know that they must prioritze very hard to make a working system. In some cases that means I must wait while other stuff gets implemented.
The Wikibase extension is a big and complex piece of software, and it will take time to complete it. The only way to speed up development is to get more people involved in the development, either as volunteers or as employees. Not everyone can be employed, but a lot of people can volunteer.
/jeblad
On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 11:28 PM, Denny Vrandečić vrandecic@gmail.com wrote:
The main reason why Queries are not done yet is because in the beginning of 2013 I deprioritized them compared to the original plan. Only a single developer kept working on them, instead of a major part of the team, as was originally planned.
I made this decision because it became clear to me that we will likely be able to continue the Wikidata development beyond the original 12-month plan (as was indeed the case) and that, in the medium run, rushing this functionality would only hurt the project. I thus decided to increase the priorities on tasks which had a higher short-term benefit and were more immediate, e.g. many smaller things, but also more datatypes, ranks, and clean-ups, but also reactions to the roll-outs which had begun back then. This made us highly responsive to the current needs of the community, and lead to a sustained growth of Wikidata.
If it would be needed, queries could be rushed. But that would have a negative impact on the longer sustainability of the project. If it would be deemed a higher priority, the development of queries could be sped up. But this comes with a sacrifice regarding other functionalities. Thus yes, more resources would lead to a faster development of queries (if it were decided that this would be the appropriate priority).
The latter especially means that a sustained contribution from external developers can also lead to a faster development of the query functionality. We have seen with the sustained support of Benestar for the Badges functionality that this is feasible and possible. So instead of simply expressing complaints about features not being developed fast enough, how about actually helping with making them real? it is Open Source after all. Or at least simply make a case for the importance of this functionality? The development team keeps listening to the community like no other that I know of, and prioritizes their effort with respect to that.
So, in short, blame me.
Cheers, Denny
On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 2:08 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote:
Hm,
nice to read all the reasoning why queries are yet still not possible, but I think we live in 2014 not and not 1914 actually... seems like the problem is too small budget or bad management... can not really think of another reason. How much do you think would it cost to make queries reality for production at Wikidata?
Regards, Jan
2013/11/29 Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijssen@gmail.com
Hoi, Please understand that providing functionality like query is something that has to fit into a continuously live environment. This is an environment where the Wikidata functionality is used all the time and where some of the underlying functionality is changed as well. The Wikidata development is not happening in a vacuum.
Given that we hope to get next week a new type of property, it should be obvious that Wikidata is not feature complete. When you add on extra functionality like a query engine, you add extra complications while the work is ongoing to get to the stage where Wikidata is feature complete for the data types.
Another aspect is that it is NOT the Wikidata team to decide what goes into production on Wikipedia projects. The Ask 1.0 functionality for instance is at its release level. It is now for other people to determine if they want to include it in. They have their own road maps and, it is not obvious for an observer what the rationales are. NB Ask 1.0 is also used in Semantic MediaWiki and it provides a query kind of functionality. Query does require some performance <grin> and what is too much </grin>.
So in one aspect there is a query functionality to be used in Wikipedia ea. What the query functionality will deliver that is still being build is not clear to me.
On another note, there are other projects that have lingering before they were implemented. Nothing new here. There have been other projects that had to change because of external pressures. Nothing new here.
If you want query functionality on the existing data now, there is a hack that works quite nicely. It makes use of data replicated to the labs environment. The replication is broken and given the holidays it has not been picked up for the third day now so the data is three days old. Thanks, GerardM
On 29 November 2013 14:03, Martynas Jusevičius martynas@graphity.org wrote:
Jan,
my suspicion is that my predictions from last year hold true: it is a far more complex task to design a scalable and performant data model, query language and/or query engine solely for Wikidata than the designers of this project anticipated - unless they did anticipate and now knowingly fail to deliver.
You can check some threads from december last year, and they relate to even older ones: http://www.mail-archive.com/wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org/msg01415.html
Martynas
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote:
Ok.
One is a bit disappointed seeing various projects to fail to deliver according to their original timelines... seems like there is not enough money in? Do you need more developers to perform better?
2013/11/26 Lydia Pintscher lydia.pintscher@wikimedia.de
On Mon, Nov 25, 2013 at 9:55 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote: > Hi, > > so how things are going? Anything for testing already?
Nothing to test yet. As soon as there is I will send an email to this list. The current status is that we still need to make some final adjustments on the database schema and finish the java script part of the user interface as well as ranks.
Cheers Lydia
-- Lydia Pintscher - http://about.me/lydia.pintscher Product Manager for Wikidata
Wikimedia Deutschland e.V. Obentrautstr. 72 10963 Berlin www.wikimedia.de
Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e. V.
Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 Nz. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
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On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 11:08 PM, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote:
Hm,
nice to read all the reasoning why queries are yet still not possible, but I think we live in 2014 not and not 1914 actually... seems like the problem is too small budget or bad management... can not really think of another reason. How much do you think would it cost to make queries reality for production at Wikidata?
Denny already answered you extensively so I will only add a bit: * Money does not solve all problems ;-) * Until earlier this week we were waiting for feedback from a database specialist on our database schema for queries. We have this now so things will continue to move forward again. Getting this feedback was crucial to make sure queries can work on the scale we need them to. * Current top priorities (in order of priority): ** Wikisource getting language links via Wikidata (currently planned for 14th) ** getting the first version of quantities live (current plan is to do this on 21st), ** continue making performance improvements ** simple queries
Cheers Lydia
On 7 January 2014 22:08, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote:
nice to read all the reasoning why queries are yet still not possible, but I think we live in 2014 not and not 1914 actually... seems like the problem is too small budget or bad management... can not really think of another reason. How much do you think would it cost to make queries reality for production at Wikidata?
Absolutely the most important thing about Wikidata is the deep integration (both technical and social) into the Wikipedia universe. Building a sensible query framework for a system working at Wikipedia scale (http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/wikipedia.org) is far from trivial. I've glad to hear that Wikidata are taking the time to do this carefully.
Dan
Hoi, I agree that the integration of Wikidata in all the different Wikipedias, Wikivoyages, Wikisources, Wiktionaries and Commons is the most important objective. It is so important because this ensures that the data will be actually used.
We are doing fine I think. However, not all the quirks of specific Wikis can be supported. Wikidata is data driven and consequently it matters a lot if a Wikipedia article is an article, a list or used for disambiguation. Thanks, GerardM
On 8 January 2014 12:04, Dan Brickley danbri@danbri.org wrote:
On 7 January 2014 22:08, Jan Kučera kozuch82@gmail.com wrote:
nice to read all the reasoning why queries are yet still not possible,
but I
think we live in 2014 not and not 1914 actually... seems like the
problem is
too small budget or bad management... can not really think of another reason. How much do you think would it cost to make queries reality for production at Wikidata?
Absolutely the most important thing about Wikidata is the deep integration (both technical and social) into the Wikipedia universe. Building a sensible query framework for a system working at Wikipedia scale (http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/wikipedia.org) is far from trivial. I've glad to hear that Wikidata are taking the time to do this carefully.
Dan
Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Hi,
On a related note, there is also an upcoming project, Wikidata Toolkit [1], that will look into implementing query functionality over Wikidata content, not to replace the Wikidata query features but to provide functionality that is not a top priority for the core development. The first step towards this will be to collect concrete requirements (what queries exactly? on what part of the data?). I will send an email about this in due course, but input is always welcome.
There is no query result integration into Wikipedia via this route, but a range of interesting Wikidata-driven Web services and query features could be created. The lack of tight coupling to Wikipedia deployment makes this project a lot more flexible, with room for experiments and new ideas that might also inspire future core features.
Cheers,
Markus
[1] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:IEG/Wikidata_Toolkit
On 08/01/14 12:22, Gerard Meijssen wrote:
Hoi, I agree that the integration of Wikidata in all the different Wikipedias, Wikivoyages, Wikisources, Wiktionaries and Commons is the most important objective. It is so important because this ensures that the data will be actually used.
We are doing fine I think. However, not all the quirks of specific Wikis can be supported. Wikidata is data driven and consequently it matters a lot if a Wikipedia article is an article, a list or used for disambiguation. Thanks, GerardM
On 8 January 2014 12:04, Dan Brickley <danbri@danbri.org mailto:danbri@danbri.org> wrote:
On 7 January 2014 22:08, Jan Kučera <kozuch82@gmail.com <mailto:kozuch82@gmail.com>> wrote: > nice to read all the reasoning why queries are yet still not possible, but I > think we live in 2014 not and not 1914 actually... seems like the problem is > too small budget or bad management... can not really think of another > reason. How much do you think would it cost to make queries reality for > production at Wikidata? Absolutely the most important thing about Wikidata is the deep integration (both technical and social) into the Wikipedia universe. Building a sensible query framework for a system working at Wikipedia scale (http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/wikipedia.org) is far from trivial. I've glad to hear that Wikidata are taking the time to do this carefully. Dan _______________________________________________ Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org <mailto:Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
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Ok,
so I propose to make queries (=original phase #3 = lists) a TOP priority since most of other things from the original Wikidata targets are implemented anyways. What is a pile of data in a database good for without a reasonable way to query it?
Cheers, Kozuch
2014-01-08 Markus Krötzsch markus@semantic-mediawiki.org:
Hi,
On a related note, there is also an upcoming project, Wikidata Toolkit [1], that will look into implementing query functionality over Wikidata content, not to replace the Wikidata query features but to provide functionality that is not a top priority for the core development. The first step towards this will be to collect concrete requirements (what queries exactly? on what part of the data?). I will send an email about this in due course, but input is always welcome.
There is no query result integration into Wikipedia via this route, but a range of interesting Wikidata-driven Web services and query features could be created. The lack of tight coupling to Wikipedia deployment makes this project a lot more flexible, with room for experiments and new ideas that might also inspire future core features.
Cheers,
Markus
[1] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:IEG/Wikidata_Toolkit
On 08/01/14 12:22, Gerard Meijssen wrote:
Hoi, I agree that the integration of Wikidata in all the different Wikipedias, Wikivoyages, Wikisources, Wiktionaries and Commons is the most important objective. It is so important because this ensures that the data will be actually used.
We are doing fine I think. However, not all the quirks of specific Wikis can be supported. Wikidata is data driven and consequently it matters a lot if a Wikipedia article is an article, a list or used for disambiguation. Thanks, GerardM
On 8 January 2014 12:04, Dan Brickley <danbri@danbri.org mailto:danbri@danbri.org> wrote:
On 7 January 2014 22:08, Jan Kučera <kozuch82@gmail.com <mailto:kozuch82@gmail.com>> wrote: > nice to read all the reasoning why queries are yet still not possible, but I > think we live in 2014 not and not 1914 actually... seems like the problem is > too small budget or bad management... can not really think ofanother > reason. How much do you think would it cost to make queries reality for > production at Wikidata?
Absolutely the most important thing about Wikidata is the deep integration (both technical and social) into the Wikipedia universe. Building a sensible query framework for a system working at Wikipedia scale (http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/wikipedia.org) is far from trivial. I've glad to hear that Wikidata are taking the time to do this carefully. Dan _______________________________________________ Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org <mailto:Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.orghttps://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
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