On 9 November 2012 08:30, Daniel Mietchen &lt;daniel.mietchen(a)googlemail.com&gt; wrote: ... If the painter is unknown then the 70 year rule applies for anon works in the UK <http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Copyright_rules_by_territory#United_Kingdom>. However, if it can be worked out who the painter was (i.e. the information is knowable, not just that you or the museum don't happen to know it), then you have to calculate from the date of death. I think if the painter is named but date of death is unknown, then you would assume that the painter might have lived to a record breaking age, something like 115 years old, but I don't believe this is based on case law and I'm unsure what advice to give in this area. PS the photo must be a faithful two dimensional reproduction to have no copyright in itself; if there is a mounting or frame in the photograph then this has to be cropped out unless the frame has no creative content. Fae

On 9 November 2012 08:30, Daniel Mietchen &lt;daniel.mietchen(a)googlemail.com&gt; wrote: http://www.bl.uk/reshelp/pdfs/copyrightflowchart.pdf is worth saving for future use :-) As Fae says, you'll really need to determine if the painter is actually anonymous or just not known to them - it might be worth checking the ODNB/Grove etc, which often list known paintings of people, or consulting biographies to see if they have a reproduction with a name attached. If you can identify the painter, it's life + 70, which means anyone who died in 1941 or earlier (in two months, 1942 or earlier). If you can't, and it's "properly anonymous", it's a mess. It then comes down to whether the painting was "published" - has it ever been reproduced in print? If so, copyright expires 70 years later - so if it was published by the 1930s, you're safe. If it wasn't published but has been exhibited ("made available to the public"), copyright remains until the end of 2039, or 70 years after first exhibition if that's longer. If it's never been made available to the public - which is likely if they have a photo - then copyright remains until the end of 2039. The 2039 provision is quite horrendous, and entirely counterintuitive - in theory, it can assign copyright to medieval works, despite the fact that the owner of such continuing copyright is entirely untraceable. -- - Andrew Gray andrew.gray(a)dunelm.org.uk

On 9 November 2012 16:14, Fae &lt;faenwp(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote: (I should clarify here - I meant to say that if they have a photo, it's likely it *has* been made available to the public. Either way, it's academic from the "is it PD" perspective) While there may not be many cases in practice, it is in the legislation, and there's not much room I can see for creative interpretation. http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/48/schedule/1 Schedule 1, s. 12(3): Copyright in anonymous or pseudonymous literary, dramatic, musical or artistic works (other than photographs) continues to subsist ... b) if the work is unpublished, until the end of the period of 50 years from the end of the calendar year in which the new copyright provisions come into force or, if during that period the work is first made available to the public within the meaning of [section 12(3)] (duration of copyright in works of unknown authorship), the date on which copyright expires in accordance with that provision; The Act proper defines the term to include exhibition: s.12: For the purposes of subsection (3) making available to the public includes ... (b) in the case of an artistic work; (i) exhibition in public, (ii) a film including the work being shown in public, or (iii) communication to the public; Not many cases, perhaps, but the use of "exhibition" is indeed there in statute. -- - Andrew Gray andrew.gray(a)dunelm.org.uk