The big return of recipees. Many months ago, and several times already, it has been discussed whether en:wikipedia should contain recipees. There was no obvious majority between "a recipee should be kept" or "a recipee should be deleted". However, a sort of consensus has been found that some recipees of high cultural value could be kept and other moved to wikibooks. It was also rather a consensus that small articles could be kept here, and link the the recipee on wikibooks. Some users are now not only trying to have these small articles deleted, but even eventually speedy deleted. When that happen, first the consensus previously made is broken ; which I consider quite wrong. And second, which is much much much more relevant is that access to information is damaged. I wrote a note on the pump about that, but got no answer whatsoever. I would like to discuss it though. ------ Here is what I wrote There is something bugging me in the transwiki system. Here is an example. * A user create a recipee * Later, someone list it on vfd, some suggest it be transwikied to wikibooks, while other try to keep it in the encyclopedia. Nevertheless, the article is transwikies, but a stub kept, WITH a link to wikibooks, as it was agreed upon a few months ago. * Later, someone finds the stub and list it on vfd (or even suggests it for speedy deletion). In spite of those initially supporting keeping recipee, and in spite of the consensus, the stub is deleted. The link to the recipee subsequently disappear. Those deleting it do not particularly attempt to keep the link active somewhere, so, it is likely that all traces of the initial recipee is deleted. * This is called a forced consensus :-) Now... here is what is bugging me. In deleting not only the content, but also the link to the wikibooks article and references to it, I consider there is a big loss of information. Other answer me it is not a loss at all since the information is kept... well stored somewhere else. Except... that... wikipedia is FAR MORE known than wikibooks. Actually, I still am waiting to see big articles on wikibooks. I still wait to see google search leading me to wikibooks. I suspect that for many people, Wikipedia could become the everyday encyclopedia, and at least for some of us, the everyday encyclopedia should contain recipees. When the recipees are deleted entirely, the reader coming to Wikipedia and typing a recipee name... will get ... nothing. Not the recipee, nor the link to a recipee. He will not even get a more generalist article where the link to wikibooks could be. He will get just nothing at all. Information *may* exist somewhere, but it is "hidden". The link has been broken. The network does not exist. And I think the network should exist. Our goal is to GIVE access to information to readers. Not only to CREATE information. We must create the information, organise it, categorize it, link it, and make it accessible. Each time we delete information links from one project to another, we may not hurt the content itself, but we reduce the networkability (does that word exist ? If not, here it is) : we limit access to information. We hid it. When information exists, but can not be found easily by readers, then we have failed. Imho. SweetLittleFluffyThing 23:59, 7 Oct 2004 (UTC) ------- Meanwhile, in case the redirect article is deleted, I will restore it as it was agreed last spring. anthere