Some reflections on the current 'sock' discussions; If I've read correctly, dg is saying that there's no problem with Genisock, because that account is clearly linked to Geni. Which would seem to indicate that it's fine for Geni or Genisock to edit anywhere without geni being accused of abuse, or of causing disruption. I wonder if any might agree that this seems somewhat in tension with this unambiguous final decision from the arbs; "The use of sockpuppet<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Sock_puppetry>accou…counts, while not generally forbidden, is discouraged. Abuse of sockpuppet accounts, such as using them to evade blocks, bans, and user accountability—and especially to make personal attacks or reverts, or vandalize—is prohibited. Sockpuppet accounts are not to be used in discussions internal to the project, such as policy debates." And hey, I can't let the following from Guy pass without brief comment; "You had at least *eight* accounts, and your use of them was outside of community norms." *This refers to activity over three years * two accounts never edited, unsurprisingly, there has been no assertion of disruption * two accounts less than 10 edits, no assertion of disruption * 1 account 28 edits 6 months ago, no assertion of disruption * 3 accounts used extensively (the ones I disclosed to you privately, the ones I consider pertinent) You are however correct that the arb.s have agreed with you. Further discussion discussion between us here seems only likely to bore and annoy, so feel free to have the last word........ Re : banned editing and vandalism; "if he gets found out it will be really bed for him." - much as "really bed" actually sounds quite fun, I understand that I shouldn't be doing any editing, and I won't - your approach here though really is interesting to me. Is it correct to say that you believe I should not revert vandalism, because of my ban? I find that revealing. Here's another diff that I spotted (fortunately this one got bot.ed pretty quick) - I'm glad that the vandalism I reported earlier only stood for a couple of hours in total (and only seconds after I reported it here - it was a bit weird to be unsure of what I should do for the couple of hours I was aware of it, and it was publicly visible.) http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Socrates&oldid=175322777 best, PM