The below is at [[Image_talk:2UK_soldiers2.jpg]]. Im curious what the "public" thinks of the issue. ----
I have two questions on the public domain status of this image. On what basis is this said to be the work of an Iraqi government employee- it explicitly says "AFP" on the bottom right. Also, is the work of Iraqi government employees actually public domain- this is the situation with the U.S. government, but in most countries it is not.--Pharos 23:31, 19 September 2005 (UTC)
The image was taken while the agents were in custody. No evidence or mention suggests that the photo was itself taken by afp, or any other copyright interested news agency. The photo has been published elsewhere on the web in an uncensored form, where there is no attribution to AFP. It is common practice for news agencies to claim source rights for images, even without modifications, as reproductions of photos which are in fact public domain. For these reasons I believe the photo is not the property of AFP, but instead is the work of an Iraqi police officer, taken in the conduct of official duties. -St|eve 23:43, 19 September 2005 (UTC)
I don't know if it's originally from the AFP or not; it's quite possible it's from the Iraqi government, but there is no source for that. More important, there is no source saying Iraqi govenment photos are PD (in fact I don't think they are). BTW, if there is an "uncensored" version (presumably with the faces unblurred?), why shouldn't we have uploaded that one?--Pharos 23:54, 19 September 2005 (UTC)
Why would they not be public domain? They dont even currently have an established system of patents and intellectual property. You're right--I will find a good uncensored version. -St|eve 23:56, 19 September 2005 (UTC)
The intellectual property produced by most governments is not public domain- the U.S. is a real exception. I would guess they're probably operating under the old Saddam-era copyright system- the previous laws have not been repealed en masse, and most are still in operation. We can't just exclude Iraq from the international system of intellectual property and say that nothing produced by an Iraqi can be copyrighted.--Pharos 00:08, 20 September 2005 (UTC)
Thats just speculation. We will have to do some research on Iraqi law. Maybe theres a lawyer we can reach through wikien. A second photo is at Image:2UK soldiers2.jpg, by the way. Still looking. -St|eve 00:14, 20 September 2005 (UTC)
It is speculation, but we must presume a photo is copyrighted unless there is actual evidence it is not. We can't speculate in the other direction. I'm looking into the copyright law now; I'm sure it would be useful to know and not just in this instance.--Pharos 00:26, 20 September 2005 (UTC)
Respectfully disagree, and to act within your bounds would be to completely submit to transitional and subjective interpretations of law which is equally transitional. There is a good case to make that the ip of nations in transition is in the PD, and not the copyright of any entity. -St|eve 16:47, 21 September 2005 (UTC)
* Here's a PDF [1] of a 2004 ammendment by Bremer to the 1971 law. I'm not sure if it may have been superceded since then by the Iraqi Interim Government or the Iraqi Transitional Government, but probably not. No special mention is made of government works, so we should presume they are copyrighted. Moreover, look at the official government website, which says "© 2004 Iraqi Transitional Government - All rights reserved." at the bottom.--Pharos 00:39, 20 September 2005 (UTC)
I would be reluctant to assume that a decree by a corporate appointee to the leadership position of a colonial government should be considered the basis for any laws by which we must abide. Your suggestion of "probably not" may be true, but only by the most cynical of rationales. And the notion that a disclaimer on a government website should be an indicator of the entirety of ip law in an entire country is likewise flacid. -St|eve 16:47, 21 September 2005 (UTC)
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