A small group of people do digital image restoration regularly; we can hold
focused discussions among ourselves. Perhaps there's a large gap in base
knowledge between us and Wikimedians in general because when we bring
concerns to a wider forum the discussion usually gets derailed.
Not derailed in a malicious sense; derailed because there isn't enough
shared agreement to communicate. It's as if two groups came together to
discuss geometry and didn't realize they meant different geometries. Your
previous post was like asking whether I had come here to discuss the
parallel lines postulate. That's an "aha" moment which shows the
Euclideans
were scratching their heads while I was discussing spherical planes.
It is eye-opening to see the assumptions that get put forward. Possibly the
best thing that can come out of our discussion is to step back and examine
what this tells about the audience. Your points are numbered and
articulate, but I hesitate to answer them as framed. It's like asking about
"flatness" when you're certain parallel lines never meet and I'm
specifically discussing a situation where they do.
The *Signpost* has an open request for editorials. I'll be drafting
something for them. It won't answer your questions directly, but it will
explain the underlying importance of *access*. That's absolutely essential
for historic media discussions. Think of *provenance* as a proof that
derives from *access*.
-Durova
On Mon, Sep 21, 2009 at 9:36 PM, Steve Bennett <stevagewp(a)gmail.com> wrote:
On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 1:46 PM, Durova
<nadezhda.durova(a)gmail.com> wrote:
That question has already been answered several
times, in several ways.
I
am at a loss for how to restate it, and the
insinuation posed alongside
the
question discourages further attempt.
Ok, I've read through all your posts on this thread again, and here's
are the points I see you making:
1) You do restorations of images and they take a lot of time and effort.
2) People have advised you to claim copyright/left over those
restorations, but you resist doing so because it may harm the copyleft
movement in general.
3) People are selling some of your images on eBay without crediting
you, which you feel breaches your "moral rights".
4) Physical restoration and digital restoration are very different,
and it is difficult to define exactly how much effort should be put
into a digital restoration for it to count as a creative work in its
own right.
5) Some discussion about how best to carry out certain restorations,
which isn't relevant here.
I have made the following point:
1) The two images in question that I looked at were both clearly
marked "public domain", with the clear assertion that anyone could
reuse these images for any purpose whatsoever. Further, the images
neither clearly asserted you as the creator, nor requested (let alone,
demanded) that people attribute you (or anyone) as an author.
I'm sorry if I'm being obtuse or dense here, but I don't see how
you've addressed my question, which is, in its simplest form: why do
you think the eBay vendor in question is at fault? They took an image
clearly marked "public domain", with no authorship information or
request for attribution, printed it and sold it, well within their
rights.
To state my position even more clearly:
1) I'm on your side. I think you're doing a great job restoring
valuable images for Wikipedia and the wider community.
2) It seems ethical to me that a person should acknowledge the hard
work someone has put into producing the work that they are now
profiting from, but I have no idea of the legalities.
3) I think your position would be a lot stronger if the image pages in
question identified you more clearly or asserted your request for
acknowledgement.
Is the issue that you want acknowledgement but don't want to assert
authorship? How do you expect end reusers of your content to figure it
out?
I hope this isn't a flamewar, I really want to figure out where you're
coming from so perhaps we can offer some useful advice or help in some
way.
Steve
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