Moin,
On Thu 23/04/09 05:54 , Daniel Kinzler daniel.kinzler@wikimedia.de sent:
Hi all
To keep you posted and to clear up some previous confusion, here are a fewpoints about what is going to happen about the servers Wikimedia Germany (WMDE)is going to Provide for OSM.
Ah, thanx for the update!
Just one question I couldn't read the answer out of your post:
Will it be possible to get access to the OSM API via http to that toolserver (just like http://api.openstreetmap.org)?
All the best,
Tels
Tels schrieb:
Just one question I couldn't read the answer out of your post:
Will it be possible to get access to the OSM API via http to that toolserver (just like http://api.openstreetmap.org)?
The answer is yes/no/maybe. It's pretty much up to you (or more precisely, Avar for now) what will be installed there. Some kind of web api to some kind of data is likely to be there at some point, yes. But as far as I know, no public services are yet planned. The services available will be the services users supply.
-- daniel
On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 9:47 PM, Daniel Kinzler daniel.kinzler@wikimedia.de wrote:
Tels schrieb:
Just one question I couldn't read the answer out of your post:
Will it be possible to get access to the OSM API via http to that toolserver (just like http://api.openstreetmap.org)?
The answer is yes/no/maybe. It's pretty much up to you (or more precisely, Avar for now) what will be installed there. Some kind of web api to some kind of data is likely to be there at some point, yes. But as far as I know, no public services are yet planned. The services available will be the services users supply.
Oh noes:)
As I told Daniel I really didn't want to end up playing server admin, but I'll do it if there's nobody else to do it. There are certain concerns about private data at play here which don't make it easy to give access freely.
Do we have a list of people who're interested in the administration aspect of this? I.e. setting up & maintaining database & tile rendering services and/or doing other miscellaneous administration tasks.
On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 6:28 PM, Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason avarab@gmail.comwrote:
On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 9:47 PM, Daniel Kinzler daniel.kinzler@wikimedia.de wrote:
Tels schrieb:
Oh noes:)
As I told Daniel I really didn't want to end up playing server admin, but I'll do it if there's nobody else to do it. There are certain concerns about private data at play here which don't make it easy to give access freely.
Do we have a list of people who're interested in the administration aspect of this? I.e. setting up & maintaining database & tile rendering services and/or doing other miscellaneous http://wikiatic.com/wikisearch/search?q=miscellaneous%20administration tasks.
I can help with some miscellaneous tasks related to mapping software and databases, but not managing or approving accounts which I think should be handled by WMDE and/or toolserver admins. And, I don't want to over commit myself to too many tasks -- more than my time available to handle.
For the database setup on the toolserver, I think PostgreSQL (with PostGIS) is essential for its spatial data capabilities, along with OSM specific tools.
-Aude
http://wikiatic.com/wikisearch/search?q=%0D%0AI%20can%20do%20some%20mis%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0A%20http://wikiatic.com/wikisearch/search?q=%0D%0AI%20can%20do%20some%20mis%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0A%20http://wikiatic.com/wikisearch/search?q=%0D%0AI%20can%20do%20some%20mis%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0A%20http://wikiatic.com/wikisearch/search?q=%0D%0AI%20can%20do%20some%20mis%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0A%20http://wikiatic.com/wikisearch/search?q=%0D%0AI%20can%20do%20some%20mis%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0A%20
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As I told Daniel I really didn't want to end up playing server admin, but I'll do it if there's nobody else to do it.
I hope your job can be reduced to installing and maintaining the osm-specific software/service.
There are certain concerns about private data at play here which don't make it easy to give access freely.
That's indeed the problem. Another obvious candidate would of course be JeLuF, but I'd rather suggest to let him take care of the "production" map servers.
Do we have a list of people who're interested in the administration aspect of this? I.e. setting up & maintaining database & tile rendering services and/or doing other miscellaneous <http://wikiatic.com/wikisearch/search?q=miscellaneous%20>administration tasks.
If you can come up with such a list, we can ask WMF (that is, Brion) who could get access. Someone with previous involvement with wikimedia, that is, community trust, would be preferrable.
I can help with some miscellaneous tasks related to mapping software and databases, but not managing or approving accounts which I think should be handled by WMDE and/or toolserver admins.
I just learned that Tim Alder said that he'd take care of account approval. I think that would be fine, even though I'd like DaB or myself to keep an eye on it, at least in the beginning. The actual account creation will be handled by a toolserver admin, in the past usually DaB or Werdna.
And, I don't want to over commit myself to too many tasks -- more than my time available to handle.
I know that problem :)
Anyway, since you are an admin on some WMF projects, you'd have good chances of getting admin access if you want it, i think. But since this means access to private user data, it's up to the foundation to decide.
For the database setup on the toolserver, I think PostgreSQL (with PostGIS) is essential for its spatial data capabilities, along with OSM specific tools.
Perhaps it would be useful to prepare a list. You can use wiki.toolserver.org for this.
A word about the "production" map servers: It's up to the foundation (that is, Mark and Brion) to decide who gets access there, and how. I'm not sure what security concerns this entails. I think JeLuF would be the obvious choice for managing these systems, but I don't know if he has the time. I hear that SvenAnders volunteered for it, but I do not know what level of trust he enjoyes from the foundation. I'll ask Mark what he had in mind.
-- daniel
A quick follow-up to my earlier message. I wrote:
A word about the "production" map servers: It's up to the foundation (that is, Mark and Brion) to decide who gets access there, and how. I'm not sure what security concerns this entails. I think JeLuF would be the obvious choice for managing these systems, but I don't know if he has the time. I hear that SvenAnders volunteered for it, but I do not know what level of trust he enjoyes from the foundation. I'll ask Mark what he had in mind.
I talked to Mark and Brion about it - as it turns out, getting root access to the "production" OSM servers is actually *easier* than getting root access to the Map-Toolserver, because it doesn't entail access to private user data. The Foundation is fine with giving access to a few trusty people from the OSM side.
-- daniel
On Thursday 23 April 2009 23:47:56 Daniel Kinzler wrote:
Tels schrieb:
Just one question I couldn't read the answer out of your post:
Will it be possible to get access to the OSM API via http to that toolserver (just like http://api.openstreetmap.org)?
The answer is yes/no/maybe. It's pretty much up to you (or more precisely, Avar for now) what will be installed there. Some kind of web api to some kind of data is likely to be there at some point, yes. But as far as I know, no public services are yet planned. The services available will be the services users supply.
My question was a bit confusing as I was sleep deprived :)
What I mean is:
* Would it possible to install/set up/maintain a deamon/script/whatever on the toolserver, that can:
A: talk to the database directly (f.i. retrieve the XML) B: generate tiles/whatever from it? (f.i. generate gzipped JSON) C: server these then to the public?
I gather that will be possible, with the exception it must be WP related (not just OSM related I guess :)
My question is because I currently run a proxy server that does the above, except in A: it talks to http://api.openstreetmap.org (and other liekwise servers), and all these servers are soo slow that the user must suffer wait times of several minutes up to hours, depending on which area he looks at.
So either getting access via http:// to something like api.osm.toolserver.org (as alternative to api.openstreetmap.org), OR running the proxy server directly on the toolserver (so it can talk to the database in the background directly, bypassing the expensive XML-generation and be generally much faster) would be very cool.
My AJAX map application could then use that proxy, and show interesting map features highlighted. (it can't do that currently, but that is rather easy to add and planned, anyway :)
I am not afraid of writing the software, or setting up/maintaining it (I do that already anyway).
But I am not able to do admin tasks on the toolserver, manage user accounts etc. (due to time limits, sorry :)
All the best,
Tels