Doesnt it sound well... anti-collegial, ...
I suggest maybe "Comrade:name" or com: for short...
of editor: or ed: for short... or contributor... cont: for short...
On Mon, 2003-03-17 at 23:32, Stevertigo wrote:
Doesnt it sound well... anti-collegial, ...
I suggest maybe "Comrade:name" or com: for short...
of editor: or ed: for short... or contributor... cont: for short...
Incidentally, the Polish, Esperanto, and Czech wikipedias use the local equivalent of 'Wikipedian' for the user page namespace. (Respectively, that's Wikipedysta:, Vikipediisto:, and Wikipediista:)
-- brion vibber (brion @ pobox.com)
Editor
Fred
From: "Stevertigo" stevertigo@attbi.com Reply-To: wikien-l@wikipedia.org Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 23:32:34 -0800 To: wikien-l@wikipedia.org Subject: [WikiEN-l] the term 'USER'
Doesnt it sound well... anti-collegial, ...
I suggest maybe "Comrade:name" or com: for short...
of editor: or ed: for short... or contributor... cont: for short...
WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@wikipedia.org http://www.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
The term User: is perfectly fine and would be a pain to update (external+internal links, Google etc.). Besides, Editor: suggests authority to newbies which is a bad idea. Wikipedian: is too easy to confuse with Wikipedia:.
Regards,
Erik
On 3/18/03 9:34 AM, "Erik Moeller" erik_moeller@gmx.de wrote:
The term User: is perfectly fine and would be a pain to update (external+internal links, Google etc.). Besides, Editor: suggests authority to newbies which is a bad idea. Wikipedian: is too easy to confuse with Wikipedia:.
Why is a suggestion of authority to newbies a bad idea?
The Cunctator wrote:
Why is a suggestion of authority to newbies a bad idea?
It might discourage or intimidate them from participating. People normally understand that anyone can be a "user" of a site, but usually "editor" means you have to be appointed or authorized.
I think the term "user" helps to emphasize something radical about the wiki concept -- ordinary *users* can edit the site.
It doesn't sound very radical to say that on wikipedia, the editors can edit the site. But it is radical, and intruiging to newcomers, to hear that users can edit the site.
It's only a tidbit of language, though, so if we were starting from scratch, I'd be easy to persuade either way. But we already have a lot of "User:" links, so it seems best to keep things the way they are.
--Jimbo
Jimmy Wales wrote in part:
I think the term "user" helps to emphasize something radical about the wiki concept -- ordinary *users* can edit the site.
I agree with this.
In practice, there are (at least) two classes of Wikipedia users: the ordinary users that come to look stuff up after a Google match, and the regular editors that come here to work on articles. But this distinction doesn't exist in theory, and it's good to encourage the idea that users (hey, that's me, I'm a user 'cause I just looked something up here!) are the people that edit the site (so that's me too!).
-- Toby
I like the terminology user.
Because I feel it is also possible to benefit from having an account as a *reader* only (so... as a user...)
(mostly for the watch list - especially in those times of painful research through google)
A simple reader would maybe not have the compulsion of creating an account if it is named "editor".
And in truth, following one's watch list is truely addictive
--- Fred Bauder fredbaud@ctelco.net wrote:
Editor
Fred
From: "Stevertigo" stevertigo@attbi.com Reply-To: wikien-l@wikipedia.org Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 23:32:34 -0800 To: wikien-l@wikipedia.org Subject: [WikiEN-l] the term 'USER'
Doesnt it sound well... anti-collegial, ...
I suggest maybe "Comrade:name" or com: for
short...
of editor: or ed: for short... or contributor...
cont: for short...
WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@wikipedia.org http://www.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@wikipedia.org http://www.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
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On Wed, 2003-03-19 at 10:48, Anthere wrote:
I like the terminology user.
Because I feel it is also possible to benefit from having an account as a *reader* only (so... as a user...)
(mostly for the watch list - especially in those times of painful research through google)
A simple reader would maybe not have the compulsion of creating an account if it is named "editor".
I have to say here that I'm in disagreement.
"user" connotes a producer-consumer relationship (I create, you use; I sell, you buy; I produce, you consume) in its standard computer-lingo meaning ("lusers" vs "hackers" or "coders"), compounded by its association with the more common usage as shorthand for "drug user".
Wherease "editor" connotes stewardship, power, collaboration (because to edit you need to build on someone else's work)--and therefore some responsibility, yes. But is that so bad? We want participants in Wikipedia to feel a sense of stewardship, power, collaboration, and responsibility.
"contributor" is similarly a better word than "user", if you really dislike "editor".
--- The Cunctator cunctator@kband.com wrote:
On Wed, 2003-03-19 at 10:48, Anthere wrote:
I like the terminology user.
Because I feel it is also possible to benefit from having an account as a *reader* only (so... as a user...)
(mostly for the watch list - especially in those
times
of painful research through google)
A simple reader would maybe not have the
compulsion of
creating an account if it is named "editor".
I have to say here that I'm in disagreement.
"user" connotes a producer-consumer relationship (I create, you use; I sell, you buy; I produce, you consume) in its standard computer-lingo meaning ("lusers" vs "hackers" or "coders"), compounded by its association with the more common usage as shorthand for "drug user".
quite true
Wherease "editor" connotes stewardship, power, collaboration (because to edit you need to build on someone else's work)--and therefore some responsibility, yes. But is that so bad? We want participants in Wikipedia to feel a sense of stewardship, power, collaboration, and responsibility.
Also true but 'editor' excludes 'reader' in its meaning. I think it wrong.
"contributor" is similarly a better word than "user", if you really dislike "editor".
Contributor is the best of the three, as anyone can contribute in reading, or writing, or commenting, or developing the soft, or raising money...
strong point of 'user' : it's short and easy to write :-)
Une contributrice
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The Cunctator wrote in part:
"user" connotes a producer-consumer relationship.
Whereas "editor" connotes stewardship, power, collaboration.
This may be the source of the conflict between the two groups. Because to me, "user" has no such unempowered connotation. As a user (not sysadmin) of the Unix system here at school, I expect (and get) input into how the system is run (requesting installations, reporting problems, etc -- and yes, even fixing things myself when I know how).
-- Toby
I never thought about it before, but I have to agree that "user" is not a good description of what we are; in some software circles it also has a negative connotation as in "just a user, what does he know".
Somebody who runs Linux is a user, somebody who writes code for Linux is a contributor. Somebody who comes to Wikipedia in order to get some information is a user, somebody who writes and edits articles is a contributor.
While we probably all qualify as users in the above sense, I think we are better described as "contributors" and I would favor a change. For a smooth transition, the web server could simply redirect /wiki/user:* to /wiki/contributor:*
Axel
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The advantage of the term "USER" is precisely that it's inclusive: it doesn't draw a sharp line between the people who spend too much of our time writing for the Wikipedia, those who do a few articles on things they care about, and those who come here looking for information on something specific.
It also emphasizes that *the purpose of Wikipedia is to be a usable encyclopedia.* That I enjoy editing it is good, because it supports that goal: but the purpose is for Wikipedia to be *used* as a source of information.
On Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:41:54 -0500, Vicki Rosenzweig vr@redbird.org wrote:
The advantage of the term "USER" is precisely that it's inclusive: it doesn't draw a sharp line between the people who spend too much of our time writing for the Wikipedia, those who do a few articles on things they care about, and those who come here looking for information on something specific.
It also emphasizes that *the purpose of Wikipedia is to be a usable encyclopedia.* That I enjoy editing it is good, because it supports that goal: but the purpose is for Wikipedia to be *used* as a source of information.
*what she said* :-)