In a message dated 8/28/2009 11:20:44 AM Pacific Daylight Time, bluecaliocean@me.com writes:
When we are done, we can revert and voila! Wikipedia has food forever!>>
---------------------
Just imagine how many Terabytes of data are hiden under the iceberg tip that is what the casual reader sees. I have yet to see any paper about say, "The Twisty Turny Biography of Lincoln Evolves Over Six Years"....
That would probably keep someone busy for a long time. There must be 25,000 revisions to Lincoln.
Will Johnson
On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 1:25 PM, WJhonson@aol.com wrote:
Just imagine how many Terabytes of data are hiden under the iceberg tip that is what the casual reader sees. I have yet to see any paper about say, "The Twisty Turny Biography of Lincoln Evolves Over Six Years"....
Will Johnson
WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
This is what I consider to be the exact point for starting this thread. People truly do have no clue about how to edit or the community and how it functions. Actually, I don't think the functionality of the community can be described. Folks are amazed to be told that they can edit willy nilly, make an account and all that. For all our popularity worldwide the vast majority of the consumers have no idea (I realize I'm preaching to the choir) until these news stories invoke interest. So, what to do about it? How to not bite? This that and the other are great questions to mull over. I have no answers myself, Wikipedia just kind of happens.
~Keegan
I'd be all up for writing a wikibook introduction to Wikipedia. Anyone else interested? :)
FT2
On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:24 PM, Keegan Paul kgnpaul@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 1:25 PM, WJhonson@aol.com wrote:
Just imagine how many Terabytes of data are hiden under the iceberg tip that is what the casual reader sees. I have yet to see any paper about say, "The Twisty Turny Biography of Lincoln Evolves Over Six Years"....
Will Johnson
WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
This is what I consider to be the exact point for starting this thread. People truly do have no clue about how to edit or the community and how it functions. Actually, I don't think the functionality of the community can be described. Folks are amazed to be told that they can edit willy nilly, make an account and all that. For all our popularity worldwide the vast majority of the consumers have no idea (I realize I'm preaching to the choir) until these news stories invoke interest. So, what to do about it? How to not bite? This that and the other are great questions to mull over. I have no answers myself, Wikipedia just kind of happens.
~Keegan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Keegan _______________________________________________ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Only if I get to write the Drama chapter.
-----Original Message----- From: FT2 ft2.wiki@gmail.com To: English Wikipedia wikien-l@lists.wikimedia.org Sent: Fri, Aug 28, 2009 1:40 pm Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Positives to publicity
I'd be all up for writing a wikibook introduction to Wikipedia. Anyone else interested? :)
FT2
On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:24 PM, Keegan Paul kgnpaul@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 1:25 PM, WJhonson@aol.com wrote:
Just imagine how many Terabytes of data are hiden under the iceberg
tip
that is what the casual reader sees. I have yet to see any paper
about
say, "The Twisty Turny Biography of Lincoln Evolves Over Six Years"....
Will Johnson
WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
This is what I consider to be the exact point for starting this
thread.
People truly do have no clue about how to edit or the community and
how it
functions. Actually, I don't think the functionality of the
community can
be described. Folks are amazed to be told that they can edit willy nilly, make an
account
and all that. For all our popularity worldwide the vast majority of
the
consumers have no idea (I realize I'm preaching to the choir) until
these
news stories invoke interest. So, what to do about it? How to not
bite?
This that and the other are great questions to mull over. I have no answers myself, Wikipedia just kind of happens.
~Keegan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Keegan _______________________________________________ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
_______________________________________________ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
I'm serious.....
FT2
On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 10:09 PM, wjhonson@aol.com wrote:
Only if I get to write the Drama chapter.
-----Original Message----- From: FT2 ft2.wiki@gmail.com To: English Wikipedia wikien-l@lists.wikimedia.org Sent: Fri, Aug 28, 2009 1:40 pm Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Positives to publicity
I'd be all up for writing a wikibook introduction to Wikipedia. Anyone else interested? :)
FT2
On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:24 PM, Keegan Paul kgnpaul@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 1:25 PM, WJhonson@aol.com wrote:
Just imagine how many Terabytes of data are hiden under the iceberg
tip
that is what the casual reader sees. I have yet to see any paper
about
say, "The Twisty Turny Biography of Lincoln Evolves Over Six Years"....
Will Johnson
WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
This is what I consider to be the exact point for starting this
thread.
People truly do have no clue about how to edit or the community and
how it
functions. Actually, I don't think the functionality of the
community can
be described. Folks are amazed to be told that they can edit willy nilly, make an
account
and all that. For all our popularity worldwide the vast majority of
the
consumers have no idea (I realize I'm preaching to the choir) until
these
news stories invoke interest. So, what to do about it? How to not
bite?
This that and the other are great questions to mull over. I have no answers myself, Wikipedia just kind of happens.
~Keegan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Keegan _______________________________________________ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
The last book of Wikipedia was too fluffy. I prefer reality. Gritty, in the trenches, kick sand in your face, thumb wrestle to the death! Tabloid style.
-----Original Message----- From: FT2 ft2.wiki@gmail.com To: English Wikipedia wikien-l@lists.wikimedia.org Sent: Fri, Aug 28, 2009 2:13 pm Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Positives to publicity
I'm serious.....
FT2
On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 10:09 PM, wjhonson@aol.com wrote:
Only if I get to write the Drama chapter.
-----Original Message----- From: FT2 ft2.wiki@gmail.com To: English Wikipedia wikien-l@lists.wikimedia.org Sent: Fri, Aug 28, 2009 1:40 pm Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Positives to publicity
I'd be all up for writing a wikibook introduction to Wikipedia. Anyone else interested? :)
FT2
On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:24 PM, Keegan Paul kgnpaul@gmail.com
wrote:
On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 1:25 PM, WJhonson@aol.com wrote:
Just imagine how many Terabytes of data are hiden under the
iceberg
tip
that is what the casual reader sees. I have yet to see any paper
about
say, "The Twisty Turny Biography of Lincoln Evolves Over Six Years"....
Will Johnson
WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
This is what I consider to be the exact point for starting this
thread.
People truly do have no clue about how to edit or the community and
how it
functions. Actually, I don't think the functionality of the
community can
be described. Folks are amazed to be told that they can edit willy nilly, make an
account
and all that. For all our popularity worldwide the vast majority of
the
consumers have no idea (I realize I'm preaching to the choir) until
these
news stories invoke interest. So, what to do about it? How to not
bite?
This that and the other are great questions to mull over. I have
no
answers myself, Wikipedia just kind of happens.
~Keegan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Keegan _______________________________________________ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
_______________________________________________ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
2009/8/28 FT2 ft2.wiki@gmail.com:
I'd be all up for writing a wikibook introduction to Wikipedia. Anyone else interested? :)
FT2
Most people are not going to want to read a book before editing wikipedia. Your problems are:
1)getting people to click the edit link in the first place (polish style tab highlighting may help here)
2)getting them not to give up once they've clicked the edit button (usability project)
3)encouraging them to edit again in future (mostly related to making sure they have a good first experience).
On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:47 PM, genigeniice@gmail.com wrote:
Most people are not going to want to read a book before editing wikipedia. Your problems are:
-1) Getting people to realise that it's possible to edit
0) Getting people to want to edit
1)getting people to click the edit link in the first place (polish style tab highlighting may help here)
2)getting them not to give up once they've clicked the edit button (usability project)
3)encouraging them to edit again in future (mostly related to making sure they have a good first experience).
Keegan Paul wrote:
People truly do have no clue about how to edit or the community and how it functions. Actually, I don't think the functionality of the community can be described. Folks are amazed to be told that they can edit willy nilly, make an account and all that. For all our popularity worldwide the vast majority of the consumers have no idea (I realize I'm preaching to the choir) until these news stories invoke interest. So, what to do about it? How to not bite?
It's a big topic, obviously, but this book written by a few Wikipedians is probably the best introduction I've found: http://howwikipediaworks.com/
Of course, not everyone will go off and read a book. But, I mean, it's a fairly large community, engaged in a fairly large project (one that's never been attempted at this scale, actually), so some amount of effort to fully understand what's going on is inevitable. What we really want is: a much shorter version of that book, that somehow covers an even larger breadth of information. ;-)
It's tricky. I mean, we're not just teaching people about Wikipedia itself when we explain how to edit Wikipedia, but about many other fields of knowledge that they may or may not already have any grounding in, which we've adapted in our practices (and which many of us have learned as we go). The idea of tertiary-source summaries vs. original research; what constitutes original research in various areas; what a neutral tone sounds like; what scholarly citation looks like; how to evaluate the reliability of sources; how to spot surprising claims that need citations; how to write in a sort of fractal summary style; etc.
Some of this is slowly seeping out into the wider culture, which may make the acculturation process easier if lots of people coming in already know certain things. The widespread outside-Wikipedia use of "[citation needed]", often in a way reasonably close to what we usually mean by it, is one example (and actually imo good for knowledge in general--- journalists in particular are increasingly getting the "[citation needed]" thrown at them when they make questionable-and-unsupported claims).
-Mark
2009/8/28 WJhonson@aol.com:
Just imagine how many Terabytes of data are hiden under the iceberg tip that is what the casual reader sees. I have yet to see any paper about say, "The Twisty Turny Biography of Lincoln Evolves Over Six Years"....
There's something related that's been floating around for a few years - it's a bit more lighthearted, but it's pretty interesting nonetheless.
http://jonudell.net/udell/gems/umlaut/umlaut.html
I... friggin... love it. And I rarely love anything at all. I mean I don't even love Cheetos, although I like it. But this page you linked is the first time I've ever encountered anyone doing this. It's the wave of the future! I wish I had the technical ability to do it, or the time. I'm like one of those zombies in the Bela Lugosi "White Zombie" (1932) which I just linked up today (shameless plug shameless plug)
Chairpotato's "Night at the Movies!" http://knol.google.com/k/chair-potato/chairpotatos-night-at-the-movies/hyujx...
Just look at their faces as they push that grind-stone around and around and around. I'm like that. Only with a whip.
W.J.
-----Original Message----- From: Andrew Gray andrew.gray@dunelm.org.uk To: English Wikipedia wikien-l@lists.wikimedia.org Sent: Fri, Aug 28, 2009 4:24 pm Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Positives to publicity
2009/8/28 WJhonson@aol.com:
Just imagine how many Terabytes of data are hiden under the iceberg
tip
that is what the casual reader sees. I have yet to see any paper
about say,
"The Twisty Turny Biography of Lincoln Evolves Over Six Years"....
There's something related that's been floating around for a few years - it's a bit more lighthearted, but it's pretty interesting nonetheless.
http://jonudell.net/udell/gems/umlaut/umlaut.html
-- - Andrew Gray andrew.gray@dunelm.org.uk
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