----- Original Message ----- From: wikien-l-request@Wikipedia.org To: wikien-l@Wikipedia.org Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 3:12 PM Subject: WikiEN-l Digest, Vol 4, Issue 49
I tend to take a broad interpretation of the word "variant". For me it is not limited to derivatives of FIDE chess, but includes games with a parallel development in other parts of the world. They may very well be polyphyletic, rather than descended from some single "proto-chess"
So, as one person suggested, why not start the "Chess" article by mentioning that there are several different types of Chess, played all throughout the world, that they have certain similarities, and that there's no agreement as to whether there may or may not be a single proto-chess; and then make the main "Chess" article a jumping off point with links to Chess (Western) (or whatever its name is) and the other types of Chess, so each type has its own article?
70,000 hits + multiple appearances in print authorities should get a
mention
in the article ("commonly seen as Adolph, although technically
incorrect").
??? This seems like a problem of transliteration. Is it spelled Adolf in German? Then why not make "Adolf Hitler" the article, with a automatic redirect from "Adolph Hitler"? I know I'd be annoyed if I went to all the trouble of suspending democracy, starting war, killing 20 million people and wrecking Europe, and some German Encyclopedia 60 years later went and bolluxed my name up as "Hans". :-)
Well, clearly the NPOV is regarded by its creator and some of its supporters as a model of clarity which shines a beacon of hope and harmony over this dark and contentious world - while others regard it with much less awe, e.g., "a horrific, self-contradictory mess".
I've only just stumbled into the Wikipedia world, so maybe I'm ignorant of everything - but shouldn't simple reporting of recorded historical fact fix most of the battles going on? Propagandizing does seem to be a problem on your website (e.g. the Danzig and Silesia messes), but isn't it easier to avoid by simply leaving out all value-judgments and strictly reporting things that really exist?
This Wikipedia thing is starting to look like it has the same problems as rec.org.mensa. I hope it's just a few people who would rather hear the sound of their own voice than try and agree on anything.
From: John Merrall
I've only just stumbled into the Wikipedia world, so maybe I'm
ignorant of
everything - but shouldn't simple reporting of recorded historical
fact
fix most of the battles going on? Propagandizing does seem to be a
problem
on your website (e.g. the Danzig and Silesia messes), but isn't it
easier
to avoid by simply leaving out all value-judgments and strictly
reporting
things that really exist?
Yes. Fortunately we can rely on the pool of perfectly accurate, non-propagandizing, value-judgmentless historical references to do so.
Oops, they don't exist.
I think it's fair to have as a general principle that Wikipedia by and large reflect the consensus truth of what is historical fact rather than aggressively choose what it considers right, but that doesn't mean that the consensus truth is necessarily accurate.
And discounting "wacko" disputes, most of the problem articles are on topics in which there is currently huge dispute, such as the Israel/Palestinian situation.
John Merrall wrote:
70,000 hits + multiple appearances in print authorities should get a
mention
in the article ("commonly seen as Adolph, although technically
incorrect").
??? This seems like a problem of transliteration.
Not really. That would be the case if we were talking about Russian or Greek. The last time I looked German and English used the same alphabet. (...or is it alfabet?) :-)
I know I'd be annoyed if I went to all the trouble of suspending democracy, starting war, killing 20 million people and wrecking Europe, and some German Encyclopedia 60 years later went and bolluxed my name up as "Hans". :-)
You'd think that after suspending press freedoms, the newspapers would finally be able to get this right. :-)
This Wikipedia thing is starting to look like it has the same problems as rec.org.mensa. I hope it's just a few people who would rather hear the sound of their own voice than try and agree on anything.
I have to accept that one thing we have in common with them is a lot of precocious genius. :-)