Abe (user:172) has asked me to inform the mailing list that I have "retracted" my request to ban him. I'd like to take this opportunity to clarify a few points.
When I asked, "Can we ban 172 and VV?", I was using a rhetorical device. What I sought was merely that ALL parties concerned, would be in compliance with Wikipedia policy. Be cooperative, or be elsewhere: nothing more, nothing less.
I've broken a lot of log jams at Wikipedia, and when I set out to do something here I've always succeeded. If it's an article, I've always been able to find a way to get all the contributors to agree on both the process and the product. If it's a 'troublesome user', it's a bit more involved.
The best outcome is that the user sees the light and chooses _voluntarily_ to support Wikipedia policy: chiefly, no insults and no reversion wars. Other alternatives include getting an "official warning" or being blocked (temporarily) or banned (indefinitely). The last alternative is always farthest from my mind, because it's the worst for all involved.
But some people think that calling someone to account comprises a personal affront: "How dare you tell me to follow the rules!" Well, somebody has to do it. Better me than Jimbo, because most people who tangle with Jimbo wind up getting exiled. I'm much more patient and easy to deal with.
But Abe handled the "shape up or ship out" confrontation rather well. It's a pity that the process was so disturbing to him, but I don't feel I have anything to apologize for. My job (as I see it) is to ensure that articles are accurate and unbiased; my method is to encourage users to contribute with courtesy.
It's not dis-courteous to insist that another user conform to Wikipedia policy. Contrariwise, it's my duty.
Ed Poor, aka Uncle Ed Bureaucrat
Ed Poor wrote
When I asked, "Can we ban 172 and VV?", I was using a rhetorical device.
Ed, I took a long time to decide whether you were a licensed clown around here, or Machiavellian. My conclusion: both.
My job (as I see it) is to ensure that
articles are accurate and unbiased; my method is to encourage users to contribute with courtesy.
In the same vein: I have found your edits to WP to be remarkable only for their tendentiousness. As far as courtesy is concerned, I have no complaints in our personal dealings - in fact the opposite.
Charles
Poor, Edmund W wrote:
When I asked, "Can we ban 172 and VV?", I was using a rhetorical device. What I sought was merely that ALL parties concerned, would be in compliance with Wikipedia policy. Be cooperative, or be elsewhere: nothing more, nothing less.
The difficulty with rhetorical devices is that audience too easily takes them literally, and you reap a whirlwind.
Ec
On 6/24/04 10:07 AM, "Poor, Edmund W" Edmund.W.Poor@abc.com wrote:
Abe (user:172) has asked me to inform the mailing list that I have "retracted" my request to ban him. I'd like to take this opportunity to clarify a few points.
When I asked, "Can we ban 172 and VV?", I was using a rhetorical device. What I sought was merely that ALL parties concerned, would be in compliance with Wikipedia policy. Be cooperative, or be elsewhere: nothing more, nothing less.
I've broken a lot of log jams at Wikipedia, and when I set out to do something here I've always succeeded. If it's an article, I've always been able to find a way to get all the contributors to agree on both the process and the product. If it's a 'troublesome user', it's a bit more involved.
Wow. Like George W. Bush, incapable of thinking of a single failure.
Ed, why don't you just admit that your question was inappropriate and incendiary, instead of arguing that it somehow helps matters?
On Thu, 24 Jun 2004 18:52:50 -0400, The Cunctator cunctator@kband.com wrote:
Wow. Like George W. Bush, incapable of thinking of a single failure.
You trying to hit two birds with one stone, eh?