People here might be interested in my post at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_%28policy%29#Image_submi...
On Sat, Jun 14, 2008 at 5:28 PM, Gregory Maxwell gmaxwell@gmail.com wrote:
People here might be interested in my post at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_%28policy%29#Image_submi...
After reading his post I'm disappointed to see this also; I think this consequence wasn't in the minds of the people supporting this proposal. Since I do take a hardline position on image copyright issues, I'd also like it to be easy for us to get free images from people who aren't our regular user base and who do already find it difficult to contribute media.
I'm interested in hearing thoughts from David, Mark, or someone else actively involved in soliciting free images from outside the usual Wikimedians...
-Kat
2008/6/14 Kat Walsh kat@mindspillage.org:
On Sat, Jun 14, 2008 at 5:28 PM, Gregory Maxwell gmaxwell@gmail.com wrote:
People here might be interested in my post at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_%28policy%29#Image_submi...
After reading his post I'm disappointed to see this also; I think this consequence wasn't in the minds of the people supporting this proposal. Since I do take a hardline position on image copyright issues, I'd also like it to be easy for us to get free images from people who aren't our regular user base and who do already find it difficult to contribute media. I'm interested in hearing thoughts from David, Mark, or someone else actively involved in soliciting free images from outside the usual Wikimedians...
My thought is "what the fuck?"
Is there any way this can be reversed, quickly, for en:wp?
- d.
David Gerard wrote:
My thought is "what the fuck?"
Is there any way this can be reversed, quickly, for en:wp?
Indeed. Let's not have another arbitrary fait accompli like the disabling of page creation. There have just been some massive improvements to the image upload page that makes it easier to cross all the Ts and dot the Is, isn't that a preferable way to reduce the occurrence of improperly licenced and unsourced uploads rather than preventing uploads in the first place?
Kat Walsh wrote:
On Sat, Jun 14, 2008 at 5:28 PM, Gregory Maxwell gmaxwell@gmail.com wrote:
People here might be interested in my post at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_%28policy%29#Image_submi...
After reading his post I'm disappointed to see this also; I think this consequence wasn't in the minds of the people supporting this proposal. Since I do take a hardline position on image copyright issues, I'd also like it to be easy for us to get free images from people who aren't our regular user base and who do already find it difficult to contribute media.
If I read correctly, Commons was excluded from the effect of the change (or at least the comments in the vote on Meta seemed to indicate that). If so, since most new free-licensed images (as opposed to fair-use ones) should go to Commons anyway, could we just change the instructions for new-user uploads to point them to the Commons account-creation and upload pages?
-Mark
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Delirium wrote:
Kat Walsh wrote:
On Sat, Jun 14, 2008 at 5:28 PM, Gregory Maxwell gmaxwell@gmail.com wrote:
People here might be interested in my post at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_%28policy%29#Image_submi...
After reading his post I'm disappointed to see this also; I think this consequence wasn't in the minds of the people supporting this proposal. Since I do take a hardline position on image copyright issues, I'd also like it to be easy for us to get free images from people who aren't our regular user base and who do already find it difficult to contribute media.
If I read correctly, Commons was excluded from the effect of the change (or at least the comments in the vote on Meta seemed to indicate that). If so, since most new free-licensed images (as opposed to fair-use ones) should go to Commons anyway, could we just change the instructions for new-user uploads to point them to the Commons account-creation and upload pages?
-Mark
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That would make sense.
- --CWii
On Sat, Jun 14, 2008 at 10:27 PM, Delirium delirium@hackish.org wrote:
If I read correctly, Commons was excluded from the effect of the change (or at least the comments in the vote on Meta seemed to indicate that). If so, since most new free-licensed images (as opposed to fair-use ones) should go to Commons anyway, could we just change the instructions for new-user uploads to point them to the Commons account-creation and upload pages?
Better yet, wait a couple of months and they can sign up on Wikipedia and get an account on Commons automatically, when unification is automatic at account creation. Assuming that freely-licensed images should always be uploaded to Commons anyway, which isn't a terrible assumption, this restriction only reduces people's ability to upload fair-use images (and, of course, copyvios). The instructions just need to be updated, it seems to me.
On Sun, Jun 15, 2008 at 12:05 PM, Simetrical Simetrical+wikilist@gmail.com wrote:
Assuming that freely-licensed images should always be uploaded to Commons anyway, which isn't a terrible assumption, this restriction only reduces people's ability to upload fair-use images (and, of course, copyvios).
The ability to upload copyvios isn't reduced.
2008/6/16 Anthony wikimail@inbox.org:
On Sun, Jun 15, 2008 at 12:05 PM, Simetrical Simetrical+wikilist@gmail.com wrote:
Assuming that freely-licensed images should always be uploaded to Commons anyway, which isn't a terrible assumption, this restriction only reduces people's ability to upload fair-use images (and, of course, copyvios).
The ability to upload copyvios isn't reduced.
Of course technical restrictions don't stop bad faith, but it does reduce the likelihood of inadvertent ones (and claims of "fair use" under the hitherto-unknown "I wanna" clause).
- d.
On 6/15/08, Simetrical Simetrical+wikilist@gmail.com wrote:
Better yet, wait a couple of months and they can sign up on Wikipedia and get an account on Commons automatically, when unification is automatic at account creation.
Forgive me for the stupid question, but I am curious why this is not already in effect, and what exactly will happen in "a couple of months" to make this possible if it is not currently so.
Assuming that freely-licensed images should always be uploaded to Commons anyway, which isn't a terrible assumption...
This is an excellent assumption.
this restriction only reduces people's ability to upload fair-use images (and, of course, copyvios).
Well obviously copyvio can be uploaded anywhere if one is a skillful liar. The difference is that commons admins are expected to understand image policy and take it seriously, so uploads which violate policy are more likely to be deleted.
—C.W.
On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 9:20 AM, Charlotte Webb charlottethewebb@gmail.com wrote:
On 6/15/08, Simetrical Simetrical+wikilist@gmail.com wrote:
Better yet, wait a couple of months and they can sign up on Wikipedia and get an account on Commons automatically, when unification is automatic at account creation.
Forgive me for the stupid question, but I am curious why this is not already in effect, and what exactly will happen in "a couple of months" to make this possible if it is not currently so.
I believe the idea is just that it's being rolled out gradually so that bugs can be spotted and fixed before they cause too much havoc. First opt-in for admins, then opt-in for all users, and finally (we haven't gotten here yet) automatic for all users, or at least all users without conflicts. I completely made up the figure of a couple of months, but I'd be a little surprised if it weren't in effect by then.
this restriction only reduces people's ability to upload fair-use images (and, of course, copyvios).
Well obviously copyvio can be uploaded anywhere if one is a skillful liar. The difference is that commons admins are expected to understand image policy and take it seriously, so uploads which violate policy are more likely to be deleted.
As I said, yes, it reduces people's ability to upload copyvios.
On 6/18/08, Simetrical Simetrical+wikilist@gmail.com wrote:
I believe the idea is just that it's being rolled out gradually so that bugs can be spotted and fixed before they cause too much havoc. First opt-in for admins, then opt-in for all users, and finally (we haven't gotten here yet) automatic for all users, or at least all users without conflicts. I completely made up the figure of a couple of months, but I'd be a little surprised if it weren't in effect by then.
Alright, as long as we are at least preventing new accounts with names which would create more conflicts (over the next "couple of months") I can be patient.
—C.W.
On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 10:09 AM, Charlotte Webb charlottethewebb@gmail.com wrote:
Alright, as long as we are at least preventing new accounts with names which would create more conflicts (over the next "couple of months") I can be patient.
Last I checked we aren't . . .
On 6/18/08, Simetrical Simetrical+wikilist@gmail.com wrote:
Last I checked we aren't . . .
So we're still losing ground. Great.
—C.W.