On 8/24/06, Gregory Maxwell gmaxwell@gmail.com wrote:
On 8/24/06, jayjg jayjg99@gmail.com wrote:
As the article Talk: page has made quite clear, some people look at the image and think it is a clear example of anti-Semitism, others look at it and think it's anti-Zionism.
No orignal research Jay, I could care less what you and other random spectators think of the image.
Exactly. Nor do I care. Nor should those opinions be included to taint the caption with OR.
You are making a value judgement about the image by putting it on the article.
As Jkelly has explained, we don't need a secondary source claiming that a picture of a tree is a picture of tree before we can insert it in an article.
The article discusses at length the debate over whether some (or all) anti-Zionism is anti-Semitism - indeed, to a degree, that is what the whole article is about.
And hopefully the claims in the article are sourced and are not original research.
Of course they are, with literally hundreds of high quality footnotes. Again, why would you comment about something that you had not actually looked into?
Thus, again, as has been explained, the arguably ambiguous nature of the image is a perfect example of the topic of the article itself.
If it's explained, it's only explained through original research. To resolve this problem we attribute the claim to it's source, who makes a good effort to back it up.
See Jkelly's earlier e-mail in the thread, and the statement above.
Something about this image bothers Netscott, and he has tried to modify, explain, remove, etc. this image on various grounds. He keeps claiming it violates policy; yet when asked to explain what policy he thinks it violates, he keeps making vague (and changing) references to various policies, but refuses to actually quote the specific section of policy he thinks this violates.
On the talk page of the image he quite clearly argues that he believes our description of the image as Anti-Semitic is original research. I am inclined to agree.
But we *haven't* described the image as anti-Semitic, so how can it possibly be "Original research"? It is Netscott who keeps insisting it must be described as anti-Semitic, I'm arguing against that!
His editing history on the article has attempted to attribute the claim to the source of the image, along with a link to their argument. I am inclined to agree that doing so ls likely the best resolution of this absolutely idiotic edit war.
What "claim" are you talking about? We make no claim that the picture is anti-Semitic.
If there's any wikilawyering going on, it's Netscott's claim that something violated policy, but refusal to actually quote the policy.
It's inappropriate to respond to simple criticisms backed by easily understandable arguments with a demand to cite chapter and verse of the policy.
However, baffling and constantly changing arguments, that appear to have nothing whatever to do with policy, need some actual quotation of policy so that people can pin down exactly what the person is talking about.
Anyway, I'm done responding on this thread. If you want to talk about this, take it to the Talk: page.
Jay.