Wikipedia is goingto be a safe and pleasant place for people to work. We will respect ourusers and do what we can to protect them from harassment.
Fred
-----Original Message----- From: Steve Summit [mailto:scs@eskimo.com] Sent: Wednesday, July 4, 2007 06:54 PM To: wikien-l@lists.wikimedia.org Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] FredBauder"clarifies"onattackkkkk site link policy
jayjg wrote:
On 7/3/07, Steve Summit scs@eskimo.com wrote:
I'm not talking about wiki-drama, I'm talking about hypertext. Wikipedia is a website. Websites link to each other. It turns out it's an incredibly powerful and useful concept.
It's only useful to link to sites that have useful content. Wikipedia has all sorts of rules about not linking to useless sites.
Wikipedia has rules about the insertion of useless *links*. And even if every link to a site is useless, we don't need an additional rule saying, never link to this site. The no-useless-links rule is both necessary and sufficient.
I wish you'd answer the question. Why do we need a blanket ban? How does it prevent Personal Attacks (in ways that WP:NPA can't)? How does it help us build an encyclopedia?
That has been explained at length.
(But this is still no explanation:)
Wikipedians volunteer their time to help in this project; as a result of that volunteer work, they are exposed to often vicious harassment by a small number of banned editors on websites. We should not in any way bring attention to those websites. It's common sense, good policy, and basic decency.
(I should really decline to take another turn on this merry-go-round, but:) Links to the vicious harassment, for the purpose of additional harassment, are vile and should be prohibited. But you still haven't shown why other kinds of links must be prohibited. You still haven't shown why a blanket ban is necessary.
The argument in favor of a blanket ban seems to rest on one or two assumptions:
- that a link to site X is an "endorsement" of site X, and/or
- that a viciously harassed volunteer Wikipedia editor,
once harassed, is further wounded by every mention of the harasser, in any context.
What cost? I've seen none so far.
An illogical, censorious policy exacts a significant (albeit intangible) cost in that observers are left with the impression that our policies are driven by emotion, not logic. One begins to trust and respect our policymaking process less.
I'm talking about real costs, not radical philosophy.
You'll have to define "real cost", then. The cost in terms of rational people throwing up their hands and walking away from a madhouse is at least as great as the cost in terms of thin-skinned victims wailing that the bully's name got mentioned again. It's not "radical philosophy" to point out that irrational, emotion-laden policies weaken a project that's supposed to welcome rational, mature contributors.
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