It may not be the way you handle things at the Dutch Wikipedia, but you're getting quite a few things wrong here.
First, you were complaining about a problem on YOUR PC, no amount of hacking about with the code on the wiki is going to fix that.
Second, IRC channels are not provided by the Wikimedia Foundation. They are completely independent and have nothing to do with rules like "Don't bite the newbies". Having said that, there is no indication anyone actually bit or otherwise abused you. You refused to see that the problem was on your end and nobody could help you remotely. The tongue-in-cheek joke you provoked was mild, and simply not a reason to devote so much effort, so long after the fact, to produce an extended complaint.
Brian.
-------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: [Wikinews-l] Fwd: Wikinews e-mail about IRC complaining From: "Tahrim Ramdjan" Tahrim_Ramdjan@planet.nl Date: Mon, September 28, 2009 1:29 pm To: "'Jon Davis'" wiki@konsoletek.com, "'Wikinews mailing list'" wikinews-l@lists.wikimedia.org
So it seems i did things wrong... :S Well, i only know that this isnt the way we handle at the Dutch Wikipedia, but sorry by then and goodbye.
From: jon@snowulf.com [mailto:jon@snowulf.com] On Behalf Of Jon Davis Sent: maandag 28 september 2009 4:51 To: Wikinews mailing list Cc: TahR78 Subject: Re: [Wikinews-l] Fwd: Wikinews e-mail about IRC complaining
Wow. Talk about a speedy email about this topic. This conversation started August 20th, 2009 @ 05:19 PST (12:19 UTC?).
If the group is curious, I can provided a full copy of the chat transcript, but after reading...this is a non issue. The user in question (Tahr78) who I'm CC'ing (out of the kindness of my heart) was having... difficulties.
He was extremely insistent that our maps were broken, and that there was no other explanation. NeoAmsterdam and Gopher65 attempted to explain to the user that the maps seemed to be working correctly, that the maps were not country/continent average temperatures (I guess the Netherlands is so small they dont bother giving people the weather other than the national average temp?!) and that the tooltips showed that the temperature in question was for East Midlands, England and not the Netherlands. Apparently the users tooltips were not working, and that's Wikinews's fault. When NeoAmsterdam explained that this wasn't our fault, the user threw a tantrum.
At this point the conversation goes way down hill with the user repeatedly quitting and re-joining the channel. Right after he quits the first time, he gets his "friend" to join the channel under the username "Olivier_Bommel". The user (along with his friend) continue tossing in bits of commentary here or there and generally being a pain in the ass
After a bit of this on & off, we get to the "threat". Since the user is accusing NeoAmsterdam of making threats over IRC, I'm pulling out the 4 lines of relevant text here for everyone: (6:26:46 AM) NeoAmsterdam: Since you insist, TahR78, I'll say it: (6:26:46 AM) NeoAmsterdam: The Dutch were fools for surrendering New Amsterdam so quickly to the English. (6:26:46 AM) NeoAmsterdam: There. I've said it. I feel better. (6:26:46 AM) NeoAmsterdam: ^_^
In short, there was no threatening behavior going on. NeoAmsterdam did nothing wrong in my book in handling this user. In fact, if I had been the one on, I would have ban hammered both TahR78 and his friend Olivier_Bommel from the channel for being disruptive.
-Jon
On Sun, Sep 27, 2009 at 17:14, Patrick Mannion patrick.mannion@gmail.com wrote:
Dunno why I got this, I hardly hang out on the IRC channel, but nontheless something for you guys to look at...
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: TahR78 tahrim_ramdjan@planet.nl Date: Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 8:09 PM Subject: Wikinews e-mail about IRC complaining To: TUFKAAP patrick.mannion@gmail.com
Hi Tufkaap,
Im sorry for disturbing you in this late hour (in where i live, Europe, it is now night). I want to complain about an user on IRC, he is much on it. Lets start with the story:
So, i and friends were looking because we were bored, one of my friends said that he found a weather map of Europe. We were going to watch, it was a Celsius map, but it wasnt right. So we joined the IRC channel of Wikinews and we were going to report it. First time nobody reacted, second time also nobody. Thirth time finally somebody was waken up and listened to us. I just nice said ''Hey, there's a kind of fault in this template''. The user i've spoken to, NeoAmsterdam, didnt appreciate that very much. He said to me on a not so nice way that i have to look better, because it are airports. It would stand on a tooltip. Well, tooltips doesnt work on this computer on that day, so i made him that clear. Than everybody said something and, NeoAmsterdam also said that he thinks that the Dutch were stupid to give New Amsterdam to the British.
When he said that, i thought he was going to hurt me, but he didnt. First of all, i cant fix it that New York isnt now New Amsterdam, so dont blame me that and second, it doesnt touch me, because i am born in Holland, but my parents come from a whole other country. I leaved the channel, but friends were still on the channel and said me that they were talking bad about me.
Well, i am not hurt, no, i could even laugh about what NeoAmsterdam said. I am experienced with wiki's, i have a account on the Dutch Wikipedia as well, and have crossuser on, so i can log in on every Wikimedia wiki. But i have also experience on other wiki's like from Wikia. I know this isnt the usual way, im sorry for that, but i donk think this is a nice way to explain things to (new) users on Wikinews, especially foreigners. Also when you are talking bad about a newbie on a wiki, that isnt the right thing i think?
(Why i choosen you is because when i said on the IRC channel some days ago, somebody prefered you. Hope you dont mind my bad English, because i am not so old (11, 12 years) and still Dutch, so i am not a very expert in English. Hope you understand this situation, maybe i made a big thing of it but just wanted to say this.. Only time when i contributed to Wikinews was with a article about the attack on the Dutch queen, no more).
Sorry for the long mail and disturbing you, but i just wanted this to say. Please note that it is a long time ago when this happened, you will be surprised why i send this mail NOW, well, its simple: i didnt have any time. I have also accounts on other much internet communities. There were more people at that IRC conversation but i can only remember NeoAmsterdam.
Greetings from TahR78
Want to send a reaction, you can mail this email adress back or leave a note on my dutch Wikipedia talk page, my name there is also TahR78, however i dont prefer that because it isnt necessary to tell every Dutch Wikipedians about this story.
-- This e-mail was sent by TahR78 to TUFKAAP by the "E-mail user" function at Wikinews.
-- Autism is both a gift and a curse at the same time; But I think of it as a gift.
Wikinews-l mailing list Wikinews-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikinews-l
-- Jon [[User:ShakataGaNai]] http://snowulf.com/ - Blog http://snowulf.imagekind.com/ - Pictures This has been a test of the emergency sig system.<hr>_______________________________________________ Wikinews-l mailing list Wikinews-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikinews-l
Yeah okay, thanks for another mail about this.
It could possible that i was also being a kind of rude but i felt threatened. Please respect it that i can felt threatened. I think the best thing is now to let it go. Like also somebody on the channel said.\
-----Original Message----- From: brian.mcneil@wikinewsie.org [mailto:brian.mcneil@wikinewsie.org] Sent: maandag 28 september 2009 16:34 To: Wikinews mailing list Cc: Tahrim_Ramdjan@planet.nl Subject: RE: [Wikinews-l] Fwd: Wikinews e-mail about IRC complaining
It may not be the way you handle things at the Dutch Wikipedia, but you're getting quite a few things wrong here.
First, you were complaining about a problem on YOUR PC, no amount of hacking about with the code on the wiki is going to fix that.
Second, IRC channels are not provided by the Wikimedia Foundation. They are completely independent and have nothing to do with rules like "Don't bite the newbies". Having said that, there is no indication anyone actually bit or otherwise abused you. You refused to see that the problem was on your end and nobody could help you remotely. The tongue-in-cheek joke you provoked was mild, and simply not a reason to devote so much effort, so long after the fact, to produce an extended complaint.
Brian.
-------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: [Wikinews-l] Fwd: Wikinews e-mail about IRC complaining From: "Tahrim Ramdjan" Tahrim_Ramdjan@planet.nl Date: Mon, September 28, 2009 1:29 pm To: "'Jon Davis'" wiki@konsoletek.com, "'Wikinews mailing list'" wikinews-l@lists.wikimedia.org
So it seems i did things wrong... :S Well, i only know that this isnt the way we handle at the Dutch Wikipedia, but sorry by then and goodbye.
From: jon@snowulf.com [mailto:jon@snowulf.com] On Behalf Of Jon Davis Sent: maandag 28 september 2009 4:51 To: Wikinews mailing list Cc: TahR78 Subject: Re: [Wikinews-l] Fwd: Wikinews e-mail about IRC complaining
Wow. Talk about a speedy email about this topic. This conversation
started
August 20th, 2009 @ 05:19 PST (12:19 UTC?).
If the group is curious, I can provided a full copy of the chat
transcript,
but after reading...this is a non issue. The user in question (Tahr78)
who
I'm CC'ing (out of the kindness of my heart) was having... difficulties.
He was extremely insistent that our maps were broken, and that there was
no
other explanation. NeoAmsterdam and Gopher65 attempted to explain to the user that the maps seemed to be working correctly, that the maps were not country/continent average temperatures (I guess the Netherlands is so
small
they dont bother giving people the weather other than the national average temp?!) and that the tooltips showed that the temperature in question was for East Midlands, England and not the Netherlands. Apparently the users tooltips were not working, and that's Wikinews's fault. When NeoAmsterdam explained that this wasn't our fault, the user threw a tantrum.
At this point the conversation goes way down hill with the user repeatedly quitting and re-joining the channel. Right after he quits the first time, he gets his "friend" to join the channel under the username "Olivier_Bommel". The user (along with his friend) continue tossing in
bits
of commentary here or there and generally being a pain in the ass
After a bit of this on & off, we get to the "threat". Since the user is accusing NeoAmsterdam of making threats over IRC, I'm pulling out the 4 lines of relevant text here for everyone: (6:26:46 AM) NeoAmsterdam: Since you insist, TahR78, I'll say it: (6:26:46 AM) NeoAmsterdam: The Dutch were fools for surrendering New Amsterdam so quickly to the English. (6:26:46 AM) NeoAmsterdam: There. I've said it. I feel better. (6:26:46 AM) NeoAmsterdam: ^_^
In short, there was no threatening behavior going on. NeoAmsterdam did nothing wrong in my book in handling this user. In fact, if I had been
the
one on, I would have ban hammered both TahR78 and his friend
Olivier_Bommel
from the channel for being disruptive.
-Jon
On Sun, Sep 27, 2009 at 17:14, Patrick Mannion patrick.mannion@gmail.com wrote:
Dunno why I got this, I hardly hang out on the IRC channel, but nontheless something for you guys to look at...
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: TahR78 tahrim_ramdjan@planet.nl Date: Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 8:09 PM Subject: Wikinews e-mail about IRC complaining To: TUFKAAP patrick.mannion@gmail.com
Hi Tufkaap,
Im sorry for disturbing you in this late hour (in where i live, Europe, it is now night). I want to complain about an user on IRC, he is much on it. Lets start with the story:
So, i and friends were looking because we were bored, one of my friends
said
that he found a weather map of Europe. We were going to watch, it was a Celsius map, but it wasnt right. So we joined the IRC channel of Wikinews and we were going to report it. First time nobody reacted, second time
also
nobody. Thirth time finally somebody was waken up and listened to us. I
just
nice said ''Hey, there's a kind of fault in this template''. The user i've spoken to, NeoAmsterdam, didnt appreciate that very much. He said to me on
a
not so nice way that i have to look better, because it are airports. It would stand on a tooltip. Well, tooltips doesnt work on this computer on that day, so i made him that clear. Than everybody said something and, NeoAmsterdam also said that he thinks that the Dutch were stupid to give
New
Amsterdam to the British.
When he said that, i thought he was going to hurt me, but he didnt. First
of
all, i cant fix it that New York isnt now New Amsterdam, so dont blame me that and second, it doesnt touch me, because i am born in Holland, but my parents come from a whole other country. I leaved the channel, but friends were still on the channel and said me that they were talking bad about me.
Well, i am not hurt, no, i could even laugh about what NeoAmsterdam said.
I
am experienced with wiki's, i have a account on the Dutch Wikipedia as
well,
and have crossuser on, so i can log in on every Wikimedia wiki. But i have also experience on other wiki's like from Wikia. I know this isnt the
usual
way, im sorry for that, but i donk think this is a nice way to explain things to (new) users on Wikinews, especially foreigners. Also when you
are
talking bad about a newbie on a wiki, that isnt the right thing i think?
(Why i choosen you is because when i said on the IRC channel some days
ago,
somebody prefered you. Hope you dont mind my bad English, because i am not so old (11, 12 years) and still Dutch, so i am not a very expert in
English.
Hope you understand this situation, maybe i made a big thing of it but
just
wanted to say this.. Only time when i contributed to Wikinews was with a article about the attack on the Dutch queen, no more).
Sorry for the long mail and disturbing you, but i just wanted this to say. Please note that it is a long time ago when this happened, you will be surprised why i send this mail NOW, well, its simple: i didnt have any
time.
I have also accounts on other much internet communities. There were more people at that IRC conversation but i can only remember NeoAmsterdam.
Greetings from TahR78
Want to send a reaction, you can mail this email adress back or leave a
note
on my dutch Wikipedia talk page, my name there is also TahR78, however i dont prefer that because it isnt necessary to tell every Dutch Wikipedians about this story.
-- This e-mail was sent by TahR78 to TUFKAAP by the "E-mail user" function at Wikinews.
-- Autism is both a gift and a curse at the same time; But I think of it as a gift.
Wikinews-l mailing list Wikinews-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikinews-l
-- Jon [[User:ShakataGaNai]] http://snowulf.com/ - Blog http://snowulf.imagekind.com/ - Pictures This has been a test of the emergency sig
system.<hr>_______________________________________________
Wikinews-l mailing list Wikinews-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikinews-l
wikinews-l@lists.wikimedia.org