I am sympathetic to this, but I think that there needs to be a fairly tight policy. As an example, we really can't take a photo from Reuters and claim fair use -- our use is too similar to theirs, competes with theirs, etc.

I think it's worth discussing at length so we can get our heads clear about what the exact bounds should be. Commons-only is very safe for now, but your point is valid of course.

David Speakman wrote:

C&P from the Wikinews watercooler:

I officially propose that we institute an "Image:" upload capability into the Wikinews area and drop the use of Wiki Commons as our default image upload site and article image server since it will harm the depth of our news coverage. The use of Wiki Commons as our image source will hamper us since [[w:fair use]] images are not allowed there. It is my belief that news sometimes needs fair use graphics -- case in point: the "Wells Fargo and Barclay's rumoured to be in merger talks" article in which I inserted a Wells Fargo and Barclays logo - which visually helps the story. But since we use Wiki Commons for our image source, this graphic will most likely be deleted, leaving the story text-only. -- Davodd | Talk 10:13, 10 Jan 2005 (UTC)

-- David Speakman http://www.DavidSpeakman.com 501 Moorpark Way #83 Mountain View CA 94041

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Mathias Schindler wrote:

Opening the door for non-free pictures again will block any attempt to encourage people to create free pictures. Showing the company building with the logo or even better: artistic work is much better than creating a situation in which a local law might help for a small fraction of wikimedia users. If the alternative to non-free pictures were "no-pictures", I would agree. But this is simply not the case.

I think this is a very valid point.

David should come up with an argumentation that survives contact with reality when it leaves the fair-use island (except the argumentation lazyness (sp?) to find free solutions).

Sorry, if this was to harsh but I'm very scared of this change of policy.

No, I don't think it is too harsh, it's very important that we be quite hard-headed about such things.

Now, a quick question about German law. If I pick up a German newspaper, and there is a story about IBM, is it common for the story to just use the logo? If so, does the newspaper need permission for that? Or, is there something like "fair use" that allows it?

Or is it that German newspapers instead always use photos of the company building and the like?

I apologize that I don't know the answer to this, as often as I am in Germany, I should at least try to look at the paper sometimes. :-)

--Jimbo