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Rare trove of US Army Medical Photos Heads to Flickr

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Re: [Commons-l] Image moving...

Durova

18 Mar 2009 18 Mar '09

2:36 p.m.

http://blog.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/03/medarchives.html Why is Flickr--a for-profit site--getting this rather than Commons? -Durova -- http://durova.blogspot.com/

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Mathias Schindler

18 Mar 18 Mar

2:39 p.m.

2009/3/18 Durova <nadezhda.durova(a)gmail.com>om>:

http://blog.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/03/medarchives.html Why is Flickr--a for-profit site--getting this rather than Commons?

This is not a either-or decision. Any image that is donated to Commons could also land at Flickr. On ther hand, if the donation to Flicker is done right, with a free license or declared as PD, Commons could benefit from it as well. In the meantime, I am working on another large upload of images to Commons. I expect this to be made public at the end of this month/early April. Mathias

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Mathias Schindler

2:54 p.m.

2009/3/18 Durova <nadezhda.durova(a)gmail.com>om>:

http://blog.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/03/medarchives.html Why is Flickr--a for-profit site--getting this rather than Commons?

I emailed Mike Rhode about this. Mathias

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geni

2:59 p.m.

2009/3/18 Durova <nadezhda.durova(a)gmail.com>om>:

http://blog.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/03/medarchives.html Why is Flickr--a for-profit site--getting this rather than Commons? -Durova

Becuase they have the rescources to have people working full time developing the contacts needed to get this kind of thing. -- geni

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Mathias Schindler

3:04 p.m.

On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 3:59 PM, geni <geniice(a)gmail.com> wrote:

Becuase they have the rescources to have people working full time developing the contacts needed to get this kind of thing.

I would dispute both parts. It does not take full time employees to inquire the release of data in an already pd-friendly environment such as the US Government. Mathias

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geni

5:09 p.m.

2009/3/18 Mathias Schindler <mathias.schindler(a)gmail.com>om>:

On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 3:59 PM, geni <geniice(a)gmail.com> wrote:

Becuase they have the rescources to have people working full time developing the contacts needed to get this kind of thing.

I would dispute both parts. It does not take full time employees to inquire the release of data in an already pd-friendly environment such as the US Government. Mathias

Depends on the scale. Sure as a individual you can get small scale releases but anything beyond that it will have to become something close to a full time occupation. But hey if you think otherwise you are free to try and get hold of the old aerial photographs of Antarctica from Operation Highjump. Various people have managed to get large releases of material from the US government but it tends to either be expensive or hard work. One of the things I've been vaguely trying to work out how to do is digitalising part of the UK's National Monuments Record aerial photograph collection. -- geni

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Andrew Gray

5:32 p.m.

2009/3/18 geni <geniice(a)gmail.com>om>:

2009/3/18 Durova <nadezhda.durova(a)gmail.com>om>:

http://blog.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/03/medarchives.html Why is Flickr--a for-profit site--getting this rather than Commons?

Becuase they have the rescources to have people working full time developing the contacts needed to get this kind of thing.

Judging by the story, this was done entirely unofficially by one guy there - I don't think it's a matter of "developing contacts" so much as he wanted to release them, and he happened to choose to do it on flickr. -- - Andrew Gray andrew.gray(a)dunelm.org.uk

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Geoffrey Plourde

4:19 p.m.

I am under the impression that each and every photo he uploads to Flickr is a work of the United States government and is in the public domain. By licensing them as CC, I think he has committed a copyright violation or the very least, unenforceable restriction. ________________________________ From: Durova <nadezhda.durova(a)gmail.com> To: commons-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2009 7:36:55 AM Subject: [Commons-l] Rare trove of US Army Medical Photos Heads to Flickr http://blog.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/03/medarchives.html Why is Flickr--a for-profit site--getting this rather than Commons? -Durova -- http://durova.blogspot.com/

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Mathias Schindler

4:40 p.m.

2009/3/18 Geoffrey Plourde <geo.plrd(a)yahoo.com>om>:

I am under the impression that each and every photo he uploads to Flickr is a work of the United States government and is in the public domain. By licensing them as CC, I think he has committed a copyright violation or the very least, unenforceable restriction.

What makes you think that DK Winter was an government employee? Mathias

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Geoffrey Plourde

19 Mar 19 Mar

12:06 a.m.

The person uploading these has indicated that they were retrieved from a US Government archive. Cursory inspection reveals that many are likely public domain. DK Winter was a museum illustrator in the 50s, which means copyright is dependent upon the museum. The big question I have is whther or not a public domain image can be put under a license requiring attribution? ________________________________ From: Mathias Schindler <mathias.schindler(a)gmail.com> To: Wikimedia Commons Discussion List <commons-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org> Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2009 9:40:57 AM Subject: Re: [Commons-l] Rare trove of US Army Medical Photos Heads to Flickr 2009/3/18 Geoffrey Plourde <geo.plrd(a)yahoo.com>om>:

I am under the impression that each and every photo he uploads to Flickr is a work of the United States government and is in the public domain. By licensing them as CC, I think he has committed a copyright violation or the very least, unenforceable restriction.

What makes you think that DK Winter was an government employee? Mathias _______________________________________________ Commons-l mailing list Commons-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/commons-l

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Gerard Meijssen

7:56 a.m.

Hoi, I had a look at what is published at Flickr and I found it a very interesting collection. The collection as published has its problems. The pictures are relatively small and they are published as jpg, This means that there is not much point in looking for material to restore. All the pictures are labeled with a CC license. This does not make sense because much of the material is clearly in the public domain. All in all, Flickr does a good job in attracting new archives. They provide clear benefits to them because this demonstrates the social relevance of these archives. In the execution they bungle it. Flickr does not allow for a PD label and from my point of view it makes their system broken by design. When we approach archives, the failings of Flickr are the arguments why Commons is the right place to be. Thanks, GerardM 2009/3/19 Geoffrey Plourde <geo.plrd(a)yahoo.com>

The person uploading these has indicated that they were retrieved from a US Government archive. Cursory inspection reveals that many are likely public domain. DK Winter was a museum illustrator in the 50s, which means copyright is dependent upon the museum. The big question I have is whther or not a public domain image can be put under a license requiring attribution? ------------------------------ *From:* Mathias Schindler <mathias.schindler(a)gmail.com> *To:* Wikimedia Commons Discussion List <commons-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 18, 2009 9:40:57 AM *Subject:* Re: [Commons-l] Rare trove of US Army Medical Photos Heads to Flickr 2009/3/18 Geoffrey Plourde <geo.plrd(a)yahoo.com>om>:

I am under the impression that each and every photo he uploads to Flickr

is

a work of the United States government and is in the public domain. By licensing them as CC, I think he has committed a copyright violation or

the

very least, unenforceable restriction.

What makes you think that DK Winter was an government employee? Mathias _______________________________________________ Commons-l mailing list Commons-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/commons-l _______________________________________________ Commons-l mailing list Commons-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/commons-l

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Andrew Gray
Durova
geni
Geoffrey Plourde
Gerard Meijssen
Mathias Schindler