Re: [Wikimedia-asia-chapters] Chapters Meeting 2011

-- Siska Doviana | Pendiri (Co-Founder) | Wikimedia Indonesia Ph. +62 816 484 5052 ~~~~ Dukung upaya kami membebaskan pengetahuan: http://wikimedia.or.id/wiki/Wikimedia_Indonesia:Donasi On Mon, Aug 9, 2010 at 9:08 AM, Josh Lim jamesjoshualim@yahoo.com wrote: > I'd like to draw out a few key differences between Wikimania and the > Wikimedia Conference, just so we have a clearer picture of things: > > *The location of Wikimania is determined by a panel, whereas the location of > the Wikimedia Conference is decided by all the chapters voting. > *Chapters (alongside the Foundation) spend for the chapters conference, > whereas the Foundation is the sole body spending for Wikimania.  Chapter > finances after all are very tenuously tied to their respective geographies: > chapters like WMDE, who are some of the biggest spenders for previous > conferences, have expressed their desire for a Europe-based conference. > > If the European chapters vote to have WMCON 2011 in Europe, then we have to > accept the fact that it will be there.  However, if it be held in Hong Kong > (and I mean if), then we will not hesitate to support it any way we can.  At > any rate, when voting comes, I'll convene the WMPH Board so we know how to > vote, and so we can do so with discretion. > > Regards, > > Josh > > JAMES JOSHUA G. LIM > Block I1, AB Political Science > Class of 2013, Ateneo de Manila University > Quezon City, Metro Manila, Philippines > > President (2010-2011), Wikimedia Philippines > Assistant Vice-President for Sponsorship and Sales (2010-2011), The Assembly > Varsity Member, Ateneo Debate Society > Member, Ateneo Lingua Ars Cultura > > jamesjoshualim@yahoo.com | +63(917)358-2508 > Friendster/Facebook/Twitter: akiestar | Wikimedia: Sky Harbor > http://akira123323.livejournal.com > > > ________________________________ > From: Morgan Chan morgand536@wikimedia.hk > To: Asian Wikimedia Chapters coordination > wikimedia-asia-chapters@lists.wikimedia.org > Sent: Sun, August 8, 2010 5:13:26 PM > Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-asia-chapters] Chapters Meeting 2011 > > Thank you very much for your good summary and support! :-) > > Cheers, > Morgan > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Aug 9, 2010, at 3:01, Ted Chien hsiangtai.chien@gmail.com wrote: > >> I wish to share something when we were bidding for Wikimania Taipei back >> in 2007. >> >> At that time, Ilario also held the same opinion and think Wikimania should >> be held in Euro. And we also been told by some people that we might be too >> optimist. However at the end of the bidding we Taipei team win and we did >> make everyone very enjoy in Wikimania 2007. (You can ask any WMF board / >> stuff members, they keep telling me how they love the time when they were in >> Taipei). And after Wikimania 2007, Wikimania change to different continent >> every year. >> >> The Wikimedia movement is not only a US-based or Euro-based movement. It's >> a global movement that every part of the world can join it. I think that's >> one of the visions of the Wikimedia movement, and I believe it's one of >> reasons why Kal encourages WMHK to hold the Chapters Meeting in 2011, just >> like how some WMF board members encouraged us Taipei to bid for Wikimania >> 2007. >> >> If you ask me, I will vote for WMHK, for sure. >> >> Best Regards, >> Ted Chien >> Secretary >> Wikimedia Taiwan >> -- >> User:m:htchien | zh:htchien >> MSN: htchien@livemail.tw >> Skype: ulead_hsiangtai >> LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/htchien >> Facebook: http://facebook.com/htchien >> Blog: http://htchien.blogspot.com >> >> -- Think different, do smarter, work for joy! >> >> 在 2010/8/8 下午9:43 時， Morgan Chan 寫到： >> >>> Well, I understand that WMDE is almost unbeatable on the budget. >>> >>> But if we can give everyone a great place like Cyberport, great food and >>> great five star hotel rooms, and also fully support by the sponsorship. Then >>> why we don't try Hong Kong? >>> >>> That's why I can't promise anything at the moment, because I did not get >>> anything confirmed from cyberport. But I also can't give up yet, because it >>> could happen. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Morgan >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Aug 8, 2010, at 21:30, Siska Doviana siska.doviana@wikimedia.or.id >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Morgan, >>>> I have to hand it to you for being an optimist. >>>> >>>> For those who doesn't get Illario's email: >>>> >>>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >>>> From: Ilario Valdelli valdelli@gmail.com >>>> Date: Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 12:07 AM >>>> Subject: Re: [Chapters] [Internal-l] Chapters Meeting 2011 >>>> To: chapters@wikimedia.ch >>>> >>>> >>>> On Wed, Aug 4, 2010 at 4:01 AM, Andrew Owens orderinchaos78@gmail.com >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> I may have got that wrong, and Ilario's welcome to correct me. :) >>>>> >>>>> cheers >>>>> Andrew (WMAU) >>>>> >>>> >>>> You have understood my position. Thanks for your support. >>>> >>>> In my language people says: "A buon intenditore, poche parole" and the >>>> correct translation may be: "a word to the wise". >>>> >>>> The concept is very simple. If someone starts a bid stating that a >>>> proposal must be supported by a budget of at least 50,000 Euro and the >>>> presence of a staff, surely it makes no sense to argue, we assign the >>>> chapters meeting to WM DE for the following next three years and there >>>> is no sense to discuss again. I don't think there are other chapters >>>> that have a staff-level of WM DE or an equal large budget. >>>> >>>> If the two parameters are built according to these criteria it would >>>> be a "dummy" bid. >>>> >>>> I cannot say that WM DE has organized bad meetings or they cannot >>>> assure an high level of organization and I cannot judge WM UK because >>>> I have not been in Bristol, but it's incorrect that the choice of >>>> location is a matter restricted to the "usual" two or three chapters >>>> because the requirements are a "little bit" restrictive for the >>>> remaining 95%. >>>> >>>> I cannot judge correct for example to cut out the chapters that have >>>> chosen to be without a staff if these chapters can organize a >>>> voluntary service. In the same way I cannot judge the limit of 50,000 >>>> Euros as a big condition if some chapters can organize a similar >>>> service with 20,000 euros and find alternative solutions related to a >>>> less expensive town. >>>> >>>> A bid organized in this way does not highlight the real weaknesses >>>> related to the location of Berlin, for example, because we don't have >>>> any other option. >>>> >>>> For this reason I would appreciate a bid based by location, for >>>> example, and not one based by chapter because some chapters can >>>> propose a cheaper town, well connected with flights (also from >>>> Australia) and find support (also economical) from other chapters or >>>> from some sponsors and there is no sense to deny any opportunity only >>>> for a limited budget or for a staff not present yet. >>>> >>>> Any bid has a meaning only if it is organized around flexible >>>> requirements and "really" open to the chapters. >>>> >>>> It does not seem correct to me to preclude them the opportunity to >>>> propose a candidature based on a particular "model of chapter" because >>>> there are chapters that have decided to select another model for their >>>> internal policies (for example, many chapters have agreed that the >>>> members of the association cannot be paid), because they have decided >>>> to focus on different forms of organization or other forms of >>>> investment, or because they have taken different choices based on >>>> cultural issues. >>>> >>>> We cannot say that to organize a chapters meeting they must switch to >>>> another "model". >>>> >>>> For this reason we cannot say that they are "poor" chapters but that >>>> they are chapters with a different model. >>>> >>>> Ilario >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Chapters mailing list >>>> Chapters@wikimedia.ch >>>> http://lists.wikimedia.ch/listinfo/chapters >>>> >>>> 2010/8/8 Morgan Chan morgand536@wikimedia.hk: >>>>> Just tell you guys a little secret. >>>>> Actually Kul recommends us to take the bid, and I think he has his >>>>> reason, >>>>> maybe it suits the movement or strategies of Wikimedia, maybe. >>>>> For the air tickets, we will to get sponsor from Cathay Pacific, but >>>>> before >>>>> this, we need to confirm we can get the sponsorship from cyberport and >>>>> we >>>>> sure it will hold in Hong Kong. >>>>> For Thomas, I think I won't keep it in my mind seriously. If his theory >>>>> is >>>>> correct, then we should stop all the non-euro projects because 67% of >>>>> chapters are euro, and WMFoundation should put all the resource in >>>>> euro, and >>>>> they will care about other regions three years later. It doesn't make >>>>> sense, >>>>> right? >>>>> Chapters meeting is not a meeting for chapters. It can also boost a lot >>>>> of >>>>> things, locally, regionally, or even globally. Chapters meeting in Asia >>>>> can >>>>> really put the spotlight on Asia, especially we already have an Asian >>>>> chair >>>>> and Wikimania 2011 in Israel. >>>>> So air ticket is not everything at all. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> Morgan >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> On Aug 8, 2010, at 20:46, Josh Lim jamesjoshualim@yahoo.com wrote: >>>>> >>>>> I'd have to agree with Siska here.  Like what Thomas said in >>>>> chapters-L, >>>>> given that most chapters are in Europe, the Foundation saves more by >>>>> bringing the less numerous Asians, Australians and Americans (North and >>>>> South) to Europe than the other way around. >>>>> >>>>> Josh >>>>> >>>>> JAMES JOSHUA G. LIM >>>>> Block I1, AB Political Science >>>>> Class of 2013, Ateneo de Manila University >>>>> Quezon City, Metro Manila, Philippines >>>>> >>>>> President (2010-2011), Wikimedia Philippines >>>>> Assistant Vice-President for Sponsorship and Sales (2010-2011), The >>>>> Assembly >>>>> Varsity Member, Ateneo Debate Society >>>>> Member, Ateneo Lingua Ars Cultura >>>>> >>>>> jamesjoshualim@yahoo.com | +63(917)358-2508 >>>>> Friendster/Facebook/Twitter: akiestar | Wikimedia: Sky Harbor >>>>> http://akira123323.livejournal.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ________________________________ >>>>> From: Siska Doviana siska.doviana@wikimedia.or.id >>>>> To: Asian Wikimedia Chapters coordination >>>>> wikimedia-asia-chapters@lists.wikimedia.org >>>>> Sent: Sun, August 8, 2010 8:25:05 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-asia-chapters] Chapters Meeting 2011 >>>>> >>>>> Morgan, >>>>> >>>>> As painful as it may sound, the European will let the Asian travel >>>>> twice, rather than them going to Hong Kong for chapter's meeting. >>>>> >>>>> I think Illario's email sounded the most reasonable one. Personal >>>>> view, I don't think even the UK will win the bid for chapter's >>>>> meeting, other European chapter's preferences are leaning toward to >>>>> held in again in Germany for the next 3 years, or perhaps 2, then open >>>>> for bidding. >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Siska Doviana | Pendiri (Co-Founder) | Wikimedia Indonesia >>>>> Ph. +62 816 484 5052 >>>>> ~~~~ >>>>> Dukung upaya kami membebaskan pengetahuan: >>>>> http://wikimedia.or.id/wiki/Wikimedia_Indonesia:Donasi >>>>>