Hello,

I have given a quick look to the bill. It's difficult to draw definite conclusions : the signification of the text greatly depends on the present state of several fields of Philippine legislation (on libel for instance).

I have nevertheless some concerns about the c1 paragraph of the fourth section defining the crime of cybersex : « The willful engagement, maintenance, control, or operation, directly or indirectly, of any lascivious exhibition of sexual organs or sexual activity, with the aid of a computer system, for favor or consideration. » I may be wrong, but the enforcement of this paragraph could potentially prevent the diffusion of explicit encyclopedic photographies and illustrations on sexual topics.

Pierre-Carl Langlais aka Alexander Doria

Hi Roman,

I really appreciate your sharing this with us. Is it possible you could give a brief summary to give us a gist of your concerns about the bill? Fully understand if you may be to busy to do that.

Thanks,

Geoff

On Thu, Sep 20, 2012 at 6:07 PM, Roman Bustria Jr. bustrias@gmail.com wrote: Hello again.

Here is a clearer version.

http://www.gov.ph/2012/09/12/republic-act-no-10175/

Butch WMPH

On Sun, Sep 16, 2012 at 8:47 AM, Roman Bustria Jr. bustrias@gmail.com wrote: My Fellow Wikimedians,

We would like to ask your feedback on the new law signed by our President about Cybercrime whether it had a chilling effect on our local Wikipedia editors.

Official text is available on this link:

http://www.gov.ph/downloads/2012/09sep/20120912-RA-10175-BSA.pdf

Thank you.

Roman "Butch" Bustria Jr. Vice President Wikimedia Philippines

The future of technology is defined by change, but the destiny of an organization is defined by commitment.

---

The information contained in this message is privileged and intended only for the recipients named. If the reader is not a representative of the intended recipient, any review, dissemination or copying of this message or the information it contains is prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender, and delete the original message and attachments.

Please consider the environment before printing this email.

---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Seb35 seb35wikipedia@gmail.com Date: Sun, Sep 16, 2012 at 12:23 AM Subject: Re: [Internal-l] CPA : Cybercrime Prevention Act of 2012 - Philippines To: "Local Chapters, board and officers coordination (closed subscription)" internal-l@lists.wikimedia.org

I catch the occasion to mention the open list advocacy_advisors@lists.wikimedia.org dedicated to this type of news, associated with the Meta page https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Legal_and_Community_Advocacy

~ Seb35 [^_^]

Le Sat, 15 Sep 2012 18:10:00 +0200, Amir E. Aharoni <amir.aharoni@mail.huji.ac.il

...

a écrit:

Is there a reason to ask about this on the internal mailing list? You can get useful feedback from the open list, too.

-- Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי http://aharoni.wordpress.com ‪“We're living in pieces, I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬

---

Internal-l mailing list Internal-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/internal-l

---

Internal-l mailing list Internal-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/internal-l

--

--

---

Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors

-- Geoff Brigham General Counsel Wikimedia Foundation 149 New Montgomery Street San Francisco, CA 94105 +1 (415) 839-6885 ext. 6750 gbrigham@wikimedia.org

California Registered In-House Counsel

This message might have confidential or legally privileged information in it. If you have received this message by accident, please delete it and let us know about the mistake. For legal reasons, I may only serve as an attorney for the Wikimedia Foundation. This means I may not give legal advice to or serve as a lawyer for community members, volunteers, or staff members in their personal capacity.

---

Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors

Hi all.

Wikimedia does ask for donations. I am not sure whether that could be construed as asking "for favor or consideration". How would it be for a pornographic website that relies on voluntary donations? That is the worst-case comparison someone could draw.

On Commons, the most frequently viewed files certainly have been, almost without exception, sexual media:

http://stats.grok.se/commons.m/top

On the other hand, compared to all the other content on Commons (and also, I suspect, the total number of page views), these files are a very small minority.

I will mention two of my longstanding gripes here:

1. None of the Wikimedia projects comply with 18 USC 2257 age record requirements.

http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikilegal/Age_Record_Requirement (also see talk page).

2. Given that Wikimedia projects contain some pretty extreme materials, fundraiser materials should not contain testimonials (stories) stating or implying that Wikimedia projects are child-safe.

http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Stories2/en

Andreas

On Fri, Sep 21, 2012 at 11:33 PM, Geoff Brigham gbrigham@wikimedia.orgwrote:

Interesting. I saw that as a type of anti-prostitution provision since it requires "for favor or consideration".

On Fri, Sep 21, 2012 at 3:15 PM, Pierre-Carl Langlais < pierre-carl.langlais@orange.fr> wrote:

...

Hello,

I have given a quick look to the bill. It's difficult to draw definite conclusions : the signification of the text greatly depends on the present state of several fields of Philippine legislation (on libel for instance).

I have nevertheless some concerns about the c1 paragraph of the fourth section defining the crime of cybersex : « The willful engagement, maintenance, control, or operation, directly or indirectly, of any lascivious exhibition of sexual organs or sexual activity, with the aid of a computer system, for favor or consideration. » I may be wrong, but the enforcement of this paragraph could potentially prevent the diffusion of explicit encyclopedic photographies and illustrations on sexual topics.

Pierre-Carl Langlais aka Alexander Doria

Hi Roman,

I really appreciate your sharing this with us. Is it possible you could give a brief summary to give us a gist of your concerns about the bill? Fully understand if you may be to busy to do that.

Thanks,

Geoff

On Thu, Sep 20, 2012 at 6:07 PM, Roman Bustria Jr. bustrias@gmail.comwrote:

...

Hello again.

Here is a clearer version.

http://www.gov.ph/2012/09/12/republic-act-no-10175/

Butch WMPH

On Sun, Sep 16, 2012 at 8:47 AM, Roman Bustria Jr. bustrias@gmail.comwrote:

...

My Fellow Wikimedians,

We would like to ask your feedback on the new law signed by our President about Cybercrime whether it had a chilling effect on our local Wikipedia editors.

Official text is available on this link:

http://www.gov.ph/downloads/2012/09sep/20120912-RA-10175-BSA.pdf

Thank you.

Roman "Butch" Bustria Jr. Vice President Wikimedia Philippines

*The future of technology is defined by change, but the destiny of an organization is defined by commitment.*

---

The information contained in this message is privileged and intended only for the recipients named. If the reader is not a representative of the intended recipient, any review, dissemination or copying of this message or the information it contains is prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender, and delete the original message and attachments.

Please consider the environment before printing this email.

---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Seb35 seb35wikipedia@gmail.com Date: Sun, Sep 16, 2012 at 12:23 AM Subject: Re: [Internal-l] CPA : Cybercrime Prevention Act of 2012 - Philippines To: "Local Chapters, board and officers coordination (closed subscription)" internal-l@lists.wikimedia.org

I catch the occasion to mention the open list advocacy_advisors@lists.* *wikimedia.org advocacy_advisors@lists.wikimedia.org dedicated to this type of news, associated with the Meta page https://meta.wikimedia.org/**wiki/Legal_and_Community_**Advocacyhttps://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Legal_and_Community_Advocacy

~ Seb35 [^_^]

Le Sat, 15 Sep 2012 18:10:00 +0200, Amir E. Aharoni < amir.aharoni@mail.huji.ac.il> a écrit:

Is there a reason to ask about this on the internal mailing list? You

...

can get useful feedback from the open list, too.

-- Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי http://aharoni.wordpress.com ‪“We're living in pieces, I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬

______________________________**_________________ Internal-l mailing list Internal-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/**mailman/listinfo/internal-lhttps://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/internal-l

______________________________**_________________ Internal-l mailing list Internal-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/**mailman/listinfo/internal-lhttps://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/internal-l

--

--

---

Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors

-- Geoff Brigham General Counsel Wikimedia Foundation 149 New Montgomery Street San Francisco, CA 94105 +1 (415) 839-6885 ext. 6750 gbrigham@wikimedia.org

*California Registered In-House Counsel*

*This message might have confidential or legally privileged information in it. If you have received this message by accident, please delete it and let us know about the mistake. For legal reasons, I may only serve as an attorney for the Wikimedia Foundation. This means I may not give legal advice to or serve as a lawyer for community members, volunteers, or staff members in their personal capacity.*

---

Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors

---

Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors

-- Geoff Brigham General Counsel Wikimedia Foundation 149 New Montgomery Street San Francisco, CA 94105 +1 (415) 839-6885 ext. 6750 gbrigham@wikimedia.org

*California Registered In-House Counsel*

*This message might have confidential or legally privileged information in it. If you have received this message by accident, please delete it and let us know about the mistake. For legal reasons, I may only serve as an attorney for the Wikimedia Foundation. This means I may not give legal advice to or serve as a lawyer for community members, volunteers, or staff members in their personal capacity.*

---

Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors

Hello,

What does the others has to say?

Our community is supporting the move for a blackout in EN (Philippines only), TL, and BCL Wikipedias anytime this month as the new law takes effect tomorrow, October 3.

ブストリア · ロマン二世 Roman "Butch" Bustria Jr.

*The future of technology is defined by change, but the destiny of an organization is defined by commitment.*

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information contained in this message is privileged and intended only for the recipients named. If the reader is not a representative of the intended recipient, any review, dissemination or copying of this message or the information it contains is prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender, and delete the original message and attachments.

Please consider the environment before printing this email.

On Sun, Sep 23, 2012 at 10:43 AM, Roman Bustria Jr. bustrias@gmail.comwrote:

Hello,

I am now concern that if an editor posted something that is not favorable to a known personality, even its supported by facts and sources, that known personality will just file a complaint over the Department of Justice to block access to the said article. Even the act is just *Prima facie.*

http://www.interaksyon.com/infotech/takedown-clause-in-cybercrime-law-very-d...

http://www.interaksyon.com/infotech/new-cybercrime-law-could-lead-to-warrant...

http://www.interaksyon.com/article/43480/media-watchdog-anti-cybercrime-law-...

Roman Bustria Jr. WMPH

On Sun, Sep 23, 2012 at 1:11 AM, Andreas Kolbe jayen466@gmail.com wrote:

...

Hi all.

Wikimedia does ask for donations. I am not sure whether that could be construed as asking "for favor or consideration". How would it be for a pornographic website that relies on voluntary donations? That is the worst-case comparison someone could draw.

On Commons, the most frequently viewed files certainly have been, almost without exception, sexual media:

http://stats.grok.se/commons.m/top

On the other hand, compared to all the other content on Commons (and also, I suspect, the total number of page views), these files are a very small minority.

I will mention two of my longstanding gripes here:

1. None of the Wikimedia projects comply with 18 USC 2257 age record

requirements.

http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikilegal/Age_Record_Requirement (also see talk page).

2. Given that Wikimedia projects contain some pretty extreme materials,

fundraiser materials should not contain testimonials (stories) stating or implying that Wikimedia projects are child-safe.

http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Stories2/en

Andreas

On Fri, Sep 21, 2012 at 11:33 PM, Geoff Brigham gbrigham@wikimedia.orgwrote:

...

Interesting. I saw that as a type of anti-prostitution provision since it requires "for favor or consideration".

On Fri, Sep 21, 2012 at 3:15 PM, Pierre-Carl Langlais < pierre-carl.langlais@orange.fr> wrote:

...

Hello,

I have given a quick look to the bill. It's difficult to draw definite conclusions : the signification of the text greatly depends on the present state of several fields of Philippine legislation (on libel for instance).

I have nevertheless some concerns about the c1 paragraph of the fourth section defining the crime of cybersex : « The willful engagement, maintenance, control, or operation, directly or indirectly, of any lascivious exhibition of sexual organs or sexual activity, with the aid of a computer system, for favor or consideration. » I may be wrong, but the enforcement of this paragraph could potentially prevent the diffusion of explicit encyclopedic photographies and illustrations on sexual topics.

Pierre-Carl Langlais aka Alexander Doria

Hi Roman,

I really appreciate your sharing this with us. Is it possible you could give a brief summary to give us a gist of your concerns about the bill? Fully understand if you may be to busy to do that.

Thanks,

Geoff

On Thu, Sep 20, 2012 at 6:07 PM, Roman Bustria Jr. bustrias@gmail.comwrote:

...

Hello again.

Here is a clearer version.

http://www.gov.ph/2012/09/12/republic-act-no-10175/

Butch WMPH

On Sun, Sep 16, 2012 at 8:47 AM, Roman Bustria Jr. <bustrias@gmail.com

...

wrote:

...

My Fellow Wikimedians,

We would like to ask your feedback on the new law signed by our President about Cybercrime whether it had a chilling effect on our local Wikipedia editors.

Official text is available on this link:

http://www.gov.ph/downloads/2012/09sep/20120912-RA-10175-BSA.pdf

Thank you.

Roman "Butch" Bustria Jr. Vice President Wikimedia Philippines

*The future of technology is defined by change, but the destiny of an organization is defined by commitment.*

---

The information contained in this message is privileged and intended only for the recipients named. If the reader is not a representative of the intended recipient, any review, dissemination or copying of this message or the information it contains is prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender, and delete the original message and attachments.

Please consider the environment before printing this email.

---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Seb35 seb35wikipedia@gmail.com Date: Sun, Sep 16, 2012 at 12:23 AM Subject: Re: [Internal-l] CPA : Cybercrime Prevention Act of 2012 - Philippines To: "Local Chapters, board and officers coordination (closed subscription)" internal-l@lists.wikimedia.org

I catch the occasion to mention the open list advocacy_advisors@lists.**wikimedia.orgadvocacy_advisors@lists.wikimedia.orgdedicated to this type of news, associated with the Meta page https://meta.wikimedia.org/**wiki/Legal_and_Community_**Advocacyhttps://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Legal_and_Community_Advocacy

~ Seb35 [^_^]

Le Sat, 15 Sep 2012 18:10:00 +0200, Amir E. Aharoni < amir.aharoni@mail.huji.ac.il> a écrit:

Is there a reason to ask about this on the internal mailing list? > You > can get useful feedback from the open list, too. > > -- > Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי > http://aharoni.wordpress.com > ‪“We're living in pieces, > I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬ > > ______________________________**_________________ > Internal-l mailing list > Internal-l@lists.wikimedia.org > https://lists.wikimedia.org/**mailman/listinfo/internal-lhttps://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/internal-l >

______________________________**_________________ Internal-l mailing list Internal-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/**mailman/listinfo/internal-lhttps://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/internal-l

--

--

---

Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors

-- Geoff Brigham General Counsel Wikimedia Foundation 149 New Montgomery Street San Francisco, CA 94105 +1 (415) 839-6885 ext. 6750 gbrigham@wikimedia.org

*California Registered In-House Counsel*

*This message might have confidential or legally privileged information in it. If you have received this message by accident, please delete it and let us know about the mistake. For legal reasons, I may only serve as an attorney for the Wikimedia Foundation. This means I may not give legal advice to or serve as a lawyer for community members, volunteers, or staff members in their personal capacity.*

---

Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors

---

Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors

-- Geoff Brigham General Counsel Wikimedia Foundation 149 New Montgomery Street San Francisco, CA 94105 +1 (415) 839-6885 ext. 6750 gbrigham@wikimedia.org

*California Registered In-House Counsel*

*This message might have confidential or legally privileged information in it. If you have received this message by accident, please delete it and let us know about the mistake. For legal reasons, I may only serve as an attorney for the Wikimedia Foundation. This means I may not give legal advice to or serve as a lawyer for community members, volunteers, or staff members in their personal capacity.*

---

Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors

---

Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors

--

ブストリア · ロマン二世 Roman "Butch" Bustria Jr.

*The future of technology is defined by change, but the destiny of an organization is defined by commitment.*

---

The information contained in this message is privileged and intended only for the recipients named. If the reader is not a representative of the intended recipient, any review, dissemination or copying of this message or the information it contains is prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender, and delete the original message and attachments.

Please consider the environment before printing this email.