(Moving to the libraries list, which is more appropriate than Wikipedia-l or third party proprietary lists. Please subscribe at https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries.)
Nice encouragement, but there are about 14k known "libraries" in Italy, of which over 2500 university libraries (although most of those don't have even one librarian)... https://anagrafe.iccu.sbn.it/
Is there some international standard to draw a line somewhere? If not, I suppose Italian contributors will keep working on Wikidata instead, where such information is easier to manage.
Federico
Frederick Noronha, 06/04/19 12:22:
Dear all: Please help to build list of libraries in your part of the world.
Some links https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries
Indian Wikipedians, this could do with some love: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_India
This seems impressive to me (but I don't know how many are missing): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_Australia
And here's a listing from Nigeria https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_Nigeria
Fredericknoronha
Thanks for that, Nemo. Useful pointers...
Just one query: if there is a tiny library in some village somewhere, would we assume that someone, someday might not be interested in finding out information about it too?
FN
On Sat, 6 Apr 2019 at 15:24, Federico Leva (Nemo) nemowiki@gmail.com wrote:
(Moving to the libraries list, which is more appropriate than Wikipedia-l or third party proprietary lists. Please subscribe at https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries.)
Nice encouragement, but there are about 14k known "libraries" in Italy, of which over 2500 university libraries (although most of those don't have even one librarian)... https://anagrafe.iccu.sbn.it/
Is there some international standard to draw a line somewhere? If not, I suppose Italian contributors will keep working on Wikidata instead, where such information is easier to manage.
Federico
Frederick Noronha, 06/04/19 12:22:
Dear all: Please help to build list of libraries in your part of the
world.
Some links https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries
Indian Wikipedians, this could do with some love: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_India
This seems impressive to me (but I don't know how many are missing): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_Australia
And here's a listing from Nigeria https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_Nigeria
Fredericknoronha
Frederick Noronha, 06/04/19 13:05:
Just one query: if there is a tiny library in some village somewhere, would we assume that someone, someday might not be interested in finding out information about it too?
No. We might just be unable to write anything meaningful about it on Wikipedia with third party reliable sources. For Italy, basic coordinates and data can be provided by the official database I linked either on its website or via Wikidata.
Federico
I think it would always be internationally interesting to be able to access lending data for libraries in any locale. So it may be useful if we could have some property on Wikidata indicating whether or not the library keeps lending records, and if so, how far back they go. For this reason I can also imagine it may be useful to create items for defunct libraries, if the lending archives still exist.
On Tue, Apr 16, 2019 at 4:37 PM Frederick Noronha < fredericknoronha@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for that, Nemo. Useful pointers...
Just one query: if there is a tiny library in some village somewhere, would we assume that someone, someday might not be interested in finding out information about it too?
FN
On Sat, 6 Apr 2019 at 15:24, Federico Leva (Nemo) nemowiki@gmail.com wrote:
(Moving to the libraries list, which is more appropriate than Wikipedia-l or third party proprietary lists. Please subscribe at https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries.)
Nice encouragement, but there are about 14k known "libraries" in Italy, of which over 2500 university libraries (although most of those don't have even one librarian)... https://anagrafe.iccu.sbn.it/
Is there some international standard to draw a line somewhere? If not, I suppose Italian contributors will keep working on Wikidata instead, where such information is easier to manage.
Federico
Frederick Noronha, 06/04/19 12:22:
Dear all: Please help to build list of libraries in your part of the
world.
Some links https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries
Indian Wikipedians, this could do with some love: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_India
This seems impressive to me (but I don't know how many are missing): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_Australia
And here's a listing from Nigeria https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_Nigeria
Fredericknoronha
Libraries mailing list Libraries@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries
Jane Darnell, 16/04/19 18:26:
access lending data for libraries in any locale. So it may be useful if we could have some property on Wikidata indicating whether or not the library keeps lending records, and if so, how far back they go.
Do you mean data retention policies for lending records? What detailed information is recorded about each lending, what aggregation or purging happens and when?
Federico
Jane: do you mean circulation numbers? Lending records are typically protected and an important part of at least American librarianship has been the protection of intellectual freedom by refusing to share that information at all costs (and its held up in American courts).
Cheers,
Alex
On Tue, Apr 16, 2019 at 11:30 AM Federico Leva (Nemo) nemowiki@gmail.com wrote:
Jane Darnell, 16/04/19 18:26:
access lending data for libraries in any locale. So it may be useful if we could have some property on Wikidata indicating whether or not the library keeps lending records, and if so, how far back they go.
Do you mean data retention policies for lending records? What detailed information is recorded about each lending, what aggregation or purging happens and when?
Federico
Libraries mailing list Libraries@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries
Although "lending records" are "protected" it isn't clear how well they are. Libraries, especially those with minimal or no technical staff, are probably not the most diligent in systems security. When I was doing privacy audits on US public libraries I found that many kept the most recent circulation record (even after the item had been checked in) until the next circulation - which could be indefinitely. The reasoning was that if they found a problem with the item (damage, for example) they would be able to find and charge the last patron to have the book out. This means that nearly every book in the library has an actual patron record associated with it at all times, which is an obvious security risk since library systems may not themselves be secure. (I wasn't able to determine if the records are kept "in the clear" but I would not be surprised if they were.)
Remember that "protected" is a relative status, not absolute, and that legal protection = hacker proof.
kc
On 4/16/19 5:45 PM, Alex Stinson wrote:
Jane: do you mean circulation numbers? Lending records are typically protected and an important part of at least American librarianship has been the protection of intellectual freedom by refusing to share that information at all costs (and its held up in American courts).
Cheers,
Alex
On Tue, Apr 16, 2019 at 11:30 AM Federico Leva (Nemo) <nemowiki@gmail.com mailto:nemowiki@gmail.com> wrote:
Jane Darnell, 16/04/19 18:26: > access lending data for libraries in any locale. So it may be useful if > we could have some property on Wikidata indicating whether or not the > library keeps lending records, and if so, how far back they go. Do you mean data retention policies for lending records? What detailed information is recorded about each lending, what aggregation or purging happens and when? Federico _______________________________________________ Libraries mailing list Libraries@lists.wikimedia.org <mailto:Libraries@lists.wikimedia.org> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries-- Alex Stinson Senior Program Strategist Wikimedia Foundation Twitter:@glamwiki/@sadads
Learn more about how the communities behind Wikipedia, Wikidata and other Wikimedia projects partner with cultural heritage organizations: https://outreach.wikimedia.org/wiki/GLAM
Libraries mailing list Libraries@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries
Interesting! This must be a modern library data thing. No, I was referring to the checkin/checkout data per item. Locally we have a library that has kept records back to the early 19th-century. So you can browse the "bestseller lists" of yore.
On Tue, Apr 16, 2019 at 5:55 PM Karen Coyle kcoyle@kcoyle.net wrote:
Although "lending records" are "protected" it isn't clear how well they are. Libraries, especially those with minimal or no technical staff, are probably not the most diligent in systems security. When I was doing privacy audits on US public libraries I found that many kept the most recent circulation record (even after the item had been checked in) until the next circulation - which could be indefinitely. The reasoning was that if they found a problem with the item (damage, for example) they would be able to find and charge the last patron to have the book out. This means that nearly every book in the library has an actual patron record associated with it at all times, which is an obvious security risk since library systems may not themselves be secure. (I wasn't able to determine if the records are kept "in the clear" but I would not be surprised if they were.)
Remember that "protected" is a relative status, not absolute, and that legal protection = hacker proof.
kc
On 4/16/19 5:45 PM, Alex Stinson wrote:
Jane: do you mean circulation numbers? Lending records are typically protected and an important part of at least American librarianship has been the protection of intellectual freedom by refusing to share that information at all costs (and its held up in American courts).
Cheers,
Alex
On Tue, Apr 16, 2019 at 11:30 AM Federico Leva (Nemo) <nemowiki@gmail.com mailto:nemowiki@gmail.com> wrote:
Jane Darnell, 16/04/19 18:26: > access lending data for libraries in any locale. So it may be useful if > we could have some property on Wikidata indicating whether or notthe
> library keeps lending records, and if so, how far back they go. Do you mean data retention policies for lending records? Whatdetailed
information is recorded about each lending, what aggregation orpurging
happens and when? Federico _______________________________________________ Libraries mailing list Libraries@lists.wikimedia.org <mailto:Libraries@lists.wikimedia.org> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries-- Alex Stinson Senior Program Strategist Wikimedia Foundation Twitter:@glamwiki/@sadads
Learn more about how the communities behind Wikipedia, Wikidata and other Wikimedia projects partner with cultural heritage organizations: https://outreach.wikimedia.org/wiki/GLAM
Libraries mailing list Libraries@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries
-- Karen Coyle kcoyle@kcoyle.net http://kcoyle.net skype: kcoylenet
Libraries mailing list Libraries@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries
Hi!
Maybe this could help:
Best, -- David http://www.nomono.co/david
El 6/04/2019, a las 12:54 p.m., Federico Leva (Nemo) nemowiki@gmail.com escribió:
(Moving to the libraries list, which is more appropriate than Wikipedia-l or third party proprietary lists. Please subscribe at https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries.)
Nice encouragement, but there are about 14k known "libraries" in Italy, of which over 2500 university libraries (although most of those don't have even one librarian)... https://anagrafe.iccu.sbn.it/
Is there some international standard to draw a line somewhere? If not, I suppose Italian contributors will keep working on Wikidata instead, where such information is easier to manage.
Federico
Frederick Noronha, 06/04/19 12:22:
Dear all: Please help to build list of libraries in your part of the world. Some links https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries Indian Wikipedians, this could do with some love: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_India This seems impressive to me (but I don't know how many are missing): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_Australia And here's a listing from Nigeria https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_Nigeria Fredericknoronha
Libraries mailing list Libraries@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries
As part of 1Lib1Ref 2018, the State Library of Queensland set themselves the task of adding mention of every public library in Queensland (6th largest state in the world) into the relevant town/suburb/district article. All 200 and something of them are now all listed. It was not a problem to find reliable citations as there is an annual report compiled for the Government (available online), plus information on websites from their relevant local government authority (who operate the public libraries).
As an example, our smallest public library in Queensland is in McKinlay (population 178). Enjoy the exterior and interior photos of the library!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McKinlay,_Queensland
Kerry
From: Libraries [mailto:libraries-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of David Ramírez-Ordóñez Sent: Saturday, 6 April 2019 8:23 PM To: Wikimedia & Libraries libraries@lists.wikimedia.org Cc: Frederick Noronha fredericknoronha@gmail.com Subject: Re: [libraries] [Wikipedia-l] List of Libraries...
Hi!
Maybe this could help:
Best, --
David
El 6/04/2019, a las 12:54 p.m., Federico Leva (Nemo) <nemowiki@gmail.com mailto:nemowiki@gmail.com > escribió:
(Moving to the libraries list, which is more appropriate than Wikipedia-l or third party proprietary lists. Please subscribe at https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries.)
Nice encouragement, but there are about 14k known "libraries" in Italy, of which over 2500 university libraries (although most of those don't have even one librarian)... https://anagrafe.iccu.sbn.it/
Is there some international standard to draw a line somewhere? If not, I suppose Italian contributors will keep working on Wikidata instead, where such information is easier to manage.
Federico
Frederick Noronha, 06/04/19 12:22:
Dear all: Please help to build list of libraries in your part of the world.
Some links
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries
Indian Wikipedians, this could do with some love:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_India
This seems impressive to me (but I don't know how many are missing):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_Australia
And here's a listing from Nigeria
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_Nigeria
Fredericknoronha
_______________________________________________ Libraries mailing list Libraries@lists.wikimedia.org mailto:Libraries@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries
Wonderful! Thanks for sharing. Great pictures and a terrific initiative
On Sun, Apr 7, 2019 at 9:01 AM Kerry Raymond kerry.raymond@gmail.com wrote:
As part of 1Lib1Ref 2018, the State Library of Queensland set themselves the task of adding mention of every public library in Queensland (6th largest state in the world) into the relevant town/suburb/district article. All 200 and something of them are now all listed. It was not a problem to find reliable citations as there is an annual report compiled for the Government (available online), plus information on websites from their relevant local government authority (who operate the public libraries).
As an example, our smallest public library in Queensland is in McKinlay (population 178). Enjoy the exterior and interior photos of the library!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McKinlay,_Queensland
Kerry
*From:* Libraries [mailto:libraries-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org] *On Behalf Of *David Ramírez-Ordóñez *Sent:* Saturday, 6 April 2019 8:23 PM *To:* Wikimedia & Libraries libraries@lists.wikimedia.org *Cc:* Frederick Noronha fredericknoronha@gmail.com *Subject:* Re: [libraries] [Wikipedia-l] List of Libraries...
Hi!
Maybe this could help:
Best,
David
El 6/04/2019, a las 12:54 p.m., Federico Leva (Nemo) nemowiki@gmail.com escribió:
(Moving to the libraries list, which is more appropriate than Wikipedia-l or third party proprietary lists. Please subscribe at < https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries%3E.)
Nice encouragement, but there are about 14k known "libraries" in Italy, of which over 2500 university libraries (although most of those don't have even one librarian)... https://anagrafe.iccu.sbn.it/
Is there some international standard to draw a line somewhere? If not, I suppose Italian contributors will keep working on Wikidata instead, where such information is easier to manage.
Federico
Frederick Noronha, 06/04/19 12:22:
Dear all: Please help to build list of libraries in your part of the world.
Some links
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries
Indian Wikipedians, this could do with some love:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_India
This seems impressive to me (but I don't know how many are missing):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_Australia
And here's a listing from Nigeria
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libraries_in_Nigeria
Fredericknoronha
Libraries mailing list Libraries@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries
Libraries mailing list Libraries@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/libraries
Kerry Raymond, 07/04/19 10:01:
As part of 1Lib1Ref 2018, the State Library of Queensland set themselves the task of adding mention of every public library in Queensland (6^th largest state in the world) into the relevant town/suburb/district article.
Indeed, this is easier to achieve and also what the Italian librarians are mostly doing now (although not so systematically). It's IMHO also better for publicity purposes, because the articles about municipalities and parent entities have much more traffic, and you're more likely to catch the attention of someone who wasn't actively looking for information about the library.
With an article named after the library, you're mostly preaching to the converted (in the best case).
Federico
You're right on that! FN
We never planned to create articles for individual public libraries in Queensland. We didn't think that they would pass GNG. While they are an important piece of civic amenity, their functions are broadly similar (lend books, a reference collection, local studies collection, provide computers and internet access, host children's story time, etc) and hence a bit too "run of the mill". I would imagine this would be true for public libraries generally. However, there are already a few libraries with their own article, e.g. because the building they occupy was heritage-listed at state level (passes notability for a heritage place) or passed GNG for other reasons.
Apart from noting their existence and location in their town/suburb/district article, we also added any information we had about their opening date (usually in the history section) or major relocations or redevelopments. But generally we simply didn’t have that information; even the opening of libraries seems very poorly documented. It seems you get a lot more media coverage if you try to close a public library than if you open one.
Possibly we should create an overarching article e.g. Libraries in Queensland which might capture the overall architecture of the library system in Queensland and the kinds of services provided and how they are provided.
Kerry
-----Original Message----- From: Federico Leva (Nemo) [mailto:nemowiki@gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, 7 April 2019 9:26 PM To: kerry.raymond@gmail.com; Wikimedia & Libraries libraries@lists.wikimedia.org Cc: 'Frederick Noronha' fredericknoronha@gmail.com Subject: Re: [libraries] [Wikipedia-l] List of Libraries...
Kerry Raymond, 07/04/19 10:01:
As part of 1Lib1Ref 2018, the State Library of Queensland set themselves the task of adding mention of every public library in Queensland (6^th largest state in the world) into the relevant town/suburb/district article.
Indeed, this is easier to achieve and also what the Italian librarians are mostly doing now (although not so systematically). It's IMHO also better for publicity purposes, because the articles about municipalities and parent entities have much more traffic, and you're more likely to catch the attention of someone who wasn't actively looking for information about the library.
With an article named after the library, you're mostly preaching to the converted (in the best case).
Federico