Hi,
I have a little idea that could be really helpful for Wikipedians if it could be implemented. Google has scanned in a vast collection of books http://www.google.com/googlebooks/library/. Some of these scanned pages can be read online via Google Books, and serves an important resource for Wikipedians confirming the verifiability of text added to Wikipedia. However, many of the scanned pages can *not* be read: in some cases only an arbitrary selection of pages in a given book can be read, which may not be the ones need; in other cases, pages can not be read at all or they can only be searched in the severely limited "Snippet View".
Now, there are good reasons why this is the case. The books copyrighted, and the rightsholders do not want to give their most important goods away for free to anyone on the internet. However, given Google's support for Wikipedia, and for the open dissemination of knowledge, could Wikipedia Library perhaps approach Google and request a much more limited arrangement, like the ones it has with various journals?
Full access to all books in the Google Books Library Project would be utopic. But even a limited deal where a short range of pages can be requested for each book would be extremely helpful, because page numbers are specified countless references on Wikipedia via the {{cite book}} template - we just do not have a way to easily get those pages. Yet.
Thank you, Anders Feder
Hi Anders,
Thanks for you suggestion. I can assure you that [increased] Google Books access has been our dream from the start. It's very complicated because of the contentious legal situation that surrounded the massive scanning and limited sharing Google has been doing. Because of that, we haven't prioritized increased access, however we haven't given up on the possibility of it one day happening. One thing that would be helpful is a personal contact with someone at Google who works on the Books program. If you know of any Google-connected Wikipedians, please put us in touch.
Jake Orlowitz Lead, The Wikipedia Library User:Ocaasi
On Tue, May 19, 2015 at 6:31 AM Anders Feder anders.feder.83@gmail.com wrote:
Hi,
I have a little idea that could be really helpful for Wikipedians if it could be implemented. Google has scanned in a vast collection of books http://www.google.com/googlebooks/library/. Some of these scanned pages can be read online via Google Books, and serves an important resource for Wikipedians confirming the verifiability of text added to Wikipedia. However, many of the scanned pages can *not* be read: in some cases only an arbitrary selection of pages in a given book can be read, which may not be the ones need; in other cases, pages can not be read at all or they can only be searched in the severely limited "Snippet View".
Now, there are good reasons why this is the case. The books copyrighted, and the rightsholders do not want to give their most important goods away for free to anyone on the internet. However, given Google's support for Wikipedia, and for the open dissemination of knowledge, could Wikipedia Library perhaps approach Google and request a much more limited arrangement, like the ones it has with various journals?
Full access to all books in the Google Books Library Project would be utopic. But even a limited deal where a short range of pages can be requested for each book would be extremely helpful, because page numbers are specified countless references on Wikipedia via the {{cite book}} template - we just do not have a way to easily get those pages. Yet.
Thank you, Anders Feder _______________________________________________ Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Hi Anders and Jake,
I was in a conversation with someone recently, who recommended that we talk to Haithi Trust about using their platform (because they have a little more leeway on how they give permission to use of their digital items). I am wondering who we should be reaching out to in their community (or if we should shoot for institutional partnership through one of the university partners http://www.hathitrust.org/community). I haven't followed up on it, because I didn't have a concrete proposal in mind: but its definitely something to look into during the next few months (something along the lines of Wikipedia Visiting Scholars).
It looks like their standard partnership aggreement requires institutional sign in via Shibboleth (http://www.hathitrust.org/eligibility_agreements) which is a feature that we have talked about a little, but haven't made progress on actualizing it.
Cheers,
Alex
On Tue, May 19, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jake Orlowitz jorlowitz@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Anders,
Thanks for you suggestion. I can assure you that [increased] Google Books access has been our dream from the start. It's very complicated because of the contentious legal situation that surrounded the massive scanning and limited sharing Google has been doing. Because of that, we haven't prioritized increased access, however we haven't given up on the possibility of it one day happening. One thing that would be helpful is a personal contact with someone at Google who works on the Books program. If you know of any Google-connected Wikipedians, please put us in touch.
Jake Orlowitz Lead, The Wikipedia Library User:Ocaasi
On Tue, May 19, 2015 at 6:31 AM Anders Feder anders.feder.83@gmail.com wrote:
Hi,
I have a little idea that could be really helpful for Wikipedians if it could be implemented. Google has scanned in a vast collection of books http://www.google.com/googlebooks/library/. Some of these scanned pages can be read online via Google Books, and serves an important resource for Wikipedians confirming the verifiability of text added to Wikipedia. However, many of the scanned pages can *not* be read: in some cases only an arbitrary selection of pages in a given book can be read, which may not be the ones need; in other cases, pages can not be read at all or they can only be searched in the severely limited "Snippet View".
Now, there are good reasons why this is the case. The books copyrighted, and the rightsholders do not want to give their most important goods away for free to anyone on the internet. However, given Google's support for Wikipedia, and for the open dissemination of knowledge, could Wikipedia Library perhaps approach Google and request a much more limited arrangement, like the ones it has with various journals?
Full access to all books in the Google Books Library Project would be utopic. But even a limited deal where a short range of pages can be requested for each book would be extremely helpful, because page numbers are specified countless references on Wikipedia via the {{cite book}} template - we just do not have a way to easily get those pages. Yet.
Thank you, Anders Feder _______________________________________________ Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Jake in a separate email I just put you in touch with Robert McDonald from the HathiTrust research center who may be able to carry the conversation forward.
And I’d be remiss in not mentioning that libraries hold these books, and you too can see the books – if not online than in person. You can start by looking in WorldCat to see if the book is widely held. Many public libraries will do an interlibrary loan request for you – so you can get the book. You could even ask the library if it’s possible for them to acquire the book. Libraries are allied with Wikipedia – we want to make closed resources open and that’s why libraries have books – so that YOU can get them when you need them.
Merrilee Proffitt, Senior Program Officer OCLC Research
From: wikipedia-library-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org [mailto:wikipedia-library-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of Alex Stinson Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2015 9:48 AM To: Mailing list for the Wikipedia Library project Subject: Re: [Wikipedia Library] Google Books
Hi Anders and Jake,
I was in a conversation with someone recently, who recommended that we talk to Haithi Trust about using their platform (because they have a little more leeway on how they give permission to use of their digital items). I am wondering who we should be reaching out to in their community (or if we should shoot for institutional partnership through one of the university partners http://www.hathitrust.org/community). I haven't followed up on it, because I didn't have a concrete proposal in mind: but its definitely something to look into during the next few months (something along the lines of Wikipedia Visiting Scholars).
It looks like their standard partnership aggreement requires institutional sign in via Shibboleth (http://www.hathitrust.org/eligibility_agreements) which is a feature that we have talked about a little, but haven't made progress on actualizing it.
Cheers,
Alex
On Tue, May 19, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jake Orlowitz <jorlowitz@gmail.commailto:jorlowitz@gmail.com> wrote: Hi Anders,
Thanks for you suggestion. I can assure you that [increased] Google Books access has been our dream from the start. It's very complicated because of the contentious legal situation that surrounded the massive scanning and limited sharing Google has been doing. Because of that, we haven't prioritized increased access, however we haven't given up on the possibility of it one day happening. One thing that would be helpful is a personal contact with someone at Google who works on the Books program. If you know of any Google-connected Wikipedians, please put us in touch.
Jake Orlowitz Lead, The Wikipedia Library User:Ocaasi
On Tue, May 19, 2015 at 6:31 AM Anders Feder <anders.feder.83@gmail.commailto:anders.feder.83@gmail.com> wrote: Hi,
I have a little idea that could be really helpful for Wikipedians if it could be implemented. Google has scanned in a vast collection of bookshttp://www.google.com/googlebooks/library/. Some of these scanned pages can be read online via Google Books, and serves an important resource for Wikipedians confirming the verifiability of text added to Wikipedia. However, many of the scanned pages can not be read: in some cases only an arbitrary selection of pages in a given book can be read, which may not be the ones need; in other cases, pages can not be read at all or they can only be searched in the severely limited "Snippet View".
Now, there are good reasons why this is the case. The books copyrighted, and the rightsholders do not want to give their most important goods away for free to anyone on the internet. However, given Google's support for Wikipedia, and for the open dissemination of knowledge, could Wikipedia Library perhaps approach Google and request a much more limited arrangement, like the ones it has with various journals?
Full access to all books in the Google Books Library Project would be utopic. But even a limited deal where a short range of pages can be requested for each book would be extremely helpful, because page numbers are specified countless references on Wikipedia via the {{cite book}} template - we just do not have a way to easily get those pages. Yet.
Thank you, Anders Feder _______________________________________________ Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.orgmailto:Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
_______________________________________________ Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.orgmailto:Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
I figured you had already explored that area :) I sadly do not know anyone at Google, but noticed the prominent googler Dan Brickley (danbri) is subscribed to this list. If this message isn't buried in your mailbox, can you help, Dan?
Regards, Anders Feder
2015-05-19 18:41 GMT+02:00 Jake Orlowitz jorlowitz@gmail.com:
Hi Anders,
Thanks for you suggestion. I can assure you that [increased] Google Books access has been our dream from the start. It's very complicated because of the contentious legal situation that surrounded the massive scanning and limited sharing Google has been doing. Because of that, we haven't prioritized increased access, however we haven't given up on the possibility of it one day happening. One thing that would be helpful is a personal contact with someone at Google who works on the Books program. If you know of any Google-connected Wikipedians, please put us in touch.
Jake Orlowitz Lead, The Wikipedia Library User:Ocaasi
On Tue, May 19, 2015 at 6:31 AM Anders Feder anders.feder.83@gmail.com wrote:
Hi,
I have a little idea that could be really helpful for Wikipedians if it could be implemented. Google has scanned in a vast collection of books http://www.google.com/googlebooks/library/. Some of these scanned pages can be read online via Google Books, and serves an important resource for Wikipedians confirming the verifiability of text added to Wikipedia. However, many of the scanned pages can *not* be read: in some cases only an arbitrary selection of pages in a given book can be read, which may not be the ones need; in other cases, pages can not be read at all or they can only be searched in the severely limited "Snippet View".
Now, there are good reasons why this is the case. The books copyrighted, and the rightsholders do not want to give their most important goods away for free to anyone on the internet. However, given Google's support for Wikipedia, and for the open dissemination of knowledge, could Wikipedia Library perhaps approach Google and request a much more limited arrangement, like the ones it has with various journals?
Full access to all books in the Google Books Library Project would be utopic. But even a limited deal where a short range of pages can be requested for each book would be extremely helpful, because page numbers are specified countless references on Wikipedia via the {{cite book}} template - we just do not have a way to easily get those pages. Yet.
Thank you, Anders Feder _______________________________________________ Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
On 19 May 2015 at 17:56, Anders Feder anders.feder.83@gmail.com wrote:
I figured you had already explored that area :) I sadly do not know anyone at Google, but noticed the prominent googler Dan Brickley (danbri) is subscribed to this list. If this message isn't buried in your mailbox, can you help, Dan?
I was following the thread with interest, as it happens. I have had only limited contact with the Google Books team since I joined Google, so I may not be the best contact. But anyway I'll pass https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikipedia-library/2015-May/000012.html along. As already noted here, the project is in quite a complex situation but that's no reason not to ask...
cheers,
Dan
Regards, Anders Feder
2015-05-19 18:41 GMT+02:00 Jake Orlowitz jorlowitz@gmail.com:
Hi Anders,
Thanks for you suggestion. I can assure you that [increased] Google Books access has been our dream from the start. It's very complicated because of the contentious legal situation that surrounded the massive scanning and limited sharing Google has been doing. Because of that, we haven't prioritized increased access, however we haven't given up on the possibility of it one day happening. One thing that would be helpful is a personal contact with someone at Google who works on the Books program. If you know of any Google-connected Wikipedians, please put us in touch.
Jake Orlowitz Lead, The Wikipedia Library User:Ocaasi
On Tue, May 19, 2015 at 6:31 AM Anders Feder anders.feder.83@gmail.com wrote:
Hi,
I have a little idea that could be really helpful for Wikipedians if it could be implemented. Google has scanned in a vast collection of books. Some of these scanned pages can be read online via Google Books, and serves an important resource for Wikipedians confirming the verifiability of text added to Wikipedia. However, many of the scanned pages can not be read: in some cases only an arbitrary selection of pages in a given book can be read, which may not be the ones need; in other cases, pages can not be read at all or they can only be searched in the severely limited "Snippet View".
Now, there are good reasons why this is the case. The books copyrighted, and the rightsholders do not want to give their most important goods away for free to anyone on the internet. However, given Google's support for Wikipedia, and for the open dissemination of knowledge, could Wikipedia Library perhaps approach Google and request a much more limited arrangement, like the ones it has with various journals?
Full access to all books in the Google Books Library Project would be utopic. But even a limited deal where a short range of pages can be requested for each book would be extremely helpful, because page numbers are specified countless references on Wikipedia via the {{cite book}} template - we just do not have a way to easily get those pages. Yet.
Thank you, Anders Feder _______________________________________________ Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Thanks!
2015-05-19 19:02 GMT+02:00 Dan Brickley danbri@google.com:
On 19 May 2015 at 17:56, Anders Feder anders.feder.83@gmail.com wrote:
I figured you had already explored that area :) I sadly do not know
anyone
at Google, but noticed the prominent googler Dan Brickley (danbri) is subscribed to this list. If this message isn't buried in your mailbox,
can
you help, Dan?
I was following the thread with interest, as it happens. I have had only limited contact with the Google Books team since I joined Google, so I may not be the best contact. But anyway I'll pass
https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikipedia-library/2015-May/000012.html along. As already noted here, the project is in quite a complex situation but that's no reason not to ask...
cheers,
Dan
Regards, Anders Feder
2015-05-19 18:41 GMT+02:00 Jake Orlowitz jorlowitz@gmail.com:
Hi Anders,
Thanks for you suggestion. I can assure you that [increased] Google
Books
access has been our dream from the start. It's very complicated
because of
the contentious legal situation that surrounded the massive scanning and limited sharing Google has been doing. Because of that, we haven't prioritized increased access, however we haven't given up on the
possibility
of it one day happening. One thing that would be helpful is a personal contact with someone at Google who works on the Books program. If you
know
of any Google-connected Wikipedians, please put us in touch.
Jake Orlowitz Lead, The Wikipedia Library User:Ocaasi
On Tue, May 19, 2015 at 6:31 AM Anders Feder <anders.feder.83@gmail.com
wrote:
Hi,
I have a little idea that could be really helpful for Wikipedians if it could be implemented. Google has scanned in a vast collection of
books. Some
of these scanned pages can be read online via Google Books, and serves
an
important resource for Wikipedians confirming the verifiability of text added to Wikipedia. However, many of the scanned pages can not be
read: in
some cases only an arbitrary selection of pages in a given book can be
read,
which may not be the ones need; in other cases, pages can not be read
at all
or they can only be searched in the severely limited "Snippet View".
Now, there are good reasons why this is the case. The books
copyrighted,
and the rightsholders do not want to give their most important goods
away
for free to anyone on the internet. However, given Google's support for Wikipedia, and for the open dissemination of knowledge, could Wikipedia Library perhaps approach Google and request a much more limited
arrangement,
like the ones it has with various journals?
Full access to all books in the Google Books Library Project would be utopic. But even a limited deal where a short range of pages can be requested for each book would be extremely helpful, because page
numbers are
specified countless references on Wikipedia via the {{cite book}}
template -
we just do not have a way to easily get those pages. Yet.
Thank you, Anders Feder _______________________________________________ Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Huge thanks Dan.
A big part our our partnerships approach is the mutual benefit of exposure on Wikipedia. It's quite a good thing for authors to have their work cited on Wikipedia...
A lot of nice background and recent impact metrics are laid out here: http://enwp.org/WP:PUBLISHERS
Jake
On Tue, May 19, 2015 at 10:03 AM Anders Feder anders.feder.83@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks!
2015-05-19 19:02 GMT+02:00 Dan Brickley danbri@google.com:
On 19 May 2015 at 17:56, Anders Feder anders.feder.83@gmail.com wrote:
I figured you had already explored that area :) I sadly do not know
anyone
at Google, but noticed the prominent googler Dan Brickley (danbri) is subscribed to this list. If this message isn't buried in your mailbox,
can
you help, Dan?
I was following the thread with interest, as it happens. I have had only limited contact with the Google Books team since I joined Google, so I may not be the best contact. But anyway I'll pass
https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikipedia-library/2015-May/000012.html along. As already noted here, the project is in quite a complex situation but that's no reason not to ask...
cheers,
Dan
Regards, Anders Feder
2015-05-19 18:41 GMT+02:00 Jake Orlowitz jorlowitz@gmail.com:
Hi Anders,
Thanks for you suggestion. I can assure you that [increased] Google
Books
access has been our dream from the start. It's very complicated
because of
the contentious legal situation that surrounded the massive scanning
and
limited sharing Google has been doing. Because of that, we haven't prioritized increased access, however we haven't given up on the
possibility
of it one day happening. One thing that would be helpful is a personal contact with someone at Google who works on the Books program. If you
know
of any Google-connected Wikipedians, please put us in touch.
Jake Orlowitz Lead, The Wikipedia Library User:Ocaasi
On Tue, May 19, 2015 at 6:31 AM Anders Feder <
anders.feder.83@gmail.com>
wrote:
Hi,
I have a little idea that could be really helpful for Wikipedians if
it
could be implemented. Google has scanned in a vast collection of
books. Some
of these scanned pages can be read online via Google Books, and
serves an
important resource for Wikipedians confirming the verifiability of
text
added to Wikipedia. However, many of the scanned pages can not be
read: in
some cases only an arbitrary selection of pages in a given book can
be read,
which may not be the ones need; in other cases, pages can not be read
at all
or they can only be searched in the severely limited "Snippet View".
Now, there are good reasons why this is the case. The books
copyrighted,
and the rightsholders do not want to give their most important goods
away
for free to anyone on the internet. However, given Google's support
for
Wikipedia, and for the open dissemination of knowledge, could
Wikipedia
Library perhaps approach Google and request a much more limited
arrangement,
like the ones it has with various journals?
Full access to all books in the Google Books Library Project would be utopic. But even a limited deal where a short range of pages can be requested for each book would be extremely helpful, because page
numbers are
specified countless references on Wikipedia via the {{cite book}}
template -
we just do not have a way to easily get those pages. Yet.
Thank you, Anders Feder _______________________________________________ Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
Wikipedia-Library mailing list Wikipedia-Library@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-library
wikipedia-library@lists.wikimedia.org