I think, some are getting it all wrong. It is not about sympathies to Nichalp or who so ever.
The problem is not conflict of interest editing... It is not even a philosophical debate of Paid editing Vs Volunteer editing... The problem is getting paid to white wash "negative materials" in favor of the clients, which eventually render Wikipedia articles biased and information suppressed... And if those people can get favors from the level of Admins, it is definitely wrong. What is more shocking is that if that if an account created possibly with a single purpose ( of protecting the interests of a business group) can manage to climb up the ladder of admin-ship of a "stronger" Wikipedia like en.wiki , it is definitely alarming !
At this point of time, I am giving the benefit of doubt of whether Wifione is actually Nichalp or not. But definitely an account like Wifione aka "Wireless Fidelity Class One" must be investigated.
It is not the first time, IIPM related folks tried to infiltrate Wikipedia to get the articles in their favour. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_checkuser/Case/Mrinal_Pa...
I am sure that scores of such sock puppet users are still having a free run with related articles. Previous sockpuppet investigations against Wifione in 2009 returned a "possible" result.
Imagine having an admin also with ACC ( Account Creation) toolserver authorization in the favour.
What is more shocking is that one user who slapped the notice on Wifione got this message on his talk page http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:Makrandjoshi&oldid=104617... (which closely translates to DONT YOU GET SCARED? THESE IIPM GUYS WILL KILL YOU)
Now tell me, can volunteers like you and me fearlessly edit articles related to IIPM to remove its bias, in such situations of death threats? Least I want to go to Silichar after being sued.
-TC
On Thu, Feb 9, 2012 at 2:47 PM, Pradeep Mohandas <pradeep.mohandas@gmail.com
wrote:
hi,
I think we mean this criticism only in the Wikipedia reference. It's not as if we're going to catch and hand over this guy to the Police.
Such paid editing lowers the morale of other editors. Efforts must be made to stop such work that is detrimental to other Wikipedia volunteers.
Then again, we're putting the cart in front of the horse. It's not been proved Nichalp and wifione are one and the same. It is hence best to discuss only about paid editing and how this practise can be identified and stopped.
Pradeep Handheld
On 09/02/2012, Ashwin Baindur ashwin.baindur@gmail.com wrote:
I would only like to remind people that showing some sympathy is not a bad thing .
Coming from armed forces where there are no second places - to me the greatest sin is lack of competence, whether in language, wiki-writing, techniques or otherwise. I was told by someone that Wikipeding was a voluntary activity so high standards should not be expected in competence. If that is true, then we should not suddenly start witch-hunting on the basis of principle when we are ourselves so casual about other qualities in other ways!
Without mentioning specific incidents, I have come across this tendency to crucify others in India community - which is deplorable.
Before any one becomes high & mighty on morals here, one should look closely at what are harmful crimes against humanity (murder, rape etc) and what are social misdemeanours (wiki-crimes). So many of us condone other faults all the time in Indian society; it is hypocrisy to be principled in issues concerning others, when we ourselves don't apply the highest standards to ourselves.
In my opinion. it is NOT the business of this community to go searching for culprits unless the culprit has affected us in some manner, which does not appear to be the case.
As Jesus Christ said, let he who is without blame cast the first stone.
There are far better and much more important things to do here.
Warm regards,
Ashwin Baindur
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 9:23 PM, praveenp me.praveen@gmail.com wrote:
I feel no sympathy for Nichalp or any such users....
Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
-- Pradeep Mohandas How Pradeep uses email - http://goo.gl/6v1I9
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The problem is not conflict of interest editing... It is not even a philosophical debate of Paid editing Vs Volunteer editing... The problem is getting paid to white wash "negative materials" in favor of the clients, which eventually render Wikipedia articles biased and information suppressed... And if those people can get favors from the level of Admins, it is definitely wrong. What is more shocking is that if that if an account created possibly with a single purpose ( of protecting the interests of a business group) can manage to climb up the ladder of admin-ship of a "stronger" Wikipedia like en.wiki , it is definitely alarming !
+1. Continuing this discussion generally on these terms will be good. Otherwise, this will be an en wiki community issue and I don't find it relevant to be on Indian mailing list.
Ravi
Not to state an opinion in any direction about Wifione, but has anybody bothered to tell him that he is being discussed on these mailing lists?
Risker
On 9 February 2012 05:23, CherianTinu Abraham tinucherian@gmail.com wrote:
I think, some are getting it all wrong. It is not about sympathies to Nichalp or who so ever.
The problem is not conflict of interest editing... It is not even a philosophical debate of Paid editing Vs Volunteer editing... The problem is getting paid to white wash "negative materials" in favor of the clients, which eventually render Wikipedia articles biased and information suppressed... And if those people can get favors from the level of Admins, it is definitely wrong. What is more shocking is that if that if an account created possibly with a single purpose ( of protecting the interests of a business group) can manage to climb up the ladder of admin-ship of a "stronger" Wikipedia like en.wiki , it is definitely alarming !
At this point of time, I am giving the benefit of doubt of whether Wifione is actually Nichalp or not. But definitely an account like Wifione aka "Wireless Fidelity Class One" must be investigated.
It is not the first time, IIPM related folks tried to infiltrate Wikipedia to get the articles in their favour.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_checkuser/Case/Mrinal_Pa...
I am sure that scores of such sock puppet users are still having a free run with related articles. Previous sockpuppet investigations against Wifione in 2009 returned a "possible" result.
Imagine having an admin also with ACC ( Account Creation) toolserver authorization in the favour.
What is more shocking is that one user who slapped the notice on Wifione got this message on his talk page http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:Makrandjoshi&oldid=104617... (which closely translates to DONT YOU GET SCARED? THESE IIPM GUYS WILL KILL YOU)
Now tell me, can volunteers like you and me fearlessly edit articles related to IIPM to remove its bias, in such situations of death threats? Least I want to go to Silichar after being sued.
-TC
On Thu, Feb 9, 2012 at 2:47 PM, Pradeep Mohandas < pradeep.mohandas@gmail.com
wrote:
hi,
I think we mean this criticism only in the Wikipedia reference. It's not as if we're going to catch and hand over this guy to the Police.
Such paid editing lowers the morale of other editors. Efforts must be made to stop such work that is detrimental to other Wikipedia volunteers.
Then again, we're putting the cart in front of the horse. It's not been proved Nichalp and wifione are one and the same. It is hence best to discuss only about paid editing and how this practise can be identified and stopped.
Pradeep Handheld
On 09/02/2012, Ashwin Baindur ashwin.baindur@gmail.com wrote:
I would only like to remind people that showing some sympathy is not a bad thing .
Coming from armed forces where there are no second places - to me the greatest sin is lack of competence, whether in language, wiki-writing, techniques or otherwise. I was told by someone that Wikipeding was a voluntary activity so high standards should not be expected in competence. If that is true, then we should not suddenly start witch-hunting on the basis of principle when we are ourselves so casual about other qualities in other ways!
Without mentioning specific incidents, I have come across this tendency to crucify others in India community - which is deplorable.
Before any one becomes high & mighty on morals here, one should look closely at what are harmful crimes against humanity (murder, rape etc) and what are social misdemeanours (wiki-crimes). So many of us condone other faults all the time in Indian society; it is hypocrisy to be principled in issues concerning others, when we ourselves don't apply the highest standards to ourselves.
In my opinion. it is NOT the business of this community to go searching for culprits unless the culprit has affected us in some manner, which does not appear to be the case.
As Jesus Christ said, let he who is without blame cast the first stone.
There are far better and much more important things to do here.
Warm regards,
Ashwin Baindur
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 9:23 PM, praveenp me.praveen@gmail.com wrote:
I feel no sympathy for Nichalp or any such users....
Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
-- Pradeep Mohandas How Pradeep uses email - http://goo.gl/6v1I9
Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Another one >> http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:Makrandjoshi&oldid=108166... ( No translation needed)
On Thu, Feb 9, 2012 at 3:53 PM, CherianTinu Abraham tinucherian@gmail.comwrote:
I think, some are getting it all wrong. It is not about sympathies to Nichalp or who so ever.
The problem is not conflict of interest editing... It is not even a philosophical debate of Paid editing Vs Volunteer editing... The problem is getting paid to white wash "negative materials" in favor of the clients, which eventually render Wikipedia articles biased and information suppressed... And if those people can get favors from the level of Admins, it is definitely wrong. What is more shocking is that if that if an account created possibly with a single purpose ( of protecting the interests of a business group) can manage to climb up the ladder of admin-ship of a "stronger" Wikipedia like en.wiki , it is definitely alarming !
At this point of time, I am giving the benefit of doubt of whether Wifione is actually Nichalp or not. But definitely an account like Wifione aka "Wireless Fidelity Class One" must be investigated.
It is not the first time, IIPM related folks tried to infiltrate Wikipedia to get the articles in their favour.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_checkuser/Case/Mrinal_Pa...
I am sure that scores of such sock puppet users are still having a free run with related articles. Previous sockpuppet investigations against Wifione in 2009 returned a "possible" result.
Imagine having an admin also with ACC ( Account Creation) toolserver authorization in the favour.
What is more shocking is that one user who slapped the notice on Wifione got this message on his talk page http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:Makrandjoshi&oldid=104617... (which closely translates to DONT YOU GET SCARED? THESE IIPM GUYS WILL KILL YOU)
Now tell me, can volunteers like you and me fearlessly edit articles related to IIPM to remove its bias, in such situations of death threats? Least I want to go to Silichar after being sued.
-TC
On Thu, Feb 9, 2012 at 2:47 PM, Pradeep Mohandas < pradeep.mohandas@gmail.com> wrote:
hi,
I think we mean this criticism only in the Wikipedia reference. It's not as if we're going to catch and hand over this guy to the Police.
Such paid editing lowers the morale of other editors. Efforts must be made to stop such work that is detrimental to other Wikipedia volunteers.
Then again, we're putting the cart in front of the horse. It's not been proved Nichalp and wifione are one and the same. It is hence best to discuss only about paid editing and how this practise can be identified and stopped.
Pradeep Handheld
On 09/02/2012, Ashwin Baindur ashwin.baindur@gmail.com wrote:
I would only like to remind people that showing some sympathy is not a bad thing .
Coming from armed forces where there are no second places - to me the greatest sin is lack of competence, whether in language, wiki-writing, techniques or otherwise. I was told by someone that Wikipeding was a voluntary activity so high standards should not be expected in competence. If that is true, then we should not suddenly start witch-hunting on the basis of principle when we are ourselves so casual about other qualities in other ways!
Without mentioning specific incidents, I have come across this tendency to crucify others in India community - which is deplorable.
Before any one becomes high & mighty on morals here, one should look closely at what are harmful crimes against humanity (murder, rape etc) and what are social misdemeanours (wiki-crimes). So many of us condone other faults all the time in Indian society; it is hypocrisy to be principled in issues concerning others, when we ourselves don't apply the highest standards to ourselves.
In my opinion. it is NOT the business of this community to go searching for culprits unless the culprit has affected us in some manner, which does not appear to be the case.
As Jesus Christ said, let he who is without blame cast the first stone.
There are far better and much more important things to do here.
Warm regards,
Ashwin Baindur
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 9:23 PM, praveenp me.praveen@gmail.com wrote:
I feel no sympathy for Nichalp or any such users....
Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
-- Pradeep Mohandas How Pradeep uses email - http://goo.gl/6v1I9
Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Worse: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Makrandjoshi&diff=pr...
I cant believe nothing has been done about this so far!
From: tinucherian@gmail.com Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2012 19:46:16 +0530 To: wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org; wikimedia-in-en@lists.wikimedia.org; wikien-l@lists.wikimedia.org Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-in-en] [Wikimediaindia-l] Pure Fiction: Nichalp and Wifione
Another one >> http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:Makrandjoshi&oldid=108166... ( No translation needed)
On Thu, Feb 9, 2012 at 3:53 PM, CherianTinu Abraham tinucherian@gmail.com wrote:
I think, some are getting it all wrong. It is not about sympathies to Nichalp or who so ever.
The problem is not conflict of interest editing... It is not even a philosophical debate of Paid editing Vs Volunteer editing... The problem is getting paid to white wash "negative materials" in favor of the clients, which eventually render Wikipedia articles biased and information suppressed... And if those people can get favors from the level of Admins, it is definitely wrong. What is more shocking is that if that if an account created possibly with a single purpose ( of protecting the interests of a business group) can manage to climb up the ladder of admin-ship of a "stronger" Wikipedia like en.wiki , it is definitely alarming !
At this point of time, I am giving the benefit of doubt of whether Wifione is actually Nichalp or not. But definitely an account like Wifione aka "Wireless Fidelity Class One" must be investigated.
It is not the first time, IIPM related folks tried to infiltrate Wikipedia to get the articles in their favour.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_checkuser/Case/Mrinal_Pa...
I am sure that scores of such sock puppet users are still having a free run with related articles.
Previous sockpuppet investigations against Wifione in 2009 returned a "possible" result.
Imagine having an admin also with ACC ( Account Creation) toolserver authorization in the favour.
What is more shocking is that one user who slapped the notice on Wifione got this message on his talk page
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:Makrandjoshi&oldid=104617...
(which closely translates to DONT YOU GET SCARED? THESE IIPM GUYS WILL KILL YOU)
Now tell me, can volunteers like you and me fearlessly edit articles related to IIPM to remove its bias, in such situations of death threats? Least I want to go to Silichar after being sued.
-TC
On Thu, Feb 9, 2012 at 2:47 PM, Pradeep Mohandas pradeep.mohandas@gmail.com wrote:
hi,
I think we mean this criticism only in the Wikipedia reference. It's
not as if we're going to catch and hand over this guy to the Police.
Such paid editing lowers the morale of other editors. Efforts must be
made to stop such work that is detrimental to other Wikipedia
volunteers.
Then again, we're putting the cart in front of the horse. It's not
been proved Nichalp and wifione are one and the same. It is hence best
to discuss only about paid editing and how this practise can be
identified and stopped.
Pradeep
Handheld
On 09/02/2012, Ashwin Baindur ashwin.baindur@gmail.com wrote:
I would only like to remind people that showing some sympathy is not a
bad thing .
Coming from armed forces where there are no second places - to me the
greatest sin is lack of competence, whether in language, wiki-writing,
techniques or otherwise. I was told by someone that Wikipeding was a
voluntary activity so high standards should not be expected in
competence. If that is true, then we should not suddenly start
witch-hunting on the basis of principle when we are ourselves so
casual about other qualities in other ways!
Without mentioning specific incidents, I have come across this
tendency to crucify others in India community - which is deplorable.
Before any one becomes high & mighty on morals here, one should look
closely at what are harmful crimes against humanity (murder, rape etc)
and what are social misdemeanours (wiki-crimes). So many of us condone
other faults all the time in Indian society; it is hypocrisy to be
principled in issues concerning others, when we ourselves don't apply
the highest standards to ourselves.
In my opinion. it is NOT the business of this community to go
searching for culprits unless the culprit has affected us in some
manner, which does not appear to be the case.
As Jesus Christ said, let he who is without blame cast the first stone.
There are far better and much more important things to do here.
Warm regards,
Ashwin Baindur
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 9:23 PM, praveenp me.praveen@gmail.com wrote:
I feel no sympathy for Nichalp or any such users....
Wikimediaindia-l mailing list
Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
--
Pradeep Mohandas
How Pradeep uses email - http://goo.gl/6v1I9
_______________________________________________
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_______________________________________________ Wikimedia-in-en mailing list Wikimedia-in-en@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-in-en
While all this is rather disconcerting, do remember that we must not prejudice ourselves against the said institute. I do know a student Who's an excellent contributor to the English Wikipedia and is very active in Outreach programs.
wikimedia-in-en@lists.wikimedia.org