Hi All,
No history is authentic. Written history depends on the author's
upbringing,his imagination ,his social background , his ethnic background
and so many other backgrounds. So,History is far, far, far away
from truth and so are the interpretations of the reader of History.But it is
not bull! It is worth reading and
interpreting to suit the reader's fancy.That is about the authenticity of
History as a subject. Mind you, I am a trained scienceman and my mind works
in this fashion.
Gokuldas
On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 10:44 AM, Basavaraj Itnal
<basavarajitnal(a)yahoo.com>wrote;wrote:
prateek,
i dont where this comment on personal vendetta comes from. we must root out
sources of such insinuations.
your comment that wiki is far more neutral than many news channels comes
from a lopsided comparision. news channels and news papers are run extremely
transparently and continously face public scrutiny - elements wiki lacks.
the concept of neutrality in wiki is formulated from a PoV and that PoV
tends to buldoze indigenous PoVs. i have elaborated on most of these points
earlier.
thanks.
Basavaraj N Itnal
--- On *Mon, 2/28/11, Prateek Ramachandra <prateek.vr(a)gmail.com>* wrote:
From: Prateek Ramachandra <prateek.vr(a)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-in-blr] [Wikimediaindia-l] ToI front page: Rs 1 cr
for Sanskrit WP
To: "Mailing list for Wikimedians / Wikipedians in & from Bangalore,
India"
<wikimedia-in-blr(a)lists.wikimedia.org>
Date: Monday, February 28, 2011, 9:40 AM
Dear Basavaraj,
Fully agree with you when you speak about Mass Medium..
The same follows here.. its understood..
Wikipedia *must not be used for personal vendetta*... whenever a good
contributor adds/edits articles in wiki he will certainly add refs...
Wikipedia should not be used to post rubbish theories which have no basis
and references...
We too have a pretty good knowledge of what happens around us... I
appreciate your concern that vandals may spoil reputation of Wikipedia and
make some articles too one-sided.... there are thousands of other users who
are their to monitor what others are doing... Its not that easy to have a
free run in Wikipedia... With more number of people editing truth will
surely prevail after sometime as you see internet world is not that
developed and matured..
I personally think that Wikipedia is more neutral than scores and scores of
News Channels we have in India... I say this because there is no
accountability there... you cannot reverse what you have said there...MOST
are owned directly or indirectly by corporates who tweak news in a manner
they want it to be... you surely would have heard about how alarming PAID
NEWS is these days... The Election Commission has spoken in detail about
it... This cannot happen here at all! That's the point... If any vandal is
screwing up some article... making unsubstantiated allegations... Editors in
Wiki will set it right... I am sure... as time passes Wikipedia will have
many many more editors who can keep Wikipedia clean from Vandals who dream
to have a free run here...
Regards,
Prateek Ramachandra.
On Sun, Feb 27, 2011 at 9:30 AM, Basavaraj Itnal
<basavarajitnal@yahoo.com<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=basavarajitnal@yahoo.com>
wrote:
hi arun and co, how r u guys doing?
Since we dont seem to have a mailing list to discuss ethical issues of
wiki, i continue to post.
now lemme try to tell all of you something what i normally tell journalism
interns on their first day;
1. Only becoz you have an access to a mass medium of expression, do not
think you are wiser than any poor illeterate farmer in the last village of
this country. In fact, your learning has just begun.
2. Access to a mass medium is a great opportunity to learn. When i started
reading Indian/world history along with various views on it and Indian/
world polity, most of today's college kids were not even born but i am yet
to form a decisive commentery. so it is better to carry all view points
rather than go without any viewpoints.
3. Whatever be the story, understand social context before putting it up
for public consumption. Every story exists only in a social context and
without social relevance even the best stories can serve anti-soical
elements.
4. No story is written. All stories are re-written. So before publishing
the story get it checked by your peers.
Having said that, i must remind all of you that if wikipedians are not
discussing the social relevance of what they are doing, they should start
doing so. It is pointless being wikipedian or being anybody, unless you
understand the social context. And dont think that they had no sense of
context before starting Wiki Foundation. They had, but have you asked them
what it was? Ask them, find an answer and then see if it compliments Indian
context. The idea of wikipedia is not concieved in vaccum so dont blindly
jump into the band wagon. There must be a reason why wiki keeps its editors
and admins anonymous even when India has thousands of learned men and women
who never say anything anonymously - however risky it would be to say that.
Often the findings may not suit our ego but ego blocks your understanding.
All wikipedians must read Indian history. you may begin with
1. Indian History by Romila Thapar
2. Indian History by Percieval Spear
3. Indian Independance Movement by Bipin Chandra
4. Freedom at midnight by Dominique lappierre
5. Discovery of India by Nehru
6. Intervals in Politics by Ram Manohar Lohia
7. Caste System by Ram Manohar Lohia
8. Wheels of History by Ram Manohar Lohia
...this list can go on. more later.
regards
Basavaraj N Itnal
--- On *Sat, 2/26/11, Arun Ramarathnam
<arunram25@gmail.com<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=arunram25@gmail.com>
* wrote:
From: Arun Ramarathnam
<arunram25@gmail.com<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=arunram25@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-in-blr]
[Wikimediaindia-l] ToI front page: Rs 1 cr
for Sanskrit WP
To: "Basavaraj Itnal"
<basavarajitnal@yahoo.com<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=basavarajitnal@yahoo.com>
Cc: "IndiaMailing list for
Wikimedians / Wikipedians in & from Bangalore" <
wikimedia-in-blr@lists.wikimedia.org<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=wikimedia-in-blr@lists.wikimedia.org>
Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 2:06
PM
On Sat, Feb 26, 2011 at 6:21 PM, Basavaraj Itnal <
basavarajitnal@yahoo.com<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=basavarajitnal@yahoo.com>
wrote:
explain. how social relevance of sanskrit is out of scope of wiki in
sanskrit and govt funding to it?
Basavaraj,
You must differentiate between the following:
- The social relevance of Sanskrit in India (as you put it)
- Impact of Wikipedia in Sanskrit to society.
The first topic, I maintain is beyond the scope of this list. It is to wide
a topic.
As far as the second one goes, Wikipedia in Sanskrit is too small to
discuss this now.
If you question was with regards to the process followed to start a
wikipedia in a language (like Sankrit or any other), you are referred to the
following:
http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_new_languages
http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Meta:Language_proposal_policy
http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Language_committee
As you can see from the links above, there *are* active discussions before
a wikipedia project is created.
do you guys discuss social relavance of what you are doing at all? if
yes, where? if no, that is a grave ommission.
I urge you to consider spending some time understanding how wikipedia works
and the processes behind it before coming to conclusions on some aspects.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Contents
Wikipedia has evolved over 10 years. It did not become a phenomenon just
like that. There surely is a "method" to most things, even if it doesn't
seem very apparent to some. And these methods keep improving. You too can
contribute to bettering these while participating in the processes and
experiencing them.
A lot of links and references have been shared on this thread. Hope it
helps you form your views on the processes behind wikipedia. And as they
say, "Rome was not built in one day"! In this case it took 10 years (and it
is still a WIP).
Thanks
Arun
--- On *Sat, 2/26/11, Arun Ramarathnam
<arunram25@gmail.com<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=arunram25@gmail.com>
* wrote:
From: Arun Ramarathnam
<arunram25@gmail.com<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=arunram25@gmail.com>>
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-in-blr] [Wikimediaindia-l] ToI front page: Rs 1 cr
for Sanskrit WP
To: "Mailing list for Wikimedians / Wikipedians in & from Bangalore,
India"
<wikimedia-in-blr@lists.wikimedia.org<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=wikimedia-in-blr@lists.wikimedia.org>>,
"Basavaraj Itnal"
<basavarajitnal@yahoo.com<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=basavarajitnal@yahoo.com>
Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 12:47
PM
Basavaraj,
The social relevance of Sanskrit in India, is not a topic that is in the
scope if this list.
It is a much larger topic.
As far as your observations on factual inaccuracies of some articles, that
is certainly something you can take up on the talk page of the respective
wiki page. There may be more knowledgeable contributors on the subject who
can comment on it.
Could you also please refer the following links or pages that may assist
you further:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Accuracy_dispute
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Fact_and_Reference_Check
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Contact_us/Article_problem/Factual_e…
Thank you
Arun
On Sat, Feb 26, 2011 at 5:34 PM, Basavaraj Itnal
<basavarajitnal@yahoo.com<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=basavarajitnal@yahoo.com>
wrote:
this is about social relevance of sanskrit to India. and some
concomitant errenous insertions.
Basavaraj N Itnal
--- On *Sat, 2/26/11, Prateek Ramachandra
<prateek.vr@gmail.com<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=prateek.vr@gmail.com>
* wrote:
From: Prateek Ramachandra
<prateek.vr@gmail.com<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=prateek.vr@gmail.com>>
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-in-blr] [Wikimediaindia-l] ToI front page: Rs 1 cr
for Sanskrit WP
To: "Mailing list for Wikimedians / Wikipedians in & from Bangalore,
India"
<wikimedia-in-blr@lists.wikimedia.org<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=wikimedia-in-blr@lists.wikimedia.org>
Cc: "Basavaraj Itnal"
<basavarajitnal@yahoo.com<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=basavarajitnal@yahoo.com>
Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 12:00
PM
Guys... what are we discussing here??? Please stop discussing about
non-relevant topics... focus on sanskrit wiki... please start another
discussion if anyone has anything else to say...
I
On Sat, Feb 26, 2011 at 5:18 PM, Basavaraj Itnal
<basavarajitnal@yahoo.com<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=basavarajitnal@yahoo.com>
wrote:
correct version of lingayatism as opposed to brahmanicised version on
wiki..
http://www.everyculture.com/South-Asia/Lingayat-Religion-and-Expressive-Cul…
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/hubli/Lingayat-is-an-independent-re…
http://www.deccanherald.com/content/134566/veerashaivas-urged-register-ling…
Basavaraj N Itnal
--- On Sat, 2/26/11, Gautam John
<gautam@prathambooks.org<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=gautam@prathambooks.org>>
wrote:
> From: Gautam John
<gautam@prathambooks.org<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=gautam@prathambooks.org>
> Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-in-blr]
[Wikimediaindia-l] ToI front page: Rs 1
cr for Sanskrit WP
To: "Mailing list for Wikimedians /
Wikipedians in & from Bangalore,
India"
<wikimedia-in-blr@lists.wikimedia.org<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=wikimedia-in-blr@lists.wikimedia.org>
> Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011,
11:30 AM
> On 26 February 2011 16:57, Basavaraj
> Itnal
<basavarajitnal@yahoo.com<http://us.mc1137.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=basavarajitnal@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> > wiki has to
recognise and be sensitive to these
> concerns.
> It is, in it's content drawing on
it's policies of being
> an
> encyclopedia and being neutral. These are very powerful
> pillars that
> promote neutrality of points of view.
> Thank you.
> Best,
> Gautam
> ________
>
http://social.prathambooks.org/
>
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