Sorry, I had a typo in the title of my last Email. It should be Wikivoyage obviously, not Wikileaks or Wikisomethingelse.
Cheers, Denny
2013/6/28 Denny Vrandečić denny.vrandecic@wikimedia.de
Hey all,
as discussed yesterday in the call, here is our current plan for deploying interwikilinks to Wikivoyage. If there are no complaints from your side by Tuesday, we will share this plan with the Wikivoyage communities and the Wikidata community on Wednesday.
Wed, July 17th: Branching Wikibase 1.22-wmf12
Thu, July 18th: Deploying wmf12 to the test systems and setting up configurations for Wikivoyage on test. This means, the Test Wikidata can accept links to Wikivoyage sites.
Mon, July 22nd: Deploying wmf12 to wikidata.org and setting the configuration to accept Wikivoyage links as well.
Thu, July, 25th: Deploying wmf12 client to all Wikivoyage.org language editions. From this moment on, Wikivoyage can access interwiki links from Wikidata, and does not need to have them locally anymore.
Notes:
- Wikivoyage will only get access to the interwikis for now, not to other
data in Wikidata. This is planned for later, but we just want to go step by step (i.e. only "phase 1")
- Wikipedia will not automatically and suddenly display links to
Wikivoyage. The behavior on Wikipedia actually remains completely unchanged by this deployment.
- Wikivoyage will not automatically get links to Wikipedia and display
them (currently called "Related sites"). This is also left for later.
- Further sister projects are planned for later, depending how smoothly
this deployment goes.
- There is no need for an additional item for e.g. New York for
Wikivoyage, but rather the links to Wikivoyage can be entered in the same item that also holds the links to Wikipedia.
Cheers, Denny
P.S.: Ken, you might consider joining the Wikidata tech list. This is where we send the agenda for the Thursday calls around.
-- Project director Wikidata Wikimedia Deutschland e.V. | Obentrautstr. 72 | 10963 Berlin Tel. +49-30-219 158 26-0 | http://wikimedia.de
Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V. Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 B. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
Am 28.06.2013 11:45, schrieb Denny Vrandečić:
* Wikipedia will not automatically and suddenly display links to Wikivoyage. The behavior on Wikipedia actually remains completely unchanged by this deployment.
Let's make sure we have thorough tests for this, I'm not 100% sure how this is currently handled on the client.
-- daniel
2013/6/28 Daniel Kinzler daniel.kinzler@wikimedia.de:
Am 28.06.2013 11:45, schrieb Denny Vrandečić:
* Wikipedia will not automatically and suddenly display links to Wikivoyage. The behavior on Wikipedia actually remains completely unchanged by this deployment.Let's make sure we have thorough tests for this, I'm not 100% sure how this is currently handled on the client.
I wonder why this point is mentioned at all. May I remind you that interwiki links from Wikipedia to its sister projects are in no case handled automatically. It is up to Wikipedia article editors to decide if they want to link to sister projects at all. Local policies for external links apply. As to Wikivoyage cf. this RFC on German Wikipedia:
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Umfragen/Wikivoyage-Link
Regards, Jürgen.
Am 30.06.2013 16:25, schrieb Juergen Fenn:
2013/6/28 Daniel Kinzler daniel.kinzler@wikimedia.de:
Am 28.06.2013 11:45, schrieb Denny Vrandečić:
* Wikipedia will not automatically and suddenly display links to Wikivoyage. The behavior on Wikipedia actually remains completely unchanged by this deployment.Let's make sure we have thorough tests for this, I'm not 100% sure how this is currently handled on the client.
I wonder why this point is mentioned at all. May I remind you that interwiki links from Wikipedia to its sister projects are in no case handled automatically. It is up to Wikipedia article editors to decide if they want to link to sister projects at all. Local policies for external links apply. As to Wikivoyage cf. this RFC on German Wikipedia:
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Umfragen/Wikivoyage-Link
Which is why I say we should have tests that make sure it stays that way.
To Wikidata, "language links" and "sister links" are the same. So, if Wikipedia just said "give me all your links for this page", and then puts the result into the sidebar, it will include links to all sister projects in all languages.
This should of course not be the case: the sidebar should (per default / for now) only contain links to other Wikipedias. And we should make double sure this is the case.
-- daniel
2013/6/30 Daniel Kinzler daniel.kinzler@wikimedia.de:
To Wikidata, "language links" and "sister links" are the same. So, if Wikipedia just said "give me all your links for this page", and then puts the result into the sidebar, it will include links to all sister projects in all languages.
Excuse me, but how is it that something like this can happen at all? Wikidata was developed to fit into the Wikimedia project landscape in the first place, wasn't it?
I suggest to extend Wikidata in order to be able to process the difference between language and sister links before extending it to any of the sister projects, please.
Anyway, thanks for explaining, Daniel.
Regards, Jürgen.
Am 30.06.2013 21:46, schrieb Juergen Fenn:
I suggest to extend Wikidata in order to be able to process the difference between language and sister links before extending it to any of the sister projects, please.
That is indeed built in as the concept of "site groups". I was just saying that we need to actually test that this separation is working correctly in the case of inclusion on the sidebar on wikipedia (I already know it is working on the wikidata side).
Reading this thread, it occurred to me that this might not be the case. And indeed, it isn't, as I have just found - so I filted a bug report: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50478
Anyway: essentially, I was saying the same thing as you: we have to make sure this works cleanly before enabling it. But it's not like we forgot a major feature - I just found an oversight in the implementation, which should be easy to fix.
-- daniel
Hi Denny, I'm really excited to see a sister project getting included, however I'm concerned that the community needs a bit more time and notice (I didn't see anything about this on WD:PC). When importing interwiki links for Wikipedias, we had a few months before they were used on client sites. The proposed schedule gives our bots ~3 days to import a majority of links, which I don't think is enough time. A whole week would be much better in my opinion. I've also started a page on-wiki to help coordinate the migration: https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Wikivoyage_migration -- Legoktm
On Fri, Jun 28, 2013 at 2:45 AM, Denny Vrandečić < denny.vrandecic@wikimedia.de> wrote:
Sorry, I had a typo in the title of my last Email. It should be Wikivoyage obviously, not Wikileaks or Wikisomethingelse.
Cheers, Denny
2013/6/28 Denny Vrandečić denny.vrandecic@wikimedia.de
Hey all,
as discussed yesterday in the call, here is our current plan for deploying interwikilinks to Wikivoyage. If there are no complaints from your side by Tuesday, we will share this plan with the Wikivoyage communities and the Wikidata community on Wednesday.
Wed, July 17th: Branching Wikibase 1.22-wmf12
Thu, July 18th: Deploying wmf12 to the test systems and setting up configurations for Wikivoyage on test. This means, the Test Wikidata can accept links to Wikivoyage sites.
Mon, July 22nd: Deploying wmf12 to wikidata.org and setting the configuration to accept Wikivoyage links as well.
Thu, July, 25th: Deploying wmf12 client to all Wikivoyage.org language editions. From this moment on, Wikivoyage can access interwiki links from Wikidata, and does not need to have them locally anymore.
Notes:
- Wikivoyage will only get access to the interwikis for now, not to other
data in Wikidata. This is planned for later, but we just want to go step by step (i.e. only "phase 1")
- Wikipedia will not automatically and suddenly display links to
Wikivoyage. The behavior on Wikipedia actually remains completely unchanged by this deployment.
- Wikivoyage will not automatically get links to Wikipedia and display
them (currently called "Related sites"). This is also left for later.
- Further sister projects are planned for later, depending how smoothly
this deployment goes.
- There is no need for an additional item for e.g. New York for
Wikivoyage, but rather the links to Wikivoyage can be entered in the same item that also holds the links to Wikipedia.
Cheers, Denny
P.S.: Ken, you might consider joining the Wikidata tech list. This is where we send the agenda for the Thursday calls around.
-- Project director Wikidata Wikimedia Deutschland e.V. | Obentrautstr. 72 | 10963 Berlin Tel. +49-30-219 158 26-0 | http://wikimedia.de
Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V. Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 B. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
-- Project director Wikidata Wikimedia Deutschland e.V. | Obentrautstr. 72 | 10963 Berlin Tel. +49-30-219 158 26-0 | http://wikimedia.de
Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V. Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 B. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
Wikidata-tech mailing list Wikidata-tech@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-tech
On Fri, Jun 28, 2013 at 11:45 PM, legoktm legoktm.wikipedia@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Denny, I'm really excited to see a sister project getting included, however I'm concerned that the community needs a bit more time and notice (I didn't see anything about this on WD:PC). When importing interwiki links for Wikipedias, we had a few months before they were used on client sites. The proposed schedule gives our bots ~3 days to import a majority of links, which I don't think is enough time. A whole week would be much better in my opinion. I've also started a page on-wiki to help coordinate the migration: https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Wikivoyage_migration
Hey :)
There is no rush and absolutely no need to have all links migrated by the time it is turned on. The existing links in the wikitext will continue to work just fine just like they do on Wikipedia. It is absolutely fine to make this a slow migration. Please let me announce this properly in the appropriate channels when the dates are settled.
Cheers Lydia
-- Lydia Pintscher - http://about.me/lydia.pintscher Community Communications for Technical Projects
Wikimedia Deutschland e.V. Obentrautstr. 72 10963 Berlin www.wikimedia.de
Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e. V.
Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 Nz. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
legoktm, 28/06/2013 23:45:
Hi Denny, I'm really excited to see a sister project getting included,
+1 I've no idea why start with Wikivoyage, but it's very good that the central interwiki management is being extended to other projects when it's easy to do so (as it would be for Wikiquote and, mutatis mutandis, Commons).
Nemo
however I'm concerned that the community needs a bit more time and notice (I didn't see anything about this on WD:PC). When importing interwiki links for Wikipedias, we had a few months before they were used on client sites. The proposed schedule gives our bots ~3 days to import a majority of links, which I don't think is enough time. A whole week would be much better in my opinion. I've also started a page on-wiki to help coordinate the migration: https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Wikivoyage_migration
Wikivoyage is probably the easiest to start with because of things such as similarity to Wikipedia.
Hazard-SJ
________________________________ From: Federico Leva (Nemo) nemowiki@gmail.com To: Discussion list for the Wikidata project. wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org Cc: Wikidata technical discussion wikidata-tech@lists.wikimedia.org; Ken Snider ksnider@wikimedia.org Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2013 8:22 AM Subject: Re: [Wikidata-tech] [Wikidata-l] WikiVOYAGE deployment plan
legoktm, 28/06/2013 23:45:
Hi Denny, I'm really excited to see a sister project getting included,
+1 I've no idea why start with Wikivoyage, but it's very good that the central interwiki management is being extended to other projects when it's easy to do so (as it would be for Wikiquote and, mutatis mutandis, Commons).
Nemo
however I'm concerned that the community needs a bit more time and notice (I didn't see anything about this on WD:PC). When importing interwiki links for Wikipedias, we had a few months before they were used on client sites. The proposed schedule gives our bots ~3 days to import a majority of links, which I don't think is enough time. A whole week would be much better in my opinion. I've also started a page on-wiki to help coordinate the migration: https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Wikivoyage_migration
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