On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 9:14 AM, Nathan nawrich@gmail.com wrote:
This might be a good point for the list moderator (someone from Legal?) to step in to help maintain a constructive atmosphere on this list. We can and should discuss, debate and disagree while maintaining a degree of collegiality.
Generally, I think list moderation is *extremely* important for keeping a mailing list healthy. I described my best practices for behavior and moderation in the draft OSI Code of Conduct for Mailing Lists: http://opensource.org/codeofconduct/licensing
However, I don't think that imposing such a policy in the middle of a hot debate is a good idea. So I suggest we have a discussion about that once this has run its natural course.
In this specific case, I agree that the tone has become hostile and unconstructive from some participants. I hope everyone will take a deep breath, and if appropriate, apologize either to specific people who have been attacked or to the list as a whole for creating an unproductive environment.
I also hope that, in keeping with the "disclose potential conflicts" section of the OSI code linked above, some of the new list members will introduce themselves and explain their interests and motives for joining the group. Advocates from other groups are of course welcome here, but we hope in the spirit of transparency you'll disclose your goals and intentions for joining in our community.
Thanks- Luis
+1
FYI I am staying a bit off-list for a short while, since I warned Jens as list moderator and he threatened me personally and as "contractor" in his role as board member of WMDE.
We're now working with Jan, Lodewijk and the rest of the WMDE board to solve this... behaviour, but during this it is wiser if I don't do moderation in this exact moment.
I have poked TheHelpfulOne to keep an eye out, as he's the only list moderator who's neither WMF Legal nor me :)
BTW I am telling you this rather as a friend than in any official function - this is not a WMDE-WMF notice but rather Luis-Dimi sharing ;)
Cheers, Dimi
2014-08-13 20:50 GMT+02:00 Luis Villa lvilla@wikimedia.org:
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 9:14 AM, Nathan nawrich@gmail.com wrote:
This might be a good point for the list moderator (someone from Legal?) to step in to help maintain a constructive atmosphere on this list. We can and should discuss, debate and disagree while maintaining a degree of collegiality.
Generally, I think list moderation is *extremely* important for keeping a mailing list healthy. I described my best practices for behavior and moderation in the draft OSI Code of Conduct for Mailing Lists: http://opensource.org/codeofconduct/licensing
However, I don't think that imposing such a policy in the middle of a hot debate is a good idea. So I suggest we have a discussion about that once this has run its natural course.
In this specific case, I agree that the tone has become hostile and unconstructive from some participants. I hope everyone will take a deep breath, and if appropriate, apologize either to specific people who have been attacked or to the list as a whole for creating an unproductive environment.
I also hope that, in keeping with the "disclose potential conflicts" section of the OSI code linked above, some of the new list members will introduce themselves and explain their interests and motives for joining the group. Advocates from other groups are of course welcome here, but we hope in the spirit of transparency you'll disclose your goals and intentions for joining in our community.
Thanks- Luis
-- Luis Villa Deputy General Counsel Wikimedia Foundation 415.839.6885 ext. 6810
*This message may be confidential or legally privileged. If you have received it by accident, please delete it and let us know about the mistake. As an attorney for the Wikimedia Foundation, for legal/ethical reasons I cannot give legal advice to, or serve as a lawyer for, community members, volunteers, or staff members in their personal capacity. For more on what this means, please see our legal disclaimer https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Legal_Disclaimer.*
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Hi Luis,
Seems reasonable to me. I am a little sad though that we have to have this discussion in the first place though!
Lodewijk
2014-08-13 20:50 GMT+02:00 Luis Villa lvilla@wikimedia.org:
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 9:14 AM, Nathan nawrich@gmail.com wrote:
This might be a good point for the list moderator (someone from Legal?) to step in to help maintain a constructive atmosphere on this list. We can and should discuss, debate and disagree while maintaining a degree of collegiality.
Generally, I think list moderation is *extremely* important for keeping a mailing list healthy. I described my best practices for behavior and moderation in the draft OSI Code of Conduct for Mailing Lists: http://opensource.org/codeofconduct/licensing
However, I don't think that imposing such a policy in the middle of a hot debate is a good idea. So I suggest we have a discussion about that once this has run its natural course.
In this specific case, I agree that the tone has become hostile and unconstructive from some participants. I hope everyone will take a deep breath, and if appropriate, apologize either to specific people who have been attacked or to the list as a whole for creating an unproductive environment.
I also hope that, in keeping with the "disclose potential conflicts" section of the OSI code linked above, some of the new list members will introduce themselves and explain their interests and motives for joining the group. Advocates from other groups are of course welcome here, but we hope in the spirit of transparency you'll disclose your goals and intentions for joining in our community.
Thanks- Luis
-- Luis Villa Deputy General Counsel Wikimedia Foundation 415.839.6885 ext. 6810
*This message may be confidential or legally privileged. If you have received it by accident, please delete it and let us know about the mistake. As an attorney for the Wikimedia Foundation, for legal/ethical reasons I cannot give legal advice to, or serve as a lawyer for, community members, volunteers, or staff members in their personal capacity. For more on what this means, please see our legal disclaimer https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Legal_Disclaimer.*
Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors
I think I'm a moderator for this list (I volunteered back when nobody was here). I do absolutely nothing, and if someone else wanted to take up the torch I'd be glad have it transferred.
Adrian Raddatz
On Wed, Aug 13, 2014 at 3:42 PM, L.Gelauff lgelauff@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Luis,
Seems reasonable to me. I am a little sad though that we have to have this discussion in the first place though!
Lodewijk
2014-08-13 20:50 GMT+02:00 Luis Villa lvilla@wikimedia.org:
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 9:14 AM, Nathan nawrich@gmail.com wrote:
This might be a good point for the list moderator (someone from Legal?) to step in to help maintain a constructive atmosphere on this list. We can and should discuss, debate and disagree while maintaining a degree of collegiality.
Generally, I think list moderation is *extremely* important for keeping a mailing list healthy. I described my best practices for behavior and moderation in the draft OSI Code of Conduct for Mailing Lists: http://opensource.org/codeofconduct/licensing
However, I don't think that imposing such a policy in the middle of a hot debate is a good idea. So I suggest we have a discussion about that once this has run its natural course.
In this specific case, I agree that the tone has become hostile and unconstructive from some participants. I hope everyone will take a deep breath, and if appropriate, apologize either to specific people who have been attacked or to the list as a whole for creating an unproductive environment.
I also hope that, in keeping with the "disclose potential conflicts" section of the OSI code linked above, some of the new list members will introduce themselves and explain their interests and motives for joining the group. Advocates from other groups are of course welcome here, but we hope in the spirit of transparency you'll disclose your goals and intentions for joining in our community.
Thanks- Luis
-- Luis Villa Deputy General Counsel Wikimedia Foundation 415.839.6885 ext. 6810
*This message may be confidential or legally privileged. If you have received it by accident, please delete it and let us know about the mistake. As an attorney for the Wikimedia Foundation, for legal/ethical reasons I cannot give legal advice to, or serve as a lawyer for, community members, volunteers, or staff members in their personal capacity. For more on what this means, please see our legal disclaimer https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Legal_Disclaimer.*
Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors
Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors
On Wed, Aug 13, 2014 at 2:42 PM, L.Gelauff lgelauff@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Luis,
Seems reasonable to me. I am a little sad though that we have to have this discussion in the first place though!
Not too sad - just the nature of mailing lists, especially about politics :) Everyone here is strongly opinionated, and we are discussing important issues that we feel passionate about. We also have looser social connections - not everyone knows each other, for example, and we sometimes have strong loyalties to other groups that conflict with this one. (And those are dangers even when everyone speaks the same language natively, and has the same set of background cultural expectations, which we don't.)
So it is inevitable that if we're not careful and *intentional* about being good to one another that conflicts will happen. No need to be sad about it, any more than one should be sad that a dropped glass is caught by gravity. Focus on hanging on to the glass, not being angry at gravity ;)
Luis
Lodewijk
2014-08-13 20:50 GMT+02:00 Luis Villa lvilla@wikimedia.org:
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 9:14 AM, Nathan nawrich@gmail.com wrote:
This might be a good point for the list moderator (someone from Legal?)
to step in to help maintain a constructive atmosphere on this list. We can and should discuss, debate and disagree while maintaining a degree of collegiality.
Generally, I think list moderation is *extremely* important for keeping a mailing list healthy. I described my best practices for behavior and moderation in the draft OSI Code of Conduct for Mailing Lists: http://opensource.org/codeofconduct/licensing
However, I don't think that imposing such a policy in the middle of a hot debate is a good idea. So I suggest we have a discussion about that once this has run its natural course.
In this specific case, I agree that the tone has become hostile and unconstructive from some participants. I hope everyone will take a deep breath, and if appropriate, apologize either to specific people who have been attacked or to the list as a whole for creating an unproductive environment.
I also hope that, in keeping with the "disclose potential conflicts" section of the OSI code linked above, some of the new list members will introduce themselves and explain their interests and motives for joining the group. Advocates from other groups are of course welcome here, but we hope in the spirit of transparency you'll disclose your goals and intentions for joining in our community.
Thanks- Luis
-- Luis Villa Deputy General Counsel Wikimedia Foundation 415.839.6885 ext. 6810
*This message may be confidential or legally privileged. If you have received it by accident, please delete it and let us know about the mistake. As an attorney for the Wikimedia Foundation, for legal/ethical reasons I cannot give legal advice to, or serve as a lawyer for, community members, volunteers, or staff members in their personal capacity. For more on what this means, please see our legal disclaimer https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Legal_Disclaimer.*
Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors
Advocacy_Advisors mailing list Advocacy_Advisors@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy_advisors
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