Wikizh-l March 2006

wikizh-l@lists.wikimedia.org

8 participants
26 discussions

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by Hsing Fang 16 Mar '06

16 Mar '06

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Re: [Wikizh-l] [Foundation-l] "Chinese Wikimania 2006 to be held in Hong Kong"
by R.O.C 16 Mar '06

16 Mar '06

i think so too, there is a huge cultural and language gap, many chinese users have misunderstood the meaning of "wikimania" as simply a short word for "wikimedia conference" or "wikimedia meetup" instead of "INTERNATIONAL wikimedia conference" (of wikimedia foundation). most of them were not aware that "wikimania" is a brand name and should be a trademark for the foundation. the chinese name for the chinese conference "中文維基年會" can be more precisely translated as "chinese language wikipedia/wikimedia annual conference". since the english name is seeked largely to serve international attenders/readers, i think that suggestions/advice from international users on the mailing list would probably be helpful and productive. if you have comments, please kindly send it to the wikizh-l list at wikizh-l(a)wikipedia.org. (i personally still favor "chinese wikimedia conference" if authorized by the foundation, which seems likely.) the planning of the chinese conference is still in the early stage. it's not clear how many would attend, but personally i would not be surprised by a number between 20 and 100. it will be held on august 26-27 after wikimania in boston. roc (User:R.O.C) -- 在 2006/3/16，THD <theodoranian(a)gmail.com> 撰寫： > Hi, Ladies and all, > > I am Theodoranian from zh.wikipedia. I went to Frankfurt last year, and > now I am thinking to go to Boston to join the 2006 wikimania. > > I want to explain the "2006 Chinese wikimania" to you. > Actually, this annual conference is first-time-held this year, since > Zh.wikipedians from > China, Hong Kong, Taiwan, and else places thought that there should be a > meetup. > > The formal name of this meetup is "中文維基年會" in Chinese (which literally means > "Chinese Wikimedia Annual Conference"), and we don't have an appropriate > English > name for it yet. Now, we are still thinking what would be good. However, > somebody > translated the "CWAC" into English as "Chinese wikimania". There seems to be > a cultural > gap which misleads the translator to regard "Wiki-meetup" as "wikimania". > > Just for your information. > > Theodoanian > > 2006/3/16, Anthere <Anthere9(a)yahoo.com>: > > > > I hope we'll also see some chinese in Boston as well :-) > > I could not see the information in the news. Do you have any idea how > > many people you could gather ? > > > > ant > > > > R.O.C wrote: > > > what if using "wikimedia", for example. "chinese wikimedia conference"? > > > > > > just to clarify that "chinese" here means ethnic chinese around the > > world, > > > not limited to the people's republic of china or mainland china, as what > > > "china" nowadays often refers to. a number of users of zh.wikipedia (along > > > with other wikimedia projects in chinese language) from mainland china, > > > taiwan, hong kong, malaysia, canada, united states, germany, etc. have > > > expressed interests to attend. > > > > > > the chinese community decided to hold the conference in hong kong, which > > > enjoys convenient transportation and high degree of autonomy from the > > > central government in beijing. among other candidate cities were > > beijing, > > > shanghai, and taipei. blocking of wikipedia in PRC poses > > > concerns/difficulties for promoting wikimedia and organizing a > > conference > > > within mainland china. taipei has a highly devoted local community but > > there > > > is a difficulty also from politics that entry permits generally are not > > > issued to mainland chinese. > > > > > > -roc (User:R.O.C) > > > > > > 2006/3/16, Angela <beesley(a)gmail.com>: > > > > > >> I'm pleased to see a conference in China is being planned, but this > > >>and similar events really need to use a different name, both to > > >>prevent confusion with the actual Wikimania, and to avoid the need for > > >>each event to get permission from Wikimedia to use the name. > > >> > > >>Angela. > > >>_______________________________________________ > > >>foundation-l mailing list > > >>foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org > > >> http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l > > >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > foundation-l mailing list > > foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org > > http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l > > > _______________________________________________ > foundation-l mailing list > foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org > http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l >

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Re: [Wikizh-l] [Foundation-l] Intent to launch Chinese Wikinews
by R.O.C 16 Mar '06

16 Mar '06

i understand brian's main point: the analogy in which a government deems something harmful (either the substance harmful to the public or the information harmful to the regime) and bans it, while there are enough people who still want this stuff and in spite of the government's continuous efforts and advancement in interception, there are constantly and more advanced means available to obtain it. however, i would like to steer away from the impression that we (both wikimedia and its contributors) have anything to do with outlaws. accessing and using blocked websites within PRC are not necessarily "breaking the law" there, at least in the case of wikipedia/wikimedia. PRC officials and official news media have repeatedly asserted that there are no censorship laws at all in PRC. (indeed, such laws would be unconstitutional, although there is no constitutional court in PRC since all courts report to the people's congress, which functions mainly as the legislature.) PRC censors do cite and claim their authority from several regulations and executive rules, for example, the "regulation on protection of security of computer information systems " (中华人民共和国计算机信息系统安全保护条例) passed by the state council in 1994, the "administrative rules for protecting security of international networking of computer information systems" (计算机信息网络国际联网安全保护管理办法) issued by the department of public safety in 1997, and the "administrative rules for internet information services" (互联网信息服务管理办法) passed by the state council in 2000. however, all these regulations and rules are in essence "executive orders" instead of "laws," and i cannot find any law of PRC that grants or authorizes the executive branch for issuing these regulations/rules. it is true that the standing committee of national people's congress, the legislature, has released a document named "resolution on maintaining internet security" (全国人大常委会关于维护互联网安全的决定) in 2000, but it is merely a resolution (in form of interpreting the criminal law so the constitutionality of this resolution is not easily disputed) instead of an act or law of the people's congress. i also would keep away from the implication that the legal system/conditions of PRC are comparable to that of the freer countries. firstly, those executive regulations/rules established without debate, approval, or authorization from people's representatives are treated and applied as law -- the "law" lacks both constitutionality and legitimacy. secondly, to this day it remains unclear which governmental agency ordered ISPs to block wikipedia and on what basis the order was, indeed it is not even proven although obvious whether the government is involved in the unconnectivity -- the enforcement lacks forewarning and transparency. thirdly, there is currently no practical way of suing, appealing, or seeking redress in PRC. in addition, from my understanding of the afore mentioned regulations/rules, even when a "harmful" website is identified and blocked, just viewing or contributing to the "non-harmful" part of information does not seem to be prohibited, and viewing "harmful" information alone (without disseminating "state secrets") does not seem to be a criminal offense (although it is possible to get fines or in serious cases removal of internet access for 6 months). i hope that i did not sound too offending. if there were mistakes or misinformation, please kindly let me know. sincerely, roc (User:R.O.C) -- 2006/3/14, Brian <brian0918(a)gmail.com>: > Internet access in China following government censorship is becoming > like drug access in the US following the start of the War on Drugs. For > those willing to break the law (ie: everyone), it's becoming easier and > easier to get access to all the possibilities. > > R.O.C wrote: > > >i checked http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikinews/Vote/Zh and found more > >than 10 users who are currently living in mainland. i think that > >wikipedia/wikimedia can be accessed and edited from mainland china as long > >as the user knows how to use proxies or some special browsers. > > > >-roc > > > >2006/3/8, Anthere < Anthere9(a)yahoo.com>: > > > > > >>Erik Moeller wrote: > >> > >> > >>>Chinese Wikinews has long met the formal requirements of a new Wikinews > >>>edition to be launched. There has now been another poll: > >>> > >>>http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikinews/Vote/Zh > >>> > >>>which currently has 36 votes in favor of launching, including many > >>>Chinese Wikipedians, and only one (!) vote opposed. As per the voting > >>>rules, given more than 90% support after a week of voting, this means > >>>that the project can go ahead. > >>> > >>>Are there any objections from the Board to launching the project now? If > >>>I don't hear anything by the end of the week, I presume we can go ahead > >>>and set up the site. > >>> > >>>Erik > >>> > >>> > >>Do it. > >> > >>Ant > >> > >>PS : could mainland chinese vote since they are blocked ? > >>(note that the answer will not change the statement above...) > >> > >>_______________________________________________ > >>foundation-l mailing list > >> foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org > >>http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l > >> > >> > >> > >_______________________________________________ > >foundation-l mailing list > > foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org > > http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > foundation-l mailing list > foundation-l(a)wikimedia.org > http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l >

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Re: [Wikizh-l] [Wikinews-l] [??] Re: [??] Re: Create zh.wikinews.org
by R.O.C 16 Mar '06

16 Mar '06

thanks a lot! brion. the interwiki links all work now. a voting on wikinews logo is ongoing at http://zh.wikinews.org/wiki/Wikinews:%E8%8C%B6%E9%A6%86. roc 2006/3/15, Brion Vibber <brion(a)pobox.com>: > > R.O.C wrote: > > 1) the zh.wikinews logo on upper left corner is missing. there are > > several candidates for this logo on > > http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikinews/Vote/Zh, but i am not clear if > > there is a decision from the chinese wikinews community. (i personally > > prefer http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Wikinews_zh_1.png > > <http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Wikinews_zh_1.png>) > > If we could get a clear one chosen that would be great... > > > 2) problems about the interwiki and interlanguage links in zh.wikinews: > > This should be all fixed now; use ?action=purge on existing pages before > reporting problems in case they're still cached. > > -- brion vibber (brion @ pobox.com) > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wikinews-l mailing list > Wikinews-l(a)Wikimedia.org > http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikinews-l > > > > -- roc (User:R.O.C) --

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Re: [Wikizh-l] [??] Re: [Wikinews-l] [??] Re: Create zh.wikinews.org
by R.O.C 16 Mar '06

16 Mar '06

thank you, brion. there are two more issues on zh.wikinews.org: 1) the zh.wikinews logo on upper left corner is missing. there are several candidates for this logo on http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikinews/Vote/Zh, but i am not clear if there is a decision from the chinese wikinews community. (i personally prefer http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Wikinews_zh_1.png) 2) problems about the interwiki and interlanguage links in zh.wikinews: 2.1) interlanguage links direct to languages on wikipedia instead of wikinews. for example: [[en:Main Page]] directs to the main page on en.wikipedia instead of en.wikinews; 2.2) [[w:中文維基百科]] (chinese version of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Wikipedia) directs to an article named "w:中文維基百科" on zh.wikinews, though [[wikipedia:中文維基百科]] directs to wikipedia; 2.3) however, [[wikipedia:中文維基百科]] directs to en.wikipedia instead of zh.wikipedia, (at this moment [[wikipedia:zh:中文維基百科]] must be used). -- [[user:R.O.C|roc]] 2006/3/14, Brion Vibber <brion(a)pobox.com>: > > clino wrote: > > I can visit the site: > > https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikinews/en/wiki/ > > but why I Can not visit the site of: > > https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikinews/zh/wiki/ > > Fixed; I made a minor mistake in one of the configuration synchronization > scripts and the updated list of databases didn't go to the server that > runs the > SSL interface. > > -- brion vibber (brion @ pobox.com) > > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (Darwin) > Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org > > iD8DBQFEF16kwRnhpk1wk44RAoc6AKDAMCxabQ87028O+mfMndAGr7uHAwCg04RR > ajr2bjJQTqaudYkNWQK7lCc= > =tbzL > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > >

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Fwd: [??] Re: [??] Re: [Wikinews-l] [??] Re: [??] Re: Create zh.wikinews.org
by R.O.C 15 Mar '06

15 Mar '06

我十分認同fdcn的建議。直到今天才注意看了一下 http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org，不過仍然覺得很複雜（儘管花時間學學應該會學會），而且用英文報告對很多中文用戶的確是障礙。下面是fdcn的原文： >我有个政策提议，应当在中文维基的各个项目里增加一错误与建议页，维基人可以就此提出他们在编辑中遇见的Bug和希望达成的功能，最后由专门管理员判断后以适当文字（英？）提交维基的报告系统。我想这样能增加除错及收集建议的广度。至少很多人不知道维基那个报告系统的，也不知如何提交，在互助客栈的提议总被忽略。 > >to R.O.C: >呵呵，我没有考证那段文字的来源，照我的意思，维基既然已支持这种简写，就不应做以后不支持的打算，否则到时对大量已有链接是个灾难。 roc (User:R.O.C) -- On 3/16/06, R. O. C <sdnyroc(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > thank you, amgine, i'm sorry. it seems that both the mailling list and the > bug report system would work more effciently if i use that report system. > i'll contact you shortly on meta for help. > > > roc (User:R.O.C) > > 在 2006/3/15，amgine(a)saewyc.net <amgine(a)saewyc.net> 撰寫： > > > > R.O.C. > > > > It may be easier for the developers if we write bugzilla reports about > > issues for zh.wikinews. If you contact me on my meta account > > ( http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Amgine ) I can help you with > > getting reports for the developers. These reports allow the developers > > to > > organize their tasks, and helps remind them which things need doing and > > how long they've been waiting to be done. > > > > Amgine > > > > > > > thank you, brion. there are two more issues on zh.wikinews.org: > > > > 1) the zh.wikinews logo on upper left corner is missing. there are > several > > candidates for this logo on > > http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikinews/Vote/Zh , > > but i am not clear if there is a decision from the chinese wikinews > > community. (i personally prefer > > http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Wikinews_zh_1.png ) > > > > 2) problems about the interwiki and interlanguage links in zh.wikinews: > > 2.1) interlanguage links direct to languages on wikipedia instead of > > wikinews. for example: [[en:Main Page]] directs to the main page on > > en.wikipedia instead of en.wikinews; > > 2.2 ) [[w:中文維基百科]] (chinese version of > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Wikipedia ) directs to an article > > named > > "w:中文維基百科" on zh.wikinews , though > > [[wikipedia:中文維基百科]] directs to wikipedia; > > > > 2.3) however, [[wikipedia:中文維基百科]] directs to en.wikipedia > > instead of > > zh.wikipedia, (at this moment [[wikipedia:zh:中文維基百科]] must be > > used). > > > > -- > > [[user:R.O.C|roc]] > > R. > _______________________________________________ > Wikinews-l mailing list > Wikinews-l(a)Wikimedia.org > http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikinews-l > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ 維基百科群組瀏覽訂閱: http://groups.google.com/group/zh_wikipedia http://groups.google.com/group/zh_wikipedia/subscribe 通過郵件發言: zh_wikipedia(a)googlegroups.com 維基百科 - 人人可編輯的自由百科 -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---

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Re: [Wikizh-l] [Wikinews-l] [??] Re: [??] Re: Create zh.wikinews.org
by R.O.C 15 Mar '06

15 Mar '06

thank you, amgine, i'm sorry. it seems that both the mailling list and the bug report system would work more effciently if i use that report system. i'll contact you shortly on meta for help. roc (User:R.O.C) 在 2006/3/15，amgine(a)saewyc.net <amgine(a)saewyc.net> 撰寫： > > R.O.C. > > It may be easier for the developers if we write bugzilla reports about > issues for zh.wikinews. If you contact me on my meta account > (http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Amgine) I can help you with > getting reports for the developers. These reports allow the developers to > organize their tasks, and helps remind them which things need doing and > how long they've been waiting to be done. > > Amgine > > > > > thank you, brion. there are two more issues on zh.wikinews.org: > > > > 1) the zh.wikinews logo on upper left corner is missing. there are > several > > candidates for this logo on > > http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikinews/Vote/Zh, > > but i am not clear if there is a decision from the chinese wikinews > > community. (i personally prefer > > http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Wikinews_zh_1.png) > > > > 2) problems about the interwiki and interlanguage links in zh.wikinews: > > 2.1) interlanguage links direct to languages on wikipedia instead of > > wikinews. for example: [[en:Main Page]] directs to the main page on > > en.wikipedia instead of en.wikinews; > > 2.2) [[w:中文維基百科]] (chinese version of > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Wikipedia) directs to an article > > named > > "w:中文維基百科" on zh.wikinews, though > > [[wikipedia:中文維基百科]] directs to wikipedia; > > > > 2.3) however, [[wikipedia:中文維基百科]] directs to en.wikipedia > > instead of > > zh.wikipedia, (at this moment [[wikipedia:zh:中文維基百科]] must be > > used). > > > > -- > > [[user:R.O.C|roc]] > > R. > _______________________________________________ > Wikinews-l mailing list > Wikinews-l(a)Wikimedia.org > http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikinews-l >

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中文維基新聞開設
by THD 14 Mar '06

14 Mar '06

中文維基新聞開設了，網址是http://zh.wikinews.org。

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Re: [Wikizh-l] Create zh.wikinews.org
by Angela 14 Mar '06

14 Mar '06

The Chinese Wikinews is now available at http://zh.wikinews.org/ thanks to Brion. A number of pages are available at <http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/New_language_pre-launch#Chinese.28.E4.B8.AD.…>, some of which might need to be copied over to the new site. Good luck to all involved with this new project. Angela.

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中文維基年會舉辦地點由香港勝出
by THD 14 Mar '06

14 Mar '06

2006中文維基年會在香港就SWOT的分析狀況上海和北京的優勢不足，且劣勢均無解決方法，地方協辦者的參與度不足，均未達到基本要求的標準。以第一輪票選前兩名的香港和台北兩城市來看，台北的優勢雖大於香港，但台北對其劣勢無法提供解決辦法，相對於香港而言，香港不但在第一輪票選獲得第一，且支持者數量遠超過第二名的城市。若以香港和台北兩個城市比較，香港的機會和威脅比較，明顯優於台北。就整體的籌辦過程而言，香港的參與者表現積極，對於各方意見均能合作想出解決方法，在討論過程中，非香港的維基人也能認同現階段香港這個地點，適於舉辦第一屆的中文維基年會，希望所有維基人，共同支持香港維基人來舉辦這次的活動！

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Wikizh-l March 2006