Hi Emmanuel,
Thanks for your detailed help!
Taking it to the logical next step, I've created a wiki page for this campaign:
http://education.wikia.com/wiki/Wikipedia_For_Schools_Offline_Edition
I will do my best to incorporate all your advice there; requesting you to jump in as well!
All are requested to gather here and collaborate! (including mumbai and pune wikipedia lists here as well). Urging the volunteers who obtain the wikipedia for schools dump to enlist themselves here, and we'll be listing the schools that we empower - one by one!
I'm proud to mention that a school I'm volunteering in Pune, where some Teach For India fellows are teaching, is the first "empowered" school, where I've installed Wikipedia for Schools in the computer lab and the office! It's an under-resourced school but now the kids there have access to a wealth of knowledge! And you should see them in action!
Why I created the page in wikia : In Wikipedia, when I went to create a new page, it clearly said the content ought to be encyclopedic in nature - whereas THIS is more of a movement and recruitment page. So to be on the safe side I went to the education wikia where things are a little sparse ;). I've worked with wikia in toastmasters.wikia.com and am comfortable with it. If anyone can establish a good location on wikipedia itself, which doesn't get deleted later, and migrate everything there, it'll be great! There are lots of external links on this so need to be careful.
Further plans (if you guys can help!): 1. A proliferation meetup where a lot of us can get together and copy the dump to our laptop/netbook/USB drive. 1 goes to 20... and we can scale up the project like crazy. 2. To tie up with DVD distributors and bulk-produce, provided the costs are as low as humanly possible. Maybe Wikimedia India could maintain a stock?
(Seemingly Impossible) Requests: 1. Can anybody add a link to versions of Kiwix that work on non-Windows OS's like Linux, Apple, Android? My focus is on Android, for future mobile perspective... 2. Can we get a version of this that doesn't have Image files? Then the size will be much lesser. Of course, that's less attractive, but I'm looking for an opportunity to take this to mobile devices. How can we edit a .ZIM file?
Cheers, Nikhil Sheth +91-966-583-1250 Pune, India www.nikhilsheth.tk Find me on: Twitter http://twitter.com/nikhiljs | Facebookhttp://www.facebook.com/nikjs| LinkedIn http://in.linkedin.com/in/nikhiljs | Google http://www.google.com/profiles/nikhil.js| RangDehttp://www.rangde.org/investor/nikhilsheth Join me on: Pune Documentary Clubhttp://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=138497769525636| Let's Do it Pune http://www.facebook.com/pages/Lets-do-it-Pune/103857326346659 | Toastmasters in Punehttp://www.facebook.com/pages/Toastmasters-in-Pune/148767611833746
On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 12:27 PM, Emmanuel Engelhart <emmanuel@engelhart.org
wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
Hi.
On 20/01/2011 03:29, Nikhil Sheth wrote:
I'm trying to spread wikipedia for schools offline edition in my city/country. Got some interested people to join in the project at the wikipedia 10th anniversary meetup at Mumbai, India.<
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Meetup/Mumbai/WikipediaDay2011%3E,
i've included them in cc.
I've set up a mirror website hosting the large file in parts because
several
people had complained they couldn't download the original thing. http://wikipediaforschools.4shared.com
I wasn't aware of your webpage back then so used a .ZIM file that I found
on
http://www.kiwix.org : schools-wikipedia-full-20081023-rc5.zim
I hope I'm not hosting the wrong file??
This is a great initiative.
The Wikipedia for schools team did not prepare any ZIM file, but provides the collection of articles as a static set of HTML pages and media files directly usable by any browser.
Kiwix (so I) prepared a ZIM file containing exactly these collection of HTML and media files to provide following advantages:
- smaller
- simpler to copy
- Compatible with Kiwix and any ZIM compatbile reader and so provide
additional features like the fulltext search engine for example.
- ...
To answer to your question, yes schools-wikipedia-full-20081023-rc5.zim is the last ZIM of the last Wikipedia for schools selection.
Could you please give me this info: In the press releas<
http://www.soschildrensvillages.org.uk/charity-news/archive/2008/10/2008-wik...
e, a .Torrent file is linked :
http://www.soschildrensvillages.org.uk/static/schools-wikipedia-full-2008102...
I need to know what are the contents of this .tar.gz file. Is it for windows or for linux? Is it the same .zim file only? Is it
using
kiwix or something else? Is it pre-indexed?
I think I have answered before to these questions.
On a blog post I created for this, someone posted a link to a large .zip saying this is a pre-indexed packaged version: http://download.kiwix.org/portable/wikipedia_en_for_schools.zip
I was.
So is that the one I should be going with? The current one I'm hosting
needs
a small first-run procedure that has to be done on every computer I put
it
in, of opening the .zim file from kiwix and then indexing it. Also, I had problems with some older computers - the indexing never took off and we
are
limited to click-browsing on those computers.
Your procedure is OK, but with the ZIP file I have proposed this is simpler: you just need to unzip and use Kiwix, install it if you want. No indexing process is needed any more, this is already done.
We know, they are some weird behaviours related to some specific Win configurations which cause search engine related components failures. This is under investigation and we hope to be able to fix it before the final Kiwix 0.9 release.
In any case, in the "install" directory of Kiwix, you should find this file: http://download.kiwix.org/dev/vcredist_x86.exe
Please install it and it should fix the last problems.
Moving on from the downloading aspect, I want to set up a wiki page that will track the proliferation of Wikipedia for Schools. But I can't figure out where to create it, what name to give it and other things. So need a little help there. (wikipedians, you can help?)
I have no special idea about that, but a few remarks.
Wikipedia for schools is the project of "SOS children village UK" and I'm sure they will be happy to get feedback directly from you.
Kiwix also. We have already a map with involved people, developers and users. So feel free to add new points on it: http://www.kiwix.org/index.php/Map
And finally, could you connect me with more people in India who are associated with this project or may be interested in networking on it? Is there a facebook page on this? Mind if I set one up?
Not a lot of people from India have contact us, but I will send you separately a few email addresses.
I'm personally really interested to any project concerning the spreading of Kiwix and also to any feedback (feature request, bug reports, etc.)
Regards Emmanuel -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/
iEYEARECAAYFAk033PcACgkQn3IpJRpNWtMaBgCfTQ1FdsRUuo/h4dLfpbw2Y7iw 584AoLRv7mJ57fDX/GI3ZxSMUVIvYz0v =yIa9 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
On 01/20/2011 07:35 PM, Nikhil Sheth wrote:
Taking it to the logical next step, I've created a wiki page for this campaign:
http://education.wikia.com/wiki/Wikipedia_For_Schools_Offline_Edition
I have sign up.
I will do my best to incorporate all your advice there; requesting you to jump in as well!
All are requested to gather here and collaborate! (including mumbai and pune wikipedia lists here as well). Urging the volunteers who obtain the wikipedia for schools dump to enlist themselves here, and we'll be listing the schools that we empower - one by one!
I'm proud to mention that a school I'm volunteering in Pune, where some Teach For India fellows are teaching, is the first "empowered" school, where I've installed Wikipedia for Schools in the computer lab and the office! It's an under-resourced school but now the kids there have access to a wealth of knowledge! And you should see them in action!
I'm sure this was a great reward for your work. I never have had this chance!
Why I created the page in wikia : In Wikipedia, when I went to create a new page, it clearly said the content ought to be encyclopedic in nature
- whereas THIS is more of a movement and recruitment page. So to be on
the safe side I went to the education wikia where things are a little sparse ;). I've worked with wikia in toastmasters.wikia.com http://toastmasters.wikia.com and am comfortable with it. If anyone can establish a good location on wikipedia itself, which doesn't get deleted later, and migrate everything there, it'll be great! There are lots of external links on this so need to be careful.
Further plans (if you guys can help!):
- A proliferation meetup where a lot of us can get together and copy
the dump to our laptop/netbook/USB drive. 1 goes to 20... and we can scale up the project like crazy.
Would be great, I'm interested in any simple Ideas/Solutions to build something like a small digital kiosk where people could easily choose what they want to get on their USB stick. The wireless version, something like a WIFI Spot with only one Web Site could also be interesting.
- To tie up with DVD distributors and bulk-produce, provided the costs
are as low as humanly possible. Maybe Wikimedia India could maintain a stock?
I see you have BIG projects, so just an idea: what about something like shipit.wikimedia.in with a similar principle as shipit.ubuntu.com. This would be certainly a logistical and financial challenge... but could be really efficient.
An other good way to spread content fastly and for not too much money is to make a deal with a magazin which will be sell with the DVD... but someone has to take the publishing responsability.
(Seemingly Impossible) Requests:
- Can anybody add a link to versions of Kiwix that work on non-Windows
OS's like Linux, Apple, Android? My focus is on Android, for future mobile perspective...
Kiwix does not work on Android currently, but we should have soon an other ZIM reader which will be able to run on Android.
It's also on the roadmap of Kiwix to be ported to Android, but this shouldn't happen this year.
Otherwise Kiwix is available for MacOSX and GNU/Linux, all the necessary details are on the Kiwix Web site Welcome page.
- Can we get a version of this that doesn't have Image files? Then the
size will be much lesser. Of course, that's less attractive, but I'm looking for an opportunity to take this to mobile devices. How can we edit a .ZIM file?
This should be possible with a little bit work.
Regards Emmanuel
Hi Emmanuel and All,
I've re-christened the Wikipedia For Schools Offline Edition as WFSOE so I can use a short form ;)
Updates: I downloaded the 2.x GB pre-indexed kiwix+zim zip file from kiwix.org. It had a problem on extracting - the .zim file was broken. Emmanuel or folks from Kiwix, could you check? I hope the problem was only on my side. Link: http://download.kiwix.org/portable/wikipedia_en_for_schools.zip(2718mb)
Fortunately I already had gotten the wikipedia for schools .zim file separately, and put it here - and now it works perfectly. The pre-indexed version is much better and I'll be going to the school and replacing what I had previously installed with this version.
I'm uploading the repackaged and working version on my mirror site (this time compressed in 7-zip .7z format and also split, by 7-zip only, into 27x100mb parts): http://www.4shared.com/dir/cwqa0nnC/WFSOE_Full_pre-indexed_with_sc.html (give it a day or two to upload fully)
...And also have put up just the kiwix software in that package, without the .zim file. http://www.4shared.com/file/_yQEKn2r/WFSOE_with_kiwix-09alpha7_with.html (107mb)
So, people who already have the schools-wikipedia-full-20081023-rc5.zim file can simply put it in and start using it. This whole folder, downloaded by either of the above options, can then be directly copied over to a DVD or USB drive and it will become an auto-launching thing then.
I've made a detailed blog post of this whole process with screenshots, including shots of the working encyclopedia. http://nikhilsheth.blogspot.com/2011/01/troubleshooting-wikipedia-for-school...
I'll make these updates on the wiki page soon. http://education.wikia.com/wiki/Wikipedia_For_Schools_Offline_Edition
It would be great if someone can download from the above links and let me know if it's all working properly or not. Do let me know if I'm doing anything wrong here.
Cheers, Nikhil Sheth +91-966-583-1250 Pune, India Teach For India http://www.teachforindia.org Fellow, 2011-13 www.nikhilsheth.tk Find me on: Twitter http://twitter.com/nikhiljs | Facebookhttp://www.facebook.com/nikjs| LinkedIn http://in.linkedin.com/in/nikhiljs | Google http://www.google.com/profiles/nikhil.js| RangDehttp://www.rangde.org/investor/nikhilsheth Join me on: Pune Documentary Clubhttp://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=138497769525636| Let's Do it Pune http://www.facebook.com/pages/Lets-do-it-Pune/103857326346659 | Toastmasters in Punehttp://www.facebook.com/pages/Toastmasters-in-Pune/148767611833746
On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 1:18 AM, Emmanuel Engelhart emmanuel@engelhart.orgwrote:
On 01/20/2011 07:35 PM, Nikhil Sheth wrote:
Taking it to the logical next step, I've created a wiki page for this campaign:
http://education.wikia.com/wiki/Wikipedia_For_Schools_Offline_Edition
I have sign up.
I will do my best to incorporate all your advice there; requesting you to jump in as well!
All are requested to gather here and collaborate! (including mumbai and pune wikipedia lists here as well). Urging the volunteers who obtain the wikipedia for schools dump to enlist themselves here, and we'll be listing the schools that we empower - one by one!
I'm proud to mention that a school I'm volunteering in Pune, where some Teach For India fellows are teaching, is the first "empowered" school, where I've installed Wikipedia for Schools in the computer lab and the office! It's an under-resourced school but now the kids there have access to a wealth of knowledge! And you should see them in action!
I'm sure this was a great reward for your work. I never have had this chance!
Why I created the page in wikia : In Wikipedia, when I went to create a new page, it clearly said the content ought to be encyclopedic in nature
- whereas THIS is more of a movement and recruitment page. So to be on
the safe side I went to the education wikia where things are a little sparse ;). I've worked with wikia in toastmasters.wikia.com http://toastmasters.wikia.com and am comfortable with it. If anyone can establish a good location on wikipedia itself, which doesn't get deleted later, and migrate everything there, it'll be great! There are lots of external links on this so need to be careful.
Further plans (if you guys can help!):
- A proliferation meetup where a lot of us can get together and copy
the dump to our laptop/netbook/USB drive. 1 goes to 20... and we can scale up the project like crazy.
Would be great, I'm interested in any simple Ideas/Solutions to build something like a small digital kiosk where people could easily choose what they want to get on their USB stick. The wireless version, something like a WIFI Spot with only one Web Site could also be interesting.
- To tie up with DVD distributors and bulk-produce, provided the costs
are as low as humanly possible. Maybe Wikimedia India could maintain a stock?
I see you have BIG projects, so just an idea: what about something like shipit.wikimedia.in with a similar principle as shipit.ubuntu.com. This would be certainly a logistical and financial challenge... but could be really efficient.
An other good way to spread content fastly and for not too much money is to make a deal with a magazin which will be sell with the DVD... but someone has to take the publishing responsability.
(Seemingly Impossible) Requests:
- Can anybody add a link to versions of Kiwix that work on non-Windows
OS's like Linux, Apple, Android? My focus is on Android, for future mobile perspective...
Kiwix does not work on Android currently, but we should have soon an other ZIM reader which will be able to run on Android.
It's also on the roadmap of Kiwix to be ported to Android, but this shouldn't happen this year.
Otherwise Kiwix is available for MacOSX and GNU/Linux, all the necessary details are on the Kiwix Web site Welcome page.
- Can we get a version of this that doesn't have Image files? Then the
size will be much lesser. Of course, that's less attractive, but I'm looking for an opportunity to take this to mobile devices. How can we edit a .ZIM file?
This should be possible with a little bit work.
Regards Emmanuel
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
On 22/01/2011 13:08, Nikhil Sheth wrote:
I've re-christened the Wikipedia For Schools Offline Edition as WFSOE so I can use a short form ;)
Why not :)
Updates: I downloaded the 2.x GB pre-indexed kiwix+zim zip file from kiwix.org. It had a problem on extracting - the .zim file was broken. Emmanuel or folks from Kiwix, could you check? I hope the problem was only on my side. Link: http://download.kiwix.org/portable/wikipedia_en_for_schools.zip(2718mb)
I have checked again, and the ZIP file is valid.
I'm uploading the repackaged and working version on my mirror site (this time compressed in 7-zip .7z format and also split, by 7-zip only, into 27x100mb parts): http://www.4shared.com/dir/cwqa0nnC/WFSOE_Full_pre-indexed_with_sc.html (give it a day or two to upload fully)
...And also have put up just the kiwix software in that package, without the .zim file. http://www.4shared.com/file/_yQEKn2r/WFSOE_with_kiwix-09alpha7_with.html (107mb)
So, people who already have the schools-wikipedia-full-20081023-rc5.zim file can simply put it in and start using it. This whole folder, downloaded by either of the above options, can then be directly copied over to a DVD or USB drive and it will become an auto-launching thing then.
I've made a detailed blog post of this whole process with screenshots, including shots of the working encyclopedia. http://nikhilsheth.blogspot.com/2011/01/troubleshooting-wikipedia-for-school...
I'll make these updates on the wiki page soon. http://education.wikia.com/wiki/Wikipedia_For_Schools_Offline_Edition
It would be great if someone can download from the above links and let me know if it's all working properly or not. Do let me know if I'm doing anything wrong here.
It works.
Regards Emmanuel
All - thanks so much for your work here; this is fantastic progress and incredibly helpful for the offline work at large.
On 1/20/2011 11:48 AM, Emmanuel Engelhart wrote:
- A proliferation meetup where a lot of us can get together and copy
the dump to our laptop/netbook/USB drive. 1 goes to 20... and we can scale up the project like crazy.
Would be great, I'm interested in any simple Ideas/Solutions to build something like a small digital kiosk where people could easily choose what they want to get on their USB stick. The wireless version, something like a WIFI Spot with only one Web Site could also be interesting.
Having some sort of dedicated offline meet-up is something that a few of us have been talking about for the past month or so, so I'm glad it was brought up again. Logistically, when do we think this could happen? Although it is a couple months away, an easy way to leverage an existing organizational plan would be to tack onto the Chapter's meeting in Berlin at the end of March. Europe would also be a relatively central meeting place for us.
Thoughts? Availability? Once we carve out a block of time, we can work out a schedule of most important things to tackle and discuss (I also have lots of suggestions ;).
Hi Jessie and All,
Thanks so much for the appreciation.
Request: I want to get an Offline edition of the Hindi, Marathi and Gujrati Wikipedia. (Indian languages) - preferably in the .ZIM format. I read about Malayalam / Tamil offline versions being in the works, but not in .ZIM
Why I advocate .ZIM is that it turns wikipedia into an easily search-able single-file E-book, hence making it so much more portable (Try moving the other forms having 1000s of files between drives and you'll get what I'm talking about). Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Emmanuel and his team have actually assembled the largest ebooks that mankind has ever seen. If we give it a spin like that and give an alternate description of Kiwix as a new kind of ebook-reader for reading very very large volumes with very low memory footprint, then we can probably catch even more attention and we might even witness other publishers switching to something like it.
But I digress, so back to my task.. I have no clue how we can create the .ZIM files (don't have the expertise to see and understand the format specifications), and I understand that Wikipedia dumps creation aren't there for anybody or else the servers would be brought down.
So can anyone help with obtaining Hindi / other Indian languages Wikipedia? The reason I'm asking for them is: I'm trying to take the Wikipeida For Schools to under-resourced schools in my country and in most, it would be much, much easier to get permission from authorities to install and spread it if I actually gave them an Indian language wikipedia and bundled the Wikipedia for Schools with it. In their minds, getting the indian language one on their computers may be a much bigger novelty.
So, to hypothesize, if I handed over to a municipality in my state (Maharashtra, India, main language is Marathi) a DVD having just "Wikipedia For Schools", they may just keep it at the side and forget about it. But if I gave them a DVD having the "Complete Hindi and Marathi Wikipedia, plus Wikipedia for Schools free!" then I think that will catch more attention. This is just hypothetical, of course, but I want to give it a shot!
The Kiwix/ZIM Wikipedia For Schools package is about 2.7 GBs only when burnt to DVD, so there's plenty of room for putting more stuff, even for pen drives as we'll be using a 4GB pen drive.
------------------------------------------------ Further troubleshooting: (now moving into further exploring)
The Kiwix+Wikipedia for Schools package is a portable version of Kiwix with the index and library file already built and stored inside the root\data folder (size 141MB)
When I opened wikipedia_en_wp1_0.7_30000+_05_2009_beta3.zim in the same software, it did not create the library and index for the same inside this package; rather it is stored elsewhere on my comp and I can't find it. (I'm on Win 7 by the way)
If I want to share other versions on Wikipedia in a ready-to-run form, I will need to create and have the index inside the Kiwix software's folder. Or else on every new computer there will be a lengthy indexing process which is wasteful and might actually result in non-use by people who don't know how to go about it.
So, how can one go about it? Making Kiwix such that any .ZIM file it opens and indexes, the index is stored INSIDE the program folder rather than anywhere else? Or maybe such that it does BOTH and checks one source first and the other later?
Also, what is the command-line syntax for opening Kiwix with a particular .ZIM file? I want to have a package of multiple instant options, so that if someone double-clicks on a "Wikipedia for schools" shortcut or .bat or .exe then that opens; if someone double-clicks a "Hindi Wikipedia" then that opens, and so forth.
Cheers, Nikhil Sheth +91-966-583-1250 Pune, India Teach For India http://www.teachforindia.org/ Fellow, 2011-13 www.nikhilsheth.tk Find me on: Twitter http://twitter.com/nikhiljs | Facebookhttp://www.facebook.com/nikjs| LinkedIn http://in.linkedin.com/in/nikhiljs | Google http://www.google.com/profiles/nikhil.js| RangDehttp://www.rangde.org/investor/nikhilsheth Join me on: Pune Documentary Clubhttp://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=138497769525636| Let's Do it Pune http://www.facebook.com/pages/Lets-do-it-Pune/103857326346659 | Toastmasters in Punehttp://www.facebook.com/pages/Toastmasters-in-Pune/148767611833746| Wikipedia For Schools projecthttp://education.wikia.com/wiki/Wikipedia_For_Schools_Offline_Edition
On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 11:57 PM, Jessie Wild jwild@wikimedia.org wrote:
All - thanks so much for your work here; this is fantastic progress and incredibly helpful for the offline work at large.
On 1/20/2011 11:48 AM, Emmanuel Engelhart wrote:
- A proliferation meetup where a lot of us can get together and copy
the dump to our laptop/netbook/USB drive. 1 goes to 20... and we can scale up the project like crazy.
Would be great, I'm interested in any simple Ideas/Solutions to build something like a small digital kiosk where people could easily choose what they want to get on their USB stick. The wireless version, something like a WIFI Spot with only one Web Site could also be interesting.
Having some sort of dedicated offline meet-up is something that a few of us have been talking about for the past month or so, so I'm glad it was brought up again. Logistically, when do we think this could happen? Although it is a couple months away, an easy way to leverage an existing organizational plan would be to tack onto the Chapter's meeting in Berlin at the end of March. Europe would also be a relatively central meeting place for us.
Thoughts? Availability? Once we carve out a block of time, we can work out a schedule of most important things to tackle and discuss (I also have lots of suggestions ;).
-- Jessie Wild Special Projects Manager Global Development Wikimedia Foundation
On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 10:11 AM, Nikhil Sheth nikhil.js@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Jessie and All,
Thanks so much for the appreciation.
Request: I want to get an Offline edition of the Hindi, Marathi and Gujrati Wikipedia. (Indian languages) - preferably in the .ZIM format. I read about Malayalam / Tamil offline versions being in the works, but not in .ZIM
I am interested in this as well, with specific interest on Telugu
wikipedia. However, there is lot of work needed to curate the language wikipedia articles for Schools and ensure that the collection is free of spelling errors and has non controversial content suitable for school children.
If you want to make a begining, you can provide a pdf of featured articles to start with, as Telugu wikipedians experimented in the recent Wiki Ten celebrations at Hyderabad.
Cheers Arjun
Due to various reasons, using *the whole dump of a language wikipedia* for the offline version is not recommended especially if you are planning to distribute the CD/DVD to schools. Apart from the copyright violation of the images (check the license of images across various wiks) there are many other points to be considered while creating an offline version.
Did any one discussed with the respective language wiki community before decided to create the offline version? In the end it is the respective language community who need to answer various queries once the whole dump of wiki reach the school childern through CD/DVD.
Malayalam wiki community has indeed tried the Kiwix solution before we decided to develop our own solution. It is sad to find that still Kiwix is not in a state where we can create the CD/DVD with out the developer/expert support. But it is good to see that the issue with non-latin scripts/fonts are fixed. But the article selection feature needs to be enabled for Kiwix so that any one can create their own version of Wikipedia CD (as can be done using Wiki2CD).
But the point here is not the software, whether we need to provide whole dump of a wiki to schools. Definitely I am not for it due to my experience with the Malayalam Wikipedia CD.
Shiju
On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 5:41 AM, Nikhil Sheth nikhil.js@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Jessie and All,
Thanks so much for the appreciation.
Request: I want to get an Offline edition of the Hindi, Marathi and Gujrati Wikipedia. (Indian languages) - preferably in the .ZIM format. I read about Malayalam / Tamil offline versions being in the works, but not in .ZIM
Why I advocate .ZIM is that it turns wikipedia into an easily search-able single-file E-book, hence making it so much more portable (Try moving the other forms having 1000s of files between drives and you'll get what I'm talking about). Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Emmanuel and his team have actually assembled the largest ebooks that mankind has ever seen. If we give it a spin like that and give an alternate description of Kiwix as a new kind of ebook-reader for reading very very large volumes with very low memory footprint, then we can probably catch even more attention and we might even witness other publishers switching to something like it.
But I digress, so back to my task.. I have no clue how we can create the .ZIM files (don't have the expertise to see and understand the format specifications), and I understand that Wikipedia dumps creation aren't there for anybody or else the servers would be brought down.
So can anyone help with obtaining Hindi / other Indian languages Wikipedia? The reason I'm asking for them is: I'm trying to take the Wikipeida For Schools to under-resourced schools in my country and in most, it would be much, much easier to get permission from authorities to install and spread it if I actually gave them an Indian language wikipedia and bundled the Wikipedia for Schools with it. In their minds, getting the indian language one on their computers may be a much bigger novelty.
So, to hypothesize, if I handed over to a municipality in my state (Maharashtra, India, main language is Marathi) a DVD having just "Wikipedia For Schools", they may just keep it at the side and forget about it. But if I gave them a DVD having the "Complete Hindi and Marathi Wikipedia, plus Wikipedia for Schools free!" then I think that will catch more attention. This is just hypothetical, of course, but I want to give it a shot!
The Kiwix/ZIM Wikipedia For Schools package is about 2.7 GBs only when burnt to DVD, so there's plenty of room for putting more stuff, even for pen drives as we'll be using a 4GB pen drive.
Further troubleshooting: (now moving into further exploring)
The Kiwix+Wikipedia for Schools package is a portable version of Kiwix with the index and library file already built and stored inside the root\data folder (size 141MB)
When I opened wikipedia_en_wp1_0.7_30000+_05_2009_beta3.zim in the same software, it did not create the library and index for the same inside this package; rather it is stored elsewhere on my comp and I can't find it. (I'm on Win 7 by the way)
If I want to share other versions on Wikipedia in a ready-to-run form, I will need to create and have the index inside the Kiwix software's folder. Or else on every new computer there will be a lengthy indexing process which is wasteful and might actually result in non-use by people who don't know how to go about it.
So, how can one go about it? Making Kiwix such that any .ZIM file it opens and indexes, the index is stored INSIDE the program folder rather than anywhere else? Or maybe such that it does BOTH and checks one source first and the other later?
Also, what is the command-line syntax for opening Kiwix with a particular .ZIM file? I want to have a package of multiple instant options, so that if someone double-clicks on a "Wikipedia for schools" shortcut or .bat or .exe then that opens; if someone double-clicks a "Hindi Wikipedia" then that opens, and so forth.
Cheers, Nikhil Sheth tel:+919665831250+91-966-583-1250 tel:+919665831250 Pune, India Teach For India http://www.teachforindia.org/ Fellow, 2011-13 www.nikhilsheth.tk Find me on: Twitter http://twitter.com/nikhiljs | Facebookhttp://www.facebook.com/nikjs| LinkedIn http://in.linkedin.com/in/nikhiljs | Google http://www.google.com/profiles/nikhil.js| RangDehttp://www.rangde.org/investor/nikhilsheth Join me on: Pune Documentary Clubhttp://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=138497769525636| Let's Do it Pune http://www.facebook.com/pages/Lets-do-it-Pune/103857326346659| Toastmasters in Punehttp://www.facebook.com/pages/Toastmasters-in-Pune/148767611833746| Wikipedia For Schools projecthttp://education.wikia.com/wiki/Wikipedia_For_Schools_Offline_Edition
On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 11:57 PM, Jessie Wild jwild@wikimedia.org wrote:
All - thanks so much for your work here; this is fantastic progress and incredibly helpful for the offline work at large.
On 1/20/2011 11:48 AM, Emmanuel Engelhart wrote:
- A proliferation meetup where a lot of us can get together and copy
the dump to our laptop/netbook/USB drive. 1 goes to 20... and we can scale up the project like crazy.
Would be great, I'm interested in any simple Ideas/Solutions to build something like a small digital kiosk where people could easily choose what they want to get on their USB stick. The wireless version, something like a WIFI Spot with only one Web Site could also be interesting.
Having some sort of dedicated offline meet-up is something that a few of us have been talking about for the past month or so, so I'm glad it was brought up again. Logistically, when do we think this could happen? Although it is a couple months away, an easy way to leverage an existing organizational plan would be to tack onto the Chapter's meeting in Berlin at the end of March. Europe would also be a relatively central meeting place for us.
Thoughts? Availability? Once we carve out a block of time, we can work out a schedule of most important things to tackle and discuss (I also have lots of suggestions ;).
-- Jessie Wild Special Projects Manager Global Development Wikimedia Foundation
Offline-l mailing list Offline-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/offline-l
On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 1:02 PM, Shiju Alex shijualexonline@gmail.com wrote:
Malayalam wiki community has indeed tried the Kiwix solution before we decided to develop our own solution. It is sad to find that still Kiwix is not in a state where we can create the CD/DVD with out the developer/expert support. But it is good to see that the issue with non-latin scripts/fonts are fixed. But the article selection feature needs to be enabled for Kiwix so that any one can create their own version of Wikipedia CD (as can be done using Wiki2CD).
I agree Kiwix should provide an easy way to create a custom selection and make a ZIM of it. It is not disabled or hidden ; everything is documented on the Kiwix wiki and sources are available. The problem is that it's difficult and painful. What we could do is create a tool on top of existing ones that would allow easy selection/zim-creation.
Why did you decide to go with your own custom solution (that's what is implied by your message, sorry if it's not the case) instead of contributing to Kiwix so that other projects can benefit from this all ; aka the reader, the tools, the standard, etc.
I find it offensive to the only spare-time developer of Kiwix that you reproach the lack of features but still decide to build something on your own.
But the point here is not the software, whether we need to provide whole dump of a wiki to schools. Definitely I am not for it due to my experience with the Malayalam Wikipedia CD.
Can you elaborate ? This is very fuzzy. I agree though that schools-targeted versions should include school-friendly content (whatever that means locally) ; that's why SOS version is so successful.
renaud
Why did you decide to go with your own custom solution (that's what is
implied by your message, sorry if it's not the case) instead of
contributing to Kiwix so that other projects can benefit from this all
; aka the reader, the tools, the standard, etc.
Sorry if you find it offensive. I never meant it like that. We released the CD/DVD in 2010 April. The reasons for developing Wiki2CD is documented at http://thottingal.in/blog/2010/04/17/mlwikioncd/ and http://shijualex.wordpress.com/2010/04/24/creating-malayalam-wikipedia-cd/
I agree though that schools-targeted versions should include
school-friendly content (whatever that means locally) ; that's why SOS
version is so successful.
That itself is the reason. English SOS version is very good. My point is, all offline versions that are targeting the schools (including Hindi and Marathi) should be created in the same way.
Yeah
On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 6:44 PM, renaud gaudin rgaudin@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 1:02 PM, Shiju Alex shijualexonline@gmail.com wrote:
Malayalam wiki community has indeed tried the Kiwix solution before we decided to develop our own solution. It is sad to find that still Kiwix
is
not in a state where we can create the CD/DVD with out the
developer/expert
support. But it is good to see that the issue with non-latin
scripts/fonts
are fixed. But the article selection feature needs to be enabled for
Kiwix
so that any one can create their own version of Wikipedia CD (as can be
done
using Wiki2CD).
I agree Kiwix should provide an easy way to create a custom selection and make a ZIM of it. It is not disabled or hidden ; everything is documented on the Kiwix wiki and sources are available. The problem is that it's difficult and painful. What we could do is create a tool on top of existing ones that would allow easy selection/zim-creation.
Why did you decide to go with your own custom solution (that's what is implied by your message, sorry if it's not the case) instead of contributing to Kiwix so that other projects can benefit from this all ; aka the reader, the tools, the standard, etc.
I find it offensive to the only spare-time developer of Kiwix that you reproach the lack of features but still decide to build something on your own.
But the point here is not the software, whether we need to provide whole dump of a wiki to schools. Definitely I am not for it due to my
experience
with the Malayalam Wikipedia CD.
Can you elaborate ? This is very fuzzy. I agree though that schools-targeted versions should include school-friendly content (whatever that means locally) ; that's why SOS version is so successful.
renaud
Offline-l mailing list Offline-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/offline-l
Hi
I want with this email to correct a few points which were many times in the past wrong communicated.
On Tue, 1 Feb 2011 18:32:47 +0530, Shiju Alex shijualexonline@gmail.com wrote:
It is sad to find that still Kiwix is not in a state where we can create the CD/DVD with out the developer/expert support. But it is good to see that the issue with non-latin scripts/fonts are fixed.
The Kiwix project has being releasing CDs/DVDs since more than 4 years: we have a lot of know-how and tools to do that. All what we have done in Kiwix is free software and easily downloadable and I answer to every questions about it. I admit they are tools which are not trivial to understand... but I have to say also, a big part of the complexity is in the Mediawiki code tweaks. Developing his own full solution because you have difficulties to understand the existing one seems to me to be simply a wrong approach. As far as I know, there is nothing (excepting the dynamic transliteration in the search field) that Kiwix does not provide that your solution provides. Kiwix has no known issue (also last year) specific to non-latin languages, if you know one please make a bug report. I have released in the past DVDs in Farsi and Burmese and both run well.
The added value of the Malayalam CD is IMO not in the software but in the content and the work behind.
If you want to enjoy both (Kiwix+Malayalam selection), simply download the ZIM file of the Malayalam CD content here: http://tmp.kiwix.org/zim/0.9/wikipedia_ml_500+_05_2010_beta2.zim
... I'm sure you have Kiwix already installed ;)
Emmanuel
Hi
On Tue, 1 Feb 2011 10:11:03 +0530, Nikhil Sheth nikhil.js@gmail.com wrote:
Request: I want to get an Offline edition of the Hindi, Marathi and Gujrati Wikipedia. (Indian languages) - preferably in the .ZIM format. I read about Malayalam / Tamil offline versions being in the works, but not in .ZIM
If you want a special ZIM, you may make a request to Kiwix: http://requestafeature.kiwix.org
For these languages this should not be a problem for me to quickly make a ZIM with all main namespace articles.
For the Malayalam you have already two ZIMs: * http://tmp.kiwix.org/zim/0.9/wikipedia_ml_500+_05_2010_beta2.zim * http://tmp.kiwix.org/zim/0.9/wikipedia_ml_all_06_2010_beta1.zim
I have no clue how we can create the .ZIM files (don't have the expertise to see and understand the format specifications), and I understand that Wikipedia dumps creation aren't there for anybody or else the servers would be brought down.
Yes, creating ZIM file is unfortunately still too complicated... but this pain point will be improved :)
Further troubleshooting: (now moving into further exploring)
The Kiwix+Wikipedia for Schools package is a portable version of Kiwix with the index and library file already built and stored inside the rootdata folder (size 141MB)
When I opened wikipedia_en_wp1_0.7_30000+_05_2009_beta3.zim in the same software, it did not create the library and index for the same inside this package; rather it is stored elsewhere on my comp and I can't find it. (I'm on Win 7 by the way)
It's created in user profile application_data directory. We want to improve that point too to allow user to save this index&library somewhere else.
If I want to share other versions on Wikipedia in a ready-to-run form, I will need to create and have the index inside the Kiwix software's folder. Or else on every new computer there will be a lengthy indexing process which is wasteful and might actually result in non-use by people who don't know how to go about it.
So, how can one go about it? Making Kiwix such that any .ZIM file it opens and indexes, the index is stored INSIDE the program folder rather than anywhere else? Or maybe such that it does BOTH and checks one source first and the other later?
Have a look to the library xml in the "data" directory of the portable version. The library file describes where is the content and the index. You simply have to create a new one in the "library" directory similar but for your new content. If you still have questions, please contact me directly or join us on IRC #kiwix channel.
Also, what is the command-line syntax for opening Kiwix with a particular .ZIM file?
I want to have a package of multiple instant options, so that if someone double-clicks on a "Wikipedia for schools" shortcut or .bat or .exe then that opens; if someone double-clicks a "Hindi Wikipedia" then that opens, and so forth.
I fully understand your use case. This is not possible currently. This has to be done... again please open a feature request if this is important for you.
Emmanuel
On Wed, 02 Feb 2011 08:04:54 +0100, emmanuel@engelhart.org wrote:
On Tue, 1 Feb 2011 10:11:03 +0530, Nikhil Sheth nikhil.js@gmail.com wrote:
Request: I want to get an Offline edition of the Hindi, Marathi and Gujrati Wikipedia. (Indian languages) - preferably in the .ZIM format. I read about Malayalam / Tamil offline versions being in the works, but not in .ZIM
If you want a special ZIM, you may make a request to Kiwix: http://requestafeature.kiwix.org
For these languages this should not be a problem for me to quickly make a ZIM with all main namespace articles.
Done: * http://tmp.kiwix.org/zim/0.9/wikipedia_hi_all_01_2011_beta1.zim * http://tmp.kiwix.org/zim/0.9/wikipedia_gu_all_01_2011_beta1.zim * http://tmp.kiwix.org/zim/0.9/wikipedia_mr_all_01_2011_beta1.zim
Emmanuel
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
On 02/02/2011 08:04, emmanuel@engelhart.org wrote:
Also, what is the command-line syntax for opening Kiwix with a particular .ZIM file?
I want to have a package of multiple instant options, so that if someone double-clicks on a "Wikipedia for schools" shortcut or .bat or .exe then that opens; if someone double-clicks a "Hindi Wikipedia" then that opens, and so forth.
I fully understand your use case. This is not possible currently. This has to be done... again please open a feature request if this is important for you.
I have implemented that feature a few hours ago. I have tested on GNU/Linux and Windows and it seems to work. Simply call kiwix.exe, kiwix.sh or directly xulrunner with as argument a ZIM file path. Available in next release (so a few weeks).
Emmanuel
Hi,
Am 31.01.2011 19:27, schrieb Jessie Wild:
Although it is a couple months away, an easy way to leverage an existing organizational plan would be to tack onto the Chapter's meeting in Berlin at the end of March. Europe would also be a relatively central meeting place for us.
would be fine for me - but it should be a day _before_ the chapters meeting then as I am participating there as well.
/Manuel
Hi Nikhil,
You had ported an English Wikipedia for Schools to the portable ZIM file format for distribution. However that edition consists of articles selected for the Western milieu by SOS Children's Village Project. It needs tweaking to be relevant to our environment. Plus, we will need to collect equivalent sets for each Indian Language. Probably, some wikipedias may not have equivalent inter-wikis and will need fresh articles written for them.
I have begun listing the articles of the SOS version of Wikipedia for Schools ( I have the torrent/html version). Once we have listed them all, we'll customise it for India. It's begun on Wikimedia India as a Project by me. Find it here :
http://wikimedia.in/wiki/Wikipedia_for_Schools_-_Indian_version
Warm regards,
Ashwin Baindur ------------------------------------------------------
On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 4:27 PM, Manuel Schneider manuel.schneider@wikimedia.ch wrote:
Hi,
Am 31.01.2011 19:27, schrieb Jessie Wild:
Although it is a couple months away, an easy way to leverage an existing organizational plan would be to tack onto the Chapter's meeting in Berlin at the end of March. Europe would also be a relatively central meeting place for us.
would be fine for me - but it should be a day _before_ the chapters meeting then as I am participating there as well.
/Manuel
-- Regards Manuel Schneider
Wikimedia CH - Verein zur Förderung Freien Wissens Wikimedia CH - Association for the advancement of free knowledge www.wikimedia.ch
Wikimedia-IN-PUN mailing list Wikimedia-IN-PUN@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-in-pun
Hi Ashwin,
Thanks, but with all due respect, I have a few doubts and concerns. I've shared them on the talk page.
http://wikimedia.in/wiki/Talk:Wikipedia_for_Schools_-_Indian_version
Cheers, Nikhil Sheth +91-966-583-1250 Pune, India Teach For India http://www.teachforindia.org/ Fellow, 2011-13 www.nikhilsheth.tk Find me on: Twitter http://twitter.com/nikhiljs | Facebookhttp://www.facebook.com/nikjs| LinkedIn http://in.linkedin.com/in/nikhiljs | Google http://www.google.com/profiles/nikhil.js| RangDehttp://www.rangde.org/investor/nikhilsheth Join me on: Pune Documentary Clubhttp://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=138497769525636| Let's Do it Pune http://www.facebook.com/pages/Lets-do-it-Pune/103857326346659 | Toastmasters in Punehttp://www.facebook.com/pages/Toastmasters-in-Pune/148767611833746| Wikipedia For Schools projecthttp://education.wikia.com/wiki/Wikipedia_For_Schools_Offline_Edition
On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 5:15 PM, Ashwin Baindur ashwin.baindur@gmail.comwrote:
Hi Nikhil,
You had ported an English Wikipedia for Schools to the portable ZIM file format for distribution. However that edition consists of articles selected for the Western milieu by SOS Children's Village Project. It needs tweaking to be relevant to our environment. Plus, we will need to collect equivalent sets for each Indian Language. Probably, some wikipedias may not have equivalent inter-wikis and will need fresh articles written for them.
I have begun listing the articles of the SOS version of Wikipedia for Schools ( I have the torrent/html version). Once we have listed them all, we'll customise it for India. It's begun on Wikimedia India as a Project by me. Find it here :
http://wikimedia.in/wiki/Wikipedia_for_Schools_-_Indian_version
Warm regards,
Ashwin Baindur
On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 4:27 PM, Manuel Schneider manuel.schneider@wikimedia.ch wrote:
Hi,
Am 31.01.2011 19:27, schrieb Jessie Wild:
Although it is a couple months away, an easy way to leverage an existing organizational plan would be to tack onto the Chapter's meeting in Berlin at the end of March. Europe would also be a relatively central meeting place for us.
would be fine for me - but it should be a day _before_ the chapters meeting then as I am participating there as well.
/Manuel
-- Regards Manuel Schneider
Wikimedia CH - Verein zur Förderung Freien Wissens Wikimedia CH - Association for the advancement of free knowledge www.wikimedia.ch
Wikimedia-IN-PUN mailing list Wikimedia-IN-PUN@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-in-pun
Wikimedia-IN-PUN mailing list Wikimedia-IN-PUN@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-in-pun
Hi Nikhil,
Thank you for your detailed comments. I agree with you that there is a need for our kids to be internationally relevant and I respect your inclusionist approach. There are a few points to make:
Firstly, your contention that India-specific information is available all around is a falllacy. I can find more information easily about the Bastille than I can about Shaniwarwada.
Secondly, prima facie, all the articles are not necessarily relevant, there appears to be some ad hocism here also. For example, I cannot understand why this article was added Apaochi but no Kublai Khan. Similarly the chosen article "caveman" really sucks. They should have added "Human evolution" instead. I understand this kindof curating involves tremendous amount of work. I'm also criticising post-event which is so easy to do. But my point is, they have a wonderful first version - but its exactly that, as far as choice & development is concerned - a first version, which can be improved.
Secondly, the plan is to go over our class text books from 3rd to 10th and check that every important subject is included which the children would have questions about. Also important topics from our culture, environment, current affairs, etc are added which they may want to ask about.
Thirdly, space will be a constraint if the encyclopedia is to be on one DVD only so that some items would have to be excluded to make way for the new ones. Also, why retain articles like Boadecia or Elizabethan Poor Law which more than 95% Indians will never have come across or never will?
Fourthly, Indic language Wikipedias are more likely to have topics of Indian interest and very few about the rest of the world. Too many articles outside our milieu will result in our inability to gather enough articles in that language for an offline Wikipedia.
This task of mine will take quite some time. I plan to ask domain experts in both the teaching of children and the subject matters to help us select appropriate articles.
I agree that there should be an international edition too. But I feel there is tremendous scope for improvement on this version to achieve that goal also. If the encyclopaedia is actually to be made relevant to the world than there is a huge amount of critical examination of articles to be done and then articles added, expanded, rewritten, improved etc. Just making a good choice of articles to compile an encyclopedia is not enough, even on English Wikipedia. Let the Universal edition be another fork on which interested parties may work.
To conclude, I do not take it as a given that every thing is hunky dorey. Without meaning disrespect for the absolutely wonderful work and colossal efforts put in by the SOS Children's village Wikipedia team, I personally would like to tweak it so as to suit the Indian palate. I too am part of the world movement but I consider it a glocal one, not a global one. At this point of the time, I'm looking at how to make the world relevant to our locality.
Respectfully, AshLin
Warm regards,
Ashwin Baindur ------------------------------------------------------
On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 6:20 PM, Nikhil Sheth nikhil.js@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Ashwin,
Thanks, but with all due respect, I have a few doubts and concerns. I've shared them on the talk page.
http://wikimedia.in/wiki/Talk:Wikipedia_for_Schools_-_Indian_version
Cheers, Nikhil Sheth +91-966-583-1250 Pune, India Teach For India Fellow, 2011-13 www.nikhilsheth.tk Find me on: Twitter | Facebook | LinkedIn | Google | RangDe Join me on: Pune Documentary Club | Let's Do it Pune | Toastmasters in Pune | Wikipedia For Schools project
On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 5:15 PM, Ashwin Baindur ashwin.baindur@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Nikhil,
You had ported an English Wikipedia for Schools to the portable ZIM file format for distribution. However that edition consists of articles selected for the Western milieu by SOS Children's Village Project. It needs tweaking to be relevant to our environment. Plus, we will need to collect equivalent sets for each Indian Language. Probably, some wikipedias may not have equivalent inter-wikis and will need fresh articles written for them.
I have begun listing the articles of the SOS version of Wikipedia for Schools ( I have the torrent/html version). Once we have listed them all, we'll customise it for India. It's begun on Wikimedia India as a Project by me. Find it here :
http://wikimedia.in/wiki/Wikipedia_for_Schools_-_Indian_version
Warm regards,
Ashwin Baindur
On 2/1/2011 5:50 AM, Ashwin Baindur wrote:
To conclude, I do not take it as a given that every thing is hunky dorey. Without meaning disrespect for the absolutely wonderful work and colossal efforts put in by the SOS Children's village Wikipedia team, I personally would like to tweak it so as to suit the Indian palate. I too am part of the world movement but I consider it a glocal one, not a global one. At this point of the time, I'm looking at how to make the world relevant to our locality.
The other albeit obvious thing to note is that beyond perhaps the "local relevance" of articles, there are vast differences in article QUALITY cross-languages. That is, certain articles may have been excluded from the SOS version due to poor quality rather than importance/relevance, and this of course could and would work both ways across language projects. So, we need to make sure there are structures in place to rate article quality within a given language project which we want to place into the offline versions.
On another note - I STRONGLY agree that creating offline versions in the native languages is of utmost importance. If we can do this, the distribution will not only be better received, but could actually be much more impactful at large. UNESCO wrote a report in 2005 which stated:
/"Denial to access to information in one's mother tongue is equivalent to a denial of a human right...In terms of pedagogy, how do children learn best? In their mother tongue."[1]/
The creation of quality-filtered offline materials in many languages is an incredibly important project and one that Wikimedia is uniquely positioned to tackle. Glad we are working so actively on figuring this out.
Jessie
[1] http://en.childrenslibrary.org/about/mission.shtml [admission: I've never been able to find this actual report, although I haven't spent a significant amount of time looking. I'll track it down soon enough...]
On Tue, 01 Feb 2011 11:57:20 +0100, Manuel Schneider manuel.schneider@wikimedia.ch wrote:
Hi,
Am 31.01.2011 19:27, schrieb Jessie Wild:
Although it is a couple months away, an easy way to leverage an existing organizational plan would be to tack onto the Chapter's meeting in Berlin at the end of March. Europe would also be a relatively central meeting place for us.
would be fine for me - but it should be a day _before_ the chapters meeting then as I am participating there as well.
No chance that I may attend to this meeting end of March. Doing this meeting during Wikimania seems to me to be an alternative.
Emmanuel
wikimedia-in-pun@lists.wikimedia.org