[WikiEN-l] FredBauder"clarifies"on attack site link policy

David Goodman dgoodmanny at gmail.com
Sun Jul 8 23:31:46 UTC 2007

As i don't read that site generally, I hadn't known it; but I just now
googled MONGO and e.d., and found the article;  such is the frequent
result of attempts at suppression: they are counter-productive. More
WPedians know about e.d. from the effort to ban it than they otherwise

On 7/6/07, Fred Bauder <fredbaud at waterwiki.info> wrote:
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: William Pietri [mailto:william at scissor.com]
> >Sent: Friday, July 6, 2007 12:53 PM
> >To: 'English Wikipedia'
> >Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] FredBauder"clarifies"onattackkkkkkkkkkk site link policy
> >
> >Fred Bauder wrote:
> >> I'll never accept linking to personal attacks on Wikipedians. I don't care how futile it is considered to be or how bad such "censorship" is. And it a site makes a regular business of attacking Wikipedians, not criticizing, but attacking, I will oppose linking to the site at all. I can see only good coming out of supporting other editors and only harm coming out of tolerating their humiliation.
> >>
> >
> >I agree with the principle -- we should treasure and support our editors
> >-- but I don't think the rest follows in all cases.
> >
> >For example, I once linked to what could easily be read as an off-wiki
> >personal attack on me. That was very helpful, as it made the situation
> >clearer to fellow editors, and resulted in me getting the assistance I
> >needed. A blanket ban would have made my life as an editor worse, not
> >better.
> >
> >Rather than making the judgment based on the thing linked to, I think
> >our judgment should be based on the way we are linking. Linking to a
> >personal attack can be done as a personal attack, of course, and that
> >should be treated like any other personal attack. But it also can be a
> >way to defang the personal attack. It can be a way to show what kooks
> >the attackers are. It can shine a light on things that fester in the dark.
> >
> >Stepping back, links to contentious material can certainly be helpful in
> >discussing and building consensus around whatever the new do-not-link
> >policy ends up as. After some random clicking around on the sites whose
> >names should not be spoken, I still haven't seen anything particularly
> >horrific. I'm not saying it isn't there, of course. I'm just saying that
> >if some people can see a problem and others can't, they are unlikely to
> >ever come to consensus on the severity of the problem, let alone the
> >solution.
> >
> >William
> The remedy was applied after a personal attack on MONGO was featured on the Main Page.
> Fred
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David Goodman, Ph.D, M.L.S.

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