[WikiEN-l] Situation deadlocked, how to solve it?

[JAY JG]

>Bjorn writes:
>
>Yes, it may have been a mistake of me not to mention my efforts to
>verify Bard's claim. But I have referred Jayjg to the text of the
>document in question at UNISPAL. Plus, I have also mentioned that that
>document (which Bard gets his 472,000 claim from) states that there
>were "some three hundred thousand Arab refugees."

You haven't seen the document in question, as I've explained many times.  
You've seen excerpts from another document, which lists 360,000 refugees 
*requiring aid*, and Bard also cites this document and mentions this figure.

>In short, I have
>tried very hard to explain why I think the way Jayjg wants the source
>to be written is bad. I have written all this multiple times at the
>talk page.

And I have tried very hard to explain to you, multiple times on the Talk: 
page, why your reasoning is incorrect.

>
>But I should have mentioned my e-mail conversation with Bard on the
>talk page. The reason I hesitated to do so, is that I wanted to give
>Bard enough time to answer. I didn't want to embarras myself by first
>saying that Bard is a liar and then have to withdraw that if he shows
>me his sources. After my 24 hour ban is up I will post it. Personally,
>I very strongly doubt that he has ever looked at the documents he
>purports to be citing from. A common technique when you write
>something that has to fit a particular view is to use second hand
>sources. Search for "472,000" and "UN Mediator" on Google and you will
>see what I mean. Hundreds of articles, forum messages and mailing-list
>postings, all claiming to be citing the UN Mediator. But how many of
>them have taken a look at the original documents?


Well, Bard cites this:

Progress Report of the United Nations Mediator on Palestine, Submitted to 
the Secretary-General for Transmission to the Members of the United Nations, 
General Assembly Official Records: Third Session, Supplement No.11 (A\648), 
Paris, 1948, p. 47 and Supplement No. 11A (A\689, and A\689\Add.1, p. 5; and 
"Conclusions From Progress Report of the United Nations Mediator on 
Palestine," (September 16, 1948), U.N. doc. A/648 (part one, p. 29; part 
two, p. 23 and part three, p. 11), (September 18, 1948).

That's pretty explicit, whereas your "suspicions" are just that, suspicions, 
with absolutely no foundation in actual evidence.


>I'm prepared to try mediation as the revert wars are not limited to
>"Estimates of the Palestinain Refugee Fligt of 1948," are present on
>other pages as well that I and Jayjg has edited. Or rather, that I
>have edited and Jayjg reverted.

I welcome mediation, formal or informal, as well.  Whatever it takes to 
solve the problem, and especially get the dispute of this mail-list, where 
it does not belong.

>I hope this comment about veiled anti-Semitism is not directed against
>me. If it is, it is a very strong and offensive insult. Not to
>mention, entierly baseless.

For what it's worth, I've never seen Bjorn do or say anything anti-Semitic 
on Wikipedia, and do not suspect him of anti-Semitism.  I do, however, 
consider that his attempts to advocate on behalf of Palestinians, and his 
creation of the "Palestine-info" userid to do so, have made him lose sight 
of critical Wikipedia policies, the primary one being NPOV.

Jay.