[WikiEN-l] Fwd: Wikipedia e-mail -- fair use

Wed Aug 3 16:33:33 UTC 2005

Thank you for that wording.  I might have spelt it out better had I
not been in a rush...  I'm British as well, so I know/care very little
about US law.  BTW, I agree that the templates are incorrectly worded,
and I have started a drive to cut down on the numbers of spurious fair
use claims (it's at [[User:Smoddy/Fair use assessment]].  Your point
about content/use is a very valid one, and I actually debated that at
some length on the aforementioned page.

Thank you for your support

Sam

On 8/3/05, Fastfission <fastfission at gmail.com> wrote:
> His response is spot-on as far as I can tell, but it is important to
> see what he is saying. In a charitable interpretation, he is
> responding correctly to Smoddy's argument that promotional materials
> and logos are de facto "fair use" under U.S. copyright law. This is
> not true and our blanket statement template should be modified (as
> should all of them) to explicitly justify under which conditions it
> can be asserted as "fair use" -- not every use would necessarily be
> "fair". "Fair use" does not apply in a blanket way and should be
> spoken of in such a way -- Smoddy's language was imprecise and did not
> reflect a thorough understanding of the law (probably not his fault --
> most of the "fair use" templates are VERY misleading!).
> 
> A proper response would be, "We think our use of this falls under the
> 'fair use' clause because 1. the ownership of the logo is clearly
> attributed and the resolution of the file provided is low, 2. we are
> using it for an educational purpose on a non-profit encyclopedia, and
> it enhances this effort significantly, 3. no uncopyrighted alternative
> exists. We believe that a judge would agree with us that such usage is
> 'fair' were it to be litigated."
> 
> Our Nationalist friend has not given us any reasons for why he would
> think the above claims would *not* qualify as fair, so it is hard to
> know why he thinks that.
> 
> The templates are misleading and should be changed -- they make "fair
> use" look like a free ticket, and they are from the standpoint of what
> the *content* itself is rather than its *use* (i.e., they say things
> like "posters are considered fair use" -- completely the wrong way to
> think about it). I've been working on some proposals along these lines
> which I'll link to on here at some point.
> 
> FF
> 
> 
> On 8/3/05, Haukur Þorgeirsson <haukurth at hi.is> wrote:
> > Well, Jimbo, if you want to stand up for fair use
> > it appears that now's your chance. :)
> >
> > There seem to be around 6000 images that link to
> > the {{logo}} template.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Haukur
> >
> >
> > > I (smoddy -- this is my second email address) sent an email to
> > > User:Crosstar about fair use on a logo at [[Nationalist Movement]] and
> > > [[Crosstar]].  I received this email back in response (my original
> > > email is at the bottom).
> > >
> > > I am forwarding the email here as I am not subscribed to the legal mailing
> > > list.
> > >
> > > Are there any suggestions as to the course to take?
> > >
> > > Sam/smoddy
> > >
> > > ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> > > From: crosstar <nationalist at nationalist.org>
> > > Date: Aug 3, 2005 4:06 AM
> > > Subject: Re: Wikipedia e-mail -- fair use
> > > To: Smoddy <sam.korn at gmail.com>
> > >
> > > Dear Mr. Smoddy:
> > >
> > > Your assessment is incorrect and far from "clear."
> > >
> > > "Fair Use" is considered on a case-by-case basis and, even
> > > after expensive and protracted litigation, outcomes may vary.
> > > Suffice it to say, we cannot render legal-advice to you, which must
> > > come from your own, independent legal-counsel.  I can tell you
> > > that in approximately thirty-seven cases involving infringement
> > > of our trademarks and violation of our copyrights, however, we
> > > have won every one.
> > >
> > > The US Copyright Office advises that:
> > >
> > > "The safest course is always to get permission from the
> > > copyright owner before using copyrighted material."
> > > http://www.copyright.gov/fls/fl102.html
> > >
> > > The courts tend to lean toward protecting intellectual-property
> > > rights, as well they should, insofar such rights are protected
> > > by the United States Constitution.
> > >
> > > Anyone who wishes his own intellectual-property rights to be
> > > respected (and that should include all of us) should respect such
> > > rights of others.  Penalties for violation are severe and increased if
> > > repeated.  In the Hale case, the fine was $200,000.00, plus
> > > $450,000.00 attorney fees, alone.  Punitive damages may also
> > > be assessed, where conduct is wilfull, reckless or wanton, if, for
> > > instance, the offender persists, after having been placed on notice.
> > >
> > > In this instance, the copyright/trademark owner has not given
> > > permission for its images to be used and will vigorously defend its
> > > rights in court, if need be.
> > >
> > > The Copyright Office further explains that:
> > >
> > > "When it is impracticable to obtain permission, use of copyrighted
> > > material should be avoided...."
> > > http://www.copyright.gov/fls/fl102.html
> > >
> > > It is the choice of the copyright/trademark owner whether or not
> > > to license use of its intellectual-property and, insofar as the
> > > owner does not approve of your project and wishes to avoid any
> > > misrepresentation of itself or any implied endorsement of your
> > > project, as well as to prevent any confusion in the mind of the
> > > public, permission is denied.
> > >
> > > There are numerous other objections, but the foregoing should
> > > suffice for purposes of your question.  Thank you for your kind
> > > consideration and cooperation.
> > >
> > > Richard Barrett
> > > Attorney
> > > The Nationalist Movement
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > At 12:11 PM 8/2/2005, you wrote:
> > >
> > >>May I ask that you explain why we are not allowed to display this
> > >>image?  Under US law, it is allowed for reference materials (and other
> > >>such documents) to be shown for informational reasons about the
> > >>topic.  This is clearly true in this case.
> > >>
> > >>I am sending you an email in the hope that you will reply.
> > >>
> > >>Cheers, and best wishes
> > >>
> > >>Sam/smoddy
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Try http://en.wikipedia.org - Wikipedia - the free encyclopaedia!
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> >
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