[Foundation-l] Greg Kohs and Peter Damian

phoebe ayers phoebe.wiki at gmail.com
Mon Oct 18 06:17:28 UTC 2010

On Sun, Oct 17, 2010 at 10:34 PM, Robert S. Horning
<robert_horning at netzero.net> wrote:
> On 10/17/2010 11:01 PM, MZMcBride wrote:
>> Fred Bauder wrote:
>>> This list is for people who support the project, not those who are
>>> actively opposing it or criticizing in public forums in exaggerated ways.
>> Please don't stupidly spout off about the purpose of this list. Or if you
>> insist on doing so, at least have the decency to be accurate. There is
>> absolutely no issue with dissent on this list (or on any Wikimedia mailing
>> list). Thoughtful critics and criticism should always be welcome. The view
>> you're putting forward is simply and unequivocally wrong.
>> MZMcBride
> While I think this reply could have been a bit more tactful, the
> sentient is well founded:  This list includes a fair bit of dissent and
> controversy over the role of the Foundation in regards to the operations
> of the various Wikimedia projects.... controversy that in some cases
> I've started in the past in various capacities.  *I* have offered
> dissenting viewpoints on several key things in the past, so if it is
> those who are actively criticizing the foundation or the actions of
> "project leaders", perhaps I ought to be the next one banned from this list?

I cannot speak for the list administrators. But criticism, especially
thoughtful criticism, is of course both welcome and healthy in general
in our projects, and personally I would love to see more nuanced and
thoughtful criticism as the basis of many more conversations about
where the Foundation and projects should go.

But I do note that Austin didn't specify the reasons that Kohs was
banned, so I don't think that it's particularly useful to raise
fearful scenarios. In the last few years that I have been actively
participating in Foundation-l, I've found it quite lenient not only
towards critics but also towards troublesome posters, even trolls. So
I doubt that Kohs' critical views towards the projects contributed to
his banning; there are plenty of other ways that someone can become
unwelcome in a community, including harassment of other members of
that community. I don't know what the specific situation in this case
was that triggered this action at this time, but I trust our list
administrators to make thoughtful decisions based on a long history.


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