[Foundation-l] Advertisements? (core principles andvariablemild principles)

Tue Mar 25 13:19:09 UTC 2008

 Hi Brian
I know Wikipedia has an open source search engine but ours was designed 
specifically for the Wikimedia Foundation's projects and now manages an 
average of 180,000 searches per day.

But I don't want you to come to the easy thing consisting in providing 
Google with all the Wikipedia searches in exchange of a percentage on ads.

In such a case, I could not improve my algorithms and create offline 
versions of Wikipedia, for which we have a contract, with a high performance 
search engine.

The business model I suggest is simple and would not affect the Foundation. 
Lately, we have been in contact with Kul to provide our search engine 
results to a French ISP so that Wikiwix can become a visitors provider to 
Wikipedia (we expect 3 to 4 millions French visitors per month in this way).

Furthermore, we may strengthen this kind of business if we become the 
default search engine of the Wikimedia Foundation as the only fact to be 
taken would give us a formal side. That's why I suggest making it open 
source.

In the meantime, a link towards our search meta engine can be considered (to 
extend your searches to all the Foundation's projects) and take a share on 
the ad revenues so generated.

Wikiwix allows a distribution of Wikipedia while funding a part of the 
Foundation.

And I think I can say Linterweb is a partner of the Wikimedia Foundation, as 
we released the first English version on CD of which 80 copies were sold, 
despite the buzz produced. But we still are working on a French version that 
will be sold in supermarkets.

Best regards

Cordialement
Martin Pascal
tel : 02 32 40 23 69, fax : 02 32 61 45 26
gsm : 06 13 89 77 32
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Brian" <Brian.Mingus at colorado.edu>
To: "Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List" <foundation-l at lists.wikimedia.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2008 6:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Advertisements? (core principles andvariablemild 
principles)

> We've already got an open search engine.
>
> On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 11:42 AM, Martin Pascal <pmartin at linterweb.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Hello all,
>>
>> Probably you never heard of me but i am the french editor of the
>> http://wikipediaondvd.com  and also of  http://wikiwix.com.
>>
>> We are helping also OLPC for the Wikipedia Selection.
>>
>> Wikiwix is one of meta search engine of all the project of the wikimedia
>> fundation, it is available in 13 languages, and is integrated on the
>> different languages.
>>
>> We are working to put it in all the 250 languages of the Wikipedia.
>> http://www.wikiwix.com/langs.php?lang=fr&disp=article
>>
>> What about using our technology to improve search results  and as an
>> opportunity to get some ads on Wikiwix ?
>>
>>
>> We could make Wikiwix as on opensearch engine.
>>
>> Best regards
>> Pascal Martin
>>
>> Cordialement
>> Martin Pascal
>> tel : 02 32 40 23 69, fax : 02 32 61 45 26
>> gsm : 06 13 89 77 32
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Florence Devouard" <Anthere9 at yahoo.com>
>> To: <foundation-l at lists.wikimedia.org>
>> Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2008 6:29 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Advertisements? (core principles and
>> variablemild principles)
>>
>>
>> > Gerard Meijssen wrote:
>> >> Please define "our core principles". There are people vehemently
>> against
>> >> advertisements and there are many people cowered into silence. What 
>> >> has
>> >> always been said and this is a good thing is that if it is not
>> necessary
>> >> to
>> >> have advertisements, we will not. Equating no advertisements with core
>> >> principles is ludicrous; it means that others may make money from our
>> >> effort
>> >> and we do not make the money we need for the activities we have
>> planned,
>> >> the
>> >> costs that we incur...
>> >
>> > Given that advertisements we are discussing would be displayed on the
>> > projects websites, I think that by "core principles", he means "core
>> > principles of each project".
>> >
>> > "NPOV" is clearly a core principle, for Wikipedia
>> > "Free licence" is clearly a core principle, for ALL projects
>> > "No advertisment" is clearly not a core principle. It may be a
>> > principle-by-precedence. I would call it a mild principle if you wish.
>> >
>> > Core principles on the english wikipedia:
>> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_pillars_of_Wikipedia
>> >
>> > Note that core principles of each project can differ slightly.
>> > Note that core principles within a project, between languages, might
>> > even differ a bit as well. In particular for young projects.
>> >
>> > This might suggest that certain decisions might be taken for certain
>> > projects, but not others.
>> >
>> > Hmmm, care for me to give an example ?
>> >
>> > Search system on en.wiki:
>> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Search?search=&fulltext=Search
>> > (no reference to outside search engines. No advertisement)
>> >
>> > Search system on fr.wiki:
>> > http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Search?search=&fulltext=Search
>> > (several little known search systems are mentionned, which is a sort of
>> > advertisement. However, display is pretty discreet).
>> >
>> > Search system on ja.wiki:
>> > http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Search?search=&fulltext=Search
>> > (several search systems are boldly mentionned, with logo. Clear
>> > advertisement for these huge rich search systems, without any bucks for
>> > us. After all, Mozilla is making big bucks in putting a search system
>> > for Google in Firefox. Here, we put a nice advertisement for Google for
>> > free)
>> >
>> > What does it teach us ?
>> >
>> > 1. It is demonstration enough that advertisement is a mild principle.
>> >
>> > 2. It also reveals that there are many types of advertisement possible,
>> > and that before taking a position for or against advertisement, it 
>> > would
>> > be a good idea to identify the various types of advertisement.
>> > Typical examples are
>> > * ads in article space
>> > * ad for a search engine (in the search area)
>> > * ads in the search results space
>> > * thank you ad on the main page (for a sponsor)
>> > * thank you ad on all pages (for a sponsor)
>> > * etc...
>> > I take it some will mostly meet opposition, whilst others could be
>> > acceptable.
>> >
>> > 3. it is a demonstration that we are currently doing advertisement, and
>> > not making bucks on it. And no one complains. So, what does bugs people
>> > the most ? Doing advertisement ? Or doing advertisement and making 
>> > money
>> > of it ?
>> >
>> > 4. it also shows that each community might have a different perspective
>> > on this. With naturally a general opinion (would english editors care 
>> > if
>> > we displayed advertisement on the japanese wikipedia ?)
>> >
>> > Ant
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
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>>
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