I would just like to repeat that I think that this film should *not* be screened at Wikimedia 10th events. Many Wikipedians were offended by it when it showed at Wikimania. Liam Wyatt spoke up to say that he felt "attacked" by the film. It portrays completely ludicrous critics as if they are valid. (The guy from The Register appears in the film to be a serious journalist, but if you know his coverage of wikipedia, it has been extremely tabloid and conspiracy-theorist in nature). Rather than focussing attention on the wonderful community, the film leaves a sad and bitter taste in the mouth, is demeaning to volunteers, and rehashes debate points that are 5 years old. The world has moved on beyond Andrew Keen's pseudo-arguments. --Jimbo On 12/15/10 8:07 PM, Samuel Klein wrote: Numbers: _______________________________________________ WikiX-l mailing list WikiX-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikix-l

+1. Truth in numbers was very much a disappointment, it focuses too much on the "only amateurs" argument which we know is not true nor relevant, and it misses much of the cool things that are happening in the movement. We should really do something better, and I do feel there's potential in doing it by crowdsourcing, much as YouTube did their YouTube symphony (http://www.youtube.com/user/symphony). Perhaps this is a part of the Bookshelf Project - I don't know. But until this becomes a reality, people will wonder why we are "hiding" the movie that does exist by not showing it. We made such a big fuzz about it before it came out, that we now cannot very easily just say "it's outdated" or "it's too critical" or "it misses the point" without seeming anxious about what people will think about Wikipedia after they see it. As we will show it mainly to Wikipedians, they will know what parts are untrue, and what parts are unfair - and if they are offended by the film, we can say "Hey, let's do a better one", just as we do when it comes to Wikipedia articles. Anyway, please do not take showing the film as an endorsement of the quality of the film. Best wishes, Lennart Lennart Guldbrandsson, ordförande för Wikimedia Sverige http://wikimedia.se Tfn: 031 - 12 50 48 Mobil: 070 - 207 80 05 Epost: l_guldbrandsson(a)hotmail.com Användarsida: http://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anv%C3%A4ndare:Hannibal Blogg:http://mrchapel.wordpress.com/ From: lodewijk(a)effeietsanders.org Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2010 14:02:44 +0100 To: wikix-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org Subject: Re: [WikiX-l] Truth in numbers Just out of interest... (I would like to see the movie again to re-check my first reaction) is the film somewhere available for download at zero cost? (the film is after all CCBYSA according to truthinnumbersthemovie.com ). I agree with Jimmy that screening is tricky. However, I do think that with the proper surrounding discussion panel and notices that it is out of date etc, it might proof good ground for discussions. I know that some Wikipedians were very unhappy about the result, and I also think that it is much less than it could have been. But at the same time, it is the best there is in this category at the moment. I can only hope that some day there will be a better version available :) Lodewijk 2010/12/16 Jimmy Wales <jwales(a)wikia-inc.com> I would just like to repeat that I think that this film should *not* be screened at Wikimedia 10th events. Many Wikipedians were offended by it when it showed at Wikimania. Liam Wyatt spoke up to say that he felt "attacked" by the film. It portrays completely ludicrous critics as if they are valid. (The guy from The Register appears in the film to be a serious journalist, but if you know his coverage of wikipedia, it has been extremely tabloid and conspiracy-theorist in nature). Rather than focussing attention on the wonderful community, the film leaves a sad and bitter taste in the mouth, is demeaning to volunteers, and rehashes debate points that are 5 years old. The world has moved on beyond Andrew Keen's pseudo-arguments. --Jimbo On 12/15/10 8:07 PM, Samuel Klein wrote: _______________________________________________ WikiX-l mailing list WikiX-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikix-l _______________________________________________ WikiX-l mailing list WikiX-l@lists.wikimedia.orghttps://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikix-l _______________________________________________ WikiX-l mailing list WikiX-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikix-l

Jay writes: Now that is a brilliant idea. SJ