Thank you Maggie, for the announcement. It's a sad day, and I'm sure there were many sad actions that resulted in this. 

Two questions from my end:
* Could you commit to making a better translation available (through community processes or otherwise) for the record? I think this decision may be referred to quite a bit in the future, so it's valuable to have an accurate translation available to the Chinese community. 
* What countries are affected currently by the NDA decision? It is suggested that China and Iran are, but I can't find an authoritative list (but may be looking at the wrong place). This would be helpful for volunteers from countries that are wondering if they should even bother to apply for positions. The definition "blocked access" is a bit fluid. I'm assuming here that the fact that a country is on this list, is not a secret in itself. 

Best,
Lodewijk

On Mon, Sep 13, 2021 at 11:06 AM William Chan <william@wchan.hk> wrote:
Hi Leo,

I think that this is a Google Translation product. But yes, it is in such bad shape where even Chinese natives can barely read. But I acknowledge the fact that the urgency and secrecy of the matter made consulting external parties, to the extent, even contractors working for WMF, impossible.

To Maggie,

May I ask if there is a certain number for the amount of users linked with the unrecognized user group being warned? There is no request for the list of users, just the number would be fine. The Wikipedia communities in Hong Kong need to access the total damage dealt to the user group who had persistently engaged in activities harassing the safety of Hong Kong Users.

Regards,
William Chan


On Tue, 14 Sept 2021 at 01:58, Leo Z <leo@asianmonth.wiki> wrote:
Hi Maggie,

Thanks for the prompt response. I do not know who those ‘native speakers’ are, perhaps that’s just a way to avoid providing language proficiency certificate. I do not know. Google translation might even do better. 

I am more than certain that this translation is not just faulty or unsatisfactory, but terrible if not horrifying, disastrous, or outright shocking for an acclaimed international organization. The issue for this specific translation is not with 'movement-specific' terms, but a significant lack of elementary understanding regarding the fundamental grammatical structure of the Chinese language. I will refrain from listing specific examples here (there are plenty), but those mistakes are hilarious, if not outright absurd. Whoever translated this text might barely pass an AP Chinese exam.

Please consult a professor in Chinese language at Berkeley or CCSF or even just a language school, or perhaps consult someone from ChinaSF, maybe even a Chinese speaking professional from HSBC or wherever. There are plenty, if you feel it’s necessary. I’m more than certain they will offer similar opinions.

Sincere hope for a better translation,
Leo
On Sep 14, 2021, 1:17 AM +0800, Maggie Dennis <mdennis@wikimedia.org>, wrote:
Hello, all.

A few responses.

First, Nathan and William, we will share as much information as we can, but will need to be careful about what we say about the individuals involved for legal and safety reasons. This is indeed related to increasing resilience across Wikipedias and not at all specifically for ZhWP. I do think it's important for us to offer some additional support there, given the current situation, but we are looking at increasing safety everywhere.

Leo, thank you for your feedback on the translation, which was provided by native Chinese speakers. Since I myself am completely unable to read Chinese, I don't know the nature of the issue, but I do know that in the past we have had some issues with movement-specific terms being translated. I recall once when "free in speech" was mistranslated as "free as in beer" - which we always deliberately try to avoid. :)

Best,
Maggie

On Mon, Sep 13, 2021 at 12:45 PM Nathan <nawrich@gmail.com> wrote:
Maggie,

Thank you for taking these very difficult actions to protect both the members of our community as well as the values that it seeks to uphold. I also appreciate the degree of transparency provided and hope that more information will be disclosed as it is appropriate. I imagine questions will be asked about how these individual accounts were selected for office actions and the contours of the risk both to the individuals behind these accounts and the wider community. Any information that the WMF is able to safely share will help all of us understand better what the threats are and how we may better support the movement's goals in jurisdictions where our values are not respected. 

Thank you again,
Nathan
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Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.
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