I am puzzled on multiple fronts by this email. Was the Harvard law class not
a randomly chosen class of law students, but a group of people who had met
in order to make waterboarding sound legal in public discourse? Because
otherwise I don't see the analogy. The only other people CM has 'banned'
are people following Zeq's instructions and who give their accounts away in
the "evidence", or were editing, clearly disruptively, from the CAMERA
office. I'm sure the former, at least, could have their bans lifted if they
repudiated the supposed methods and agreed to some form of mentorship. On
the contrary, the attitude has been "yes, so what. Why can't you see,
Wikipedia is biased, why aren't you worried about what the other lot are
doing, we're just trying to fix it, are you on *their* side?" which is
precisely the attitude we don't really have time for.
I wouldn't call that enormous subpage of AN/I "not much review", but
whatever.
RR
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 9:06 PM, Nathan <nawrich(a)gmail.com> wrote:
The whole rush to ban anyone associated with this
group is disturbing, and
not receiving much in the way of review. Christiano has so far blocked two
editors and topic banned another one for a year, based on what in my mind
is
a non-review of their actual edits. This reminds me of the Harvard class
involved in editing the Waterboarding article - some of the same people,
in
fact. We don't ban people for having a point of view. Having a point of
view
isn't a violation of WP:NOT#BATTLEGROUND. We don't ban people for knowing
eachother off wiki, or sharing a point of view that they discuss off-wiki.
We don't ban people for being associated with strange people like Zeq, who
claimed to marshal an "army" to go to "war" on Wikipedia in the
e-mail
that
is attributed to him. Or we shouldn't, anyway, since now apparently we do
ban people for these reasons. What makes this more problematic is that the
folks being banned are ostensibly pro-Israel POV warriors - and the
"evidence" against them consists of e-mails represented on
electronicintifada.com, a very strongly anti-Israel and pro-Palestinian
activist organization. I put quotes around evidence because there barely
is
any evidence on that page except the efforts of junior amateur sleuths
trying to connect editors to e-mail addresses.
Nathan
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 11:05 AM, David Gerard <dgerard(a)gmail.com> wrote:
On 23/04/2008, Fred Bauder
<fredbaud(a)fairpoint.net> wrote:
I think the push by CAMERA is probably a reaction
to the gradual
movement
of articles which relate to the Arab-Israeli
toward neutral point of
view. We just need to keep that up, not panic about organized efforts.
We
have alway had to deal with disorganized efforts.
I question the blogosphere "o noez the zionists are coming" response's
sanity factor based on fingering Jayjg as an agent of CAMERA. Er,
what.
- d.
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