One more thing, I would be interested in. I don't think comparing wikidata and
freebase to DBpedia will make sense as these are sources for us. However we could compare
DBpedia including the Wikidata and Freebase part to the Google Knowledge Graph and repeat
this every three months to guide our community in integrating more sources. Can we do
that?
-- Sebastian
On September 20, 2019 8:07:28 PM GMT+02:00, "Denny Vrandečić"
<vrandecic(a)google.com> wrote:
I would love your input! I will send the link here, and
any
contribution
will be welcome :)
Thank you!
On Fri, Sep 20, 2019 at 11:05 AM Samuel Klein <meta.sj(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
I'm also interested in this comparison and
intersection, and glad to
share
perspective + help. Warmly, SJ
On Fri, Sep 20, 2019 at 1:32 PM Denny Vrandečić <vrandecic(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
> Yes, you're touching exactly on the problems I had during the
evaluation
> - I couldn't even figure out what DBpedia
is. Thanks, your help will
be
> very much appreciated.
>
> OK, I will send a link the week after the next, and then we can
start
> working on it :) I am very much looking
forward to it.
>
> On Fri, Sep 20, 2019 at 10:11 AM Sebastian Hellmann <
> hellmann(a)informatik.uni-leipzig.de> wrote:
>
>> Na, I am quite open, albeit impulsive. The information given was
quite
>> good and some of my concerns regarding
the involvement of Google
were also
>> lifted or relativized. Mainly due to the
fact that there seems to
be a
>> sense of awareness.
>>
>> I am just studying economic principles, which are very powerful. I
also
>> have the feeling that free and open stuff
just got a lot more
commercial
>> and I am still struggling with myself
whether this is good or not.
Also
>> whether DBpedia should become frenemies
with BigTech. Or funny
things like
>> many funding agencies try to push for
national sustainability
options, but
>> most of the time, they suggest to use the
GitHub Platform. Wikibase
could
>> be an option here.
>>
>> I have to apologize for the Knowledge Graph Talk thing. I was a bit
>> grumpy, because I thought I wasted a lot of time on the Talk page
that
>> could have been invested in making the
article better (WP:BE_BOLD
style),
>> but now I think, it might have been my
own mistake. So apologies
for
>> lashing out there.
>>
>> (see comments below)
>> On 20.09.19 17:53, Denny Vrandečić wrote:
>>
>> Sebastian,
>>
>> "I don't want to facilitate conspiracy theories, but ..."
>> "[I am] interested in what is the truth behind the truth"
>>
>> I am sorry, I truly am, but this *is* the language I know from
>> conspiracy theorists. And given that, I cannot imagine that there
is
>> anything I can say that could convince
you otherwise. Therefore
there is no
>> real point for me in engaging with this
conversation on these
terms, I
>> cannot see how it would turn
constructive.
>>
>> The answers to many of your questions are public and on the record.
>> Others tried to point you to them (thanks), but you dismiss them as
not
>> fitting your narrative.
>>
>> So here's a suggestion, which I think might be much more
constructive
>> and forward-looking:
>>
>> I have been working on a comparison of DBpedia, Wikidata, and
Freebase
>> (and since you've read my thesis, you
know that's a thing I know a
bit
>> about). Simple evaluation, coverage,
correctness, nothing
dramatically
>> fancy. But I am torn about publishing it,
because, d'oh, people may
(with
>> good reasons) dismiss it as being biased.
And truth be told - the
simple
>> fact that I don't know DBpedia as
well as I know Wikidata and
Freebase
>> might indeed have lead to errors,
mistakes, and stuff I missed in
the
>> evaluation. But you know what would
help?
>>
>> You.
>>
>> My suggestion is that I publish my current draft, and then you and
me
>> work together on it, publically, in the
open, until we reach a
state we
>> both consider correct enough for
publication.
>>
>> What do you think?
>>
>> Sure, we are doing statistics at the moment as well. It is a bit
hard to
>> define what DBpedia is nowadays as we are
rebranding the remixed
datasets,
>> now that we can pick up links and other
data from the Databus. It
might not
>> even be a real dataset anymore, but glue
between datasets focusing
on the
>> speed of integration and ease of quality
improvement. Also still
working on
>> the concrete Sync Targets for
GlobalFactSync (
>>
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:Project/DBpedia/GlobalFactSyncRE)
>> as well.
>>
>> One question I have is whether Wikidata is effective/efficient or
where
>> it is effective and where it could use
improvement as a chance for
>> collaboration.
>>
>> So yes any time.
>>
>> -- Sebastian
>>
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Denny
>>
>> P.S.: I am travelling the next week, so I may ask for patience
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Sep 20, 2019 at 8:11 AM Thad Guidry <thadguidry(a)gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Thank you for sharing your opinions, Sebastian.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Thad
>>>
https://www.linkedin.com/in/thadguidry/
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Sep 20, 2019 at 9:43 AM Sebastian Hellmann <
>>> hellmann(a)informatik.uni-leipzig.de> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Thad,
>>>> On 20.09.19 15:28, Thad Guidry wrote:
>>>>
>>>> With my tech evangelist hat on...
>>>>
>>>> Google's philanthropy is nearly boundless when it comes to the
>>>> promotion of knowledge. Why? Because indeed it's in their best
interest
>>>> otherwise no one can prosper
without knowledge. They aggregate
knowledge
>>>> for the benefit of mankind, and
then make a profit through
advertising ...
>>>> all while making that knowledge
extremely easy to be found for
the world.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I am neither pro-Google or anti-Google per se. Maybe skeptical
and
>>>> interested in what is the truth
behind the truth. Google is not
synonym to
>>>> philanthropy. Wikimedia is or at
least I think they are doing
many things
>>>> right. Google is a platform, so
primarily they "aggregate
knowledge for
>>>> their benefit" while
creating enough incentives in form of
accessibility
>>>> for users to add the user's
knowledge to theirs. It is not about
what
>>>> Google offers, but what it takes
in return. 20% of employees time
is also
>>>> an investment in the skill of the
employee, a Google asset called
Human
>>>> Capital and also leads to me and
Denny from Google discussing
whether
>>>>
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Knowledge_Graph is content
>>>> marketing or knowledge (@Denny: no offense, legit arguments, but
no
agenda
>>>> to resolve the stalled discussion
there). Except I don't have 20%
time to
>>>> straighten the view into what I
believe would be neutral, so
pushing it
>>>> becomes a resource issue.
>>>>
>>>> I found the other replies much more realistic and the perspective
is
>>>> yet unclear. Maybe Mozilla
wasn't so much frenemy with Google and
got
>>>> removed from the browser market
for it. I am also thinking about
Linked
>>>> Open Data. Decentralisation is
quite weak, individually. I guess
spreading
>>>> all the Wikibases around to
super-nodes is helpful unless it
prevents the
>>>> formation of a stronger lobby of
philanthropists or competition
to BigTech.
>>>> Wikidata created some pressure on
DBpedia as well (also
opportunities), but
>>>> we are fine since we can simply
innovate. Others might not
withstand.
>>>> Microsoft seems to favor
OpenStreetMaps so I am just asking to
which degree
>>>> Open Source and Open Data is
being instrumentalised by BigTech.
>>>>
>>>> Hence my question, whether it is compromise or be removed. (Note
that
>>>> states are also platforms, which
measure value in GDP and make
laws and
>>>> roads and take VAT on
transactions. Sometimes, they even don't
remove
>>>> opposition.)
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> All the best,
>>>> Sebastian Hellmann
>>>>
>>>> Director of Knowledge Integration and Linked Data Technologies
(KILT)
>>>> Competence Center
>>>> at the Institute for Applied Informatics (InfAI) at Leipzig
University
>>>> Executive Director of the DBpedia
Association
>>>> Projects:
http://dbpedia.org,
http://nlp2rdf.org,
>>>>
http://linguistics.okfn.org,
https://www.w3.org/community/ld4lt
>>>> <http://www.w3.org/community/ld4lt>
>>>> Homepage:
http://aksw.org/SebastianHellmann
>>>> Research Group:
http://aksw.org
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wikidata mailing list
>>> Wikidata(a)lists.wikimedia.org
>>>
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata
>>>
>> --
>> All the best,
>> Sebastian Hellmann
>>
>> Director of Knowledge Integration and Linked Data Technologies
(KILT)
>> Competence Center
>> at the Institute for Applied Informatics (InfAI) at Leipzig
University
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