[Wikita-l] Fw: Qs regarding village school & WP
BalaSundaraRaman
sundarbecse at yahoo.com
Thu Nov 25 02:56:11 UTC 2010
அடுத்த கட்ட நடவடிக்கைகளைத் தொடங்க வேண்டும். இலினக்சு குழமத்துடன் நாம்
தொடங்கியுள்ள திட்டத்தோடு இணைத்து விடலாமா? இந்தத் திட்டங்களுக்குப் பொறுப்பாளராக
செயல்பட ஒருவர் முன்வர வேண்டும். யாருக்கு விருப்பம் உள்ளது?
- சுந்தர்
"That language is an instrument of human reason, and not merely a medium for
the expression of thought, is a truth generally admitted."
- George Boole, quoted in Iverson's Turing Award Lecture
----- Forwarded Message ----
> From: Jessie Wild <jwild at wikimedia.org>
> To: BalaSundaraRaman <sundarbecse at yahoo.com>
> Cc: ravishankar.ayyakkannu at gmail.com
> Sent: Wed, November 24, 2010 11:44:17 PM
> Subject: Re: Qs regarding village school & WP
>
> Sure - if you would like to begin the discussion on Village Pump that
> would be great! I think a lot of the questions we walked briefly through
> are the ones where some community support would be needed. Specifically:
>
> Immediate support:
> 1 - Selecting the articles/creating collections of articles.
> 2 - Creating training materials on how to use WP and how to incorporate
> it into the classroom
> 3 - Working with government officials on distribution policies
>
> Future support:
> 4 - Distributing/installing software
> 5 - Conducting teacher trainings
>
> As you probably suspect, I don't understand Tamil, so I'd love if you'd
> just keep me in the loop with what happens on the Tamil and village pump :)
>
> Jessie
>
> On 11/24/2010 2:50 AM, BalaSundaraRaman wrote:
> > Sorry for the delay on our part, Jessie.
> > The Kenyan project is a useful project to learn from.
> >
> > Though we have a list at
>https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikita-l,
> > we still use the Village Pump to begin most of the discussions.
> > Perhaps we can start a thread on the list or on meta and put a note at
> > http://ta.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:VP?
> >
> > - Sundar
> >
> > "That language is an instrument of human reason, and not merely a medium
>for
> > the expression of thought, is a truth generally admitted."
> > - George Boole, quoted in Iverson's Turing Award Lecture
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----
> >> From: Jessie Wild<jwild at wikimedia.org>
> >> To: BalaSundaraRaman<sundarbecse at yahoo.com>
> >> Cc: ravishankar.ayyakkannu at gmail.com
> >> Sent: Tue, November 23, 2010 12:58:10 AM
> >> Subject: Re: Qs regarding village school& WP
> >>
> >> Thanks for the thorough answers - it's so great you've thought through
> >> so many of these things so carefully.
> >>
> >> I'm not sure if you are familiar with the project in Kenya that is
> >> somewhat comparable:
> >> http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Kenya/Project_for_Kenyan_Schools
> >>
> >> In terms of next steps, I think you are right in suggesting to put up a
> >> proposal on a wiki. I think the approach the Kenyan Wikimedians have
> >> taken to project planning is quite thorough and consequently very
> >> helpful, and constructing something similar for Tamil Nadu could
> >> likewise be beneficial.
> >>
> >> I would suggest getting other members of the Tamil community onboard
> >> with the planning as soon as possible; is there a list serve that I
> >> should get on to follow the conversations?
> >>
> >> Jessie
> >>
> >> On 11/18/2010 9:31 PM, BalaSundaraRaman wrote:
> >>>> I definitely agree that the offline versions will be useful, and the
> >> type of
> >>>> project you are describing is exactly the type of offline work I am
> >> helping
> >>>> orchestrate - so yes: let's brainstorm and work together on this!
> >>> Thanks a lot, Jessie. :)
> >>>
> >>>> * For the Tamil Wikipedia project, is this the same project proposed
> >> back in
> >>>> 2007, or is it an extension of it? I am curious of this ever got
>off
> >>>> the
> >>>>
> >>>> ground initially.
> >>> It derives from the same thought, but the earlier project did not go
> >> anywhere.
> >>> At present, we have more editors and hence will be able to curate
content
> >>> easily.
> >>> We also have richer content on many interesting topics.
> >>>
> >>>> * Also, I am curious what are you thinking for the collection of
> >> articles to
> >>>> be included on the CD. Would you want the whole Tamil
> >> Wikipedia/Wiktionary
> >>>> collection? Or would you go through the process of screening the
> >> articles to
> >>>> make sure they were student appropriate / of high academic
quality?
> >>> We're only thinking of releasing a selection of articles based on
quality
> >> (we've
> >>> just started with a rating system),
> >>> interestingness and suitability for students, and comprehensiveness.
> >>> WikiProject Indian Mammals and articles on chemical elements form a
good
> >>> collection to share with students.
> >>> The above are only examples, we can select articles from across several
> >>> categories.
> >>>
> >>>> * In addition, in regards to article selection (above point), would
> >> the
> >>>> Tamil Nadu government need to approve the articles that were being
> >>>> distributed into schools?
> >>> Yes, perhaps. Due to our prior engagement with them in the recently
> >> conducted
> >>> article writing contest sponsored by the Government of Tamil Nadu,
> >> co-ordination
> >>> would be easier. We have points of contact in the IT department,
>Department
> >> of
> >>> Translation, and the Department of Education in fairly senior levels.
The
> >>> Director of Tamil Virtual Academy is also a keen supporter of Tamil
> >> Wikipedia
> >>> (and an occasional editor).
> >>>
> >>>> * Why CD? Why not USB? Just curious!
> >>> I just thought CDs are less expensive. We can certainly evaluate USB
> >> storage.
> >>>
> >>>> * How are you thinking of getting the CDs to the different schools?
> >> Who is
> >>>> going to download the materials onto the school computers? Will
>there
> >> (or
> >>>> does there need to be) any training involved?
> >>> We should take the help of the School Education department who have
> > existing
> >>> channels.
> >>> Some amount of training will be required. The Government already trains
> >> selected
> >>> teachers in each District on various skills and then encourages them to
> >> train
> >>> their colleagues. We can follow the same model. It might require us to
> > offer
> >>> training in approximately 40 locations.
> >>> Or we can do it at the zonal level, say, in 5-8 locations.
> >>>
> >>> Please suggest how we can take this forward.
> >>> Perhaps put up a proposal on an appropriate wiki if we're satisfied
with
> >> the
> >>> skeleton?
> >>>
> >>> - Sundar
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> "That language is an instrument of human reason, and not merely a
>medium
> >> for
> >>> the expression of thought, is a truth generally admitted."
> >>> - George Boole, quoted in Iverson's Turing Award Lecture
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> From: Jessie Wild<jwild at wikimedia.org>
> >>>> To: BalaSundaraRaman<sundarbecse at yahoo.com>
> >>>> Cc:ravishankar.ayyakkannu at gmail.com
> >>>> Sent: Fri, November 19, 2010 4:45:14 AM
> >>>> Subject: Re: Qs regarding village school& WP
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks, Sundar.
> >>>>
> >>>> I definitely agree that the offline versions will be useful, and the
> >> type of
> >>>> project you are describing is exactly the type of offline work I am
> >> helping
> >>>> orchestrate - so yes: let's brainstorm and work together on this!
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> A couple questions to get our conversations going:
> >>>> * For the Tamil Wikipedia project, is this the same project proposed
> >> back in
> >>>> 2007, or is it an extension of it? I am curious of this ever got
>off
> >>>> the
> >>>>
> >>>> ground initially.
> >>>>
> >>>> * Also, I am curious what are you thinking for the collection of
> >> articles to
> >>>> be included on the CD. Would you want the whole Tamil
> >> Wikipedia/Wiktionary
> >>>> collection? Or would you go through the process of screening the
> >> articles to
> >>>> make sure they were student appropriate / of high academic
>quality?
> >>>>
> >>>> * In addition, in regards to article selection (above point), would
> > the
> >>>> Tamil Nadu government need to approve the articles that were being
> >>>> distributed into schools?
> >>>>
> >>>> * Why CD? Why not USB? Just curious!
> >>>>
> >>>> * How are you thinking of getting the CDs to the different schools?
> >> Who is
> >>>> going to download the materials onto the school computers? Will
>there
> >> (or
> >>>> does there need to be) any training involved?
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Sorry for the many questions - hopefully they'll push us closer to
> > some
> >>>> productive movement!
> >>>> Jessie
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On 11/17/2010 7:05 PM, BalaSundaraRaman wrote:
> >>>> Hi Jessie,
> >>>>> On another note, we at Tamil Wikipedia have been discussing
> >> ways to
> >>>>> publish an offline edition (primarily CD-based) of selected
> >> articles
> >>>> >from Tamil Wikipedia and possibly the whole of Tamil
> >> Wiktionary. Will
> >>>>> you be interested in helping with this?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> This will be useful in schools, because the TN government
>has
> >> provided
> >>>>> almost every school with a couple of computers. In fact,
>they're
> >> also
> >>>>> training the teachers (including my mom) in basic computer
> >> usage. With
> >>>>> an offline edition, students can immediately benefit
>regardless
> >> of
> >>>>> whether they have access to the internet.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> - Sundar
> >>>>>
> >>> "That language is an instrument of human reason, and not merely
>a
> >> medium
> >>> for the expression of thought, is a truth generally admitted."
> >>>>> - George Boole, quoted in Iverson's Turing Award Lecture
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> From: Jessie Wild<jwild at wikimedia.org>
> >>>>>> To:sundarbecse at yahoo.com;ravishankar.ayyakkannu at gmail.com
> >>>>>> Sent: Thu, November 18, 2010 12:56:55 AM
> >>>>>> Subject: Qs regarding village school& WP
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Sundar / Ravishankar -
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thanks for sharing this wonderful story below! What a
> >> great
> >>>>>> example of how WP can be useful in schools.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> So, I'm working on the development and deployment of
> >>> offline
> >>>>>> Wikipedia, and the areas we think will be most
>effective
> >> to get
> >>>>>> into are schools in areas without consistent access to
> >> Internet.
> >>>>>> To that end, hearing this story raised a couple
>immediate
> >>>>>> questions in my mind which I thought I'd ask you:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> (1) What was this school's connection to the Internet?
> >> That is,
> >>>>>> were they connecting to Wikipedia/Wiktionary online?
> >>>>>> (2) What exactly is a "state-funded free education
> >> school"? Does
> >>>>>> that just mean that students do not have to pay to
>attend,
> >> or is
> >>>>>> this a specific type of school (sorry, I am not
>familiar
> >> with the
> >>>>>> phrase so just want to make sure I understand!)?
> >>>>>> (3) Why did Mr. Jothimani choose to use
> >> Wikipedia/Wiktionary over
> >>>>>> other sources?
> >>>>>> (4) Do we know if the students had used Wikipedia prior
> to
> >> the
> >>>>>> launch of this project? Had the teachers?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thank you both so much; what an awesome story!
> >>>>>> Jessie
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On 11/16/2010 8:15 PM, BalaSundaraRaman wrote:
> >>>>>> Hi Sue, I just got reminded of the following story about how
students
> >> and staff
> >>>>>> of a village school benefited from Tamil Wikipedia. We found this
>from
> >> an
> >>>>>> article in a magazine called "pudhiya thalaimurai" (New Generation)
>and
> >> another
> >>>>>> blogpost.[1] It is about how a school headmaster Mr.Jothimani
>transformed
> >> the
> >>>>>> state-funded free education school at a village Mangudi near
>Kumbakonam
> >> in
> >>>>>> Tamil Nadu. Among others, it includes a section on how Tamil
>Wikipedia
> >> and
> >>>>>> Wiktionary are being used by the students and staff. Subsequently, a
> >> Tamil
> >>>>>> Wikipedian Ravishankar Ayyakkannu (User:Ravidreams) called
>Mr.Jothimani
> >> over
> >>>>>> phone and collected more information. He wrote the findings in the
>Tamil
> >>>>>> Wikipedia blogpost.[2] Translation of some excerpts: * Students of
> >> sixth,
> >>>>>> seventh, and eighth standard (aged ~11-13) use Tamil Wikipedia. *
>One
> >> class
> >>>>>> everyday is dedicated for Wikipedia during school hours. During this
> >> period,
> >>>>>> students research about the topics that they learned that day in
>other
> >> classes
> >>>>>> (examples below). If they need to access the Wiki for their home
>work,
> >> writing
> >>>>>> or speaking contests, students spend time online during lunch or
> >>>>> after hours.
> >>>>>> * They find the information accessible most of the time. * Teachers
>too
> >> find it
> >>>>>> useful. * They felt that they could use more of local information
>about
> >> their
> >>>>>> district and about Tamil Nadu and India in general. * Example use
> >> cases: if
> >>>>>> the teacher gives a topic "statesmen", students look for Nehru,
> >> Kamarajar,
> >>>>>> etc., If they give a story writing contest of the title "a story of
> >> itself told
> >>>>>> by River Cauvery", they search for the article on the river and
write
> >> the
> >>>>>> details in first person. They also go find other interlinked
>articles on
> >> Coorg,
> >>>>>> Poombuhar, etc., and get excited about their findings. The
headmaster
> >> finds
> >>>>>> that the students' creative expression has clearly increased after
> >> introducing
> >>>>>> Tamil Wikipedia. A student who would write 20 sentences on a topic
>now
> >> writes
> >>>>>> 60 sentences. * They also use the Tamil Wiktionary which has nearly
>two
> >> hundred
> >>>>>> thousand entries including technical glossaries donated by the Tamil
> >> Virtual
> >>>>>> Academy. Given that typically students in such remote villages do
>not
> >> have
> >>>>>> access to much information, the utility of this exposure is immense.
> >> Also, most
> >>>>>> of the students of state-run schools come from under-previleged and
> >> low-income
> >>>>>> families. Given that, this helps to even out the systemic bias
> >> somewhat. I've
> >>>>>> taken the liberty to copy Ravishankar who spoke to the headmaster. -
> >>> Sundar
> >>>>>> [1] -http://infinityholes.blogspot.com/2009/10/blog-post.html (in
>Tamil)
> >> [2] -
> >>>>>> http://tamilwikipedia.blogspot.com/2009/10/blog-post_5826.html (in
> >> Tamil) "That
> >>>>>> language is an instrument of human reason, and not merely a medium
for
> >> the
> >>>>>> expression of thought, is a truth generally admitted." - George
Boole,
> >> quoted in
> >>>>>> Iverson's Turing Award Lecture ----- Original Message ----
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> From: Sue Gardner<sgardner at wikimedia.org> To: "Local Chapters,
>board
> >> and
> >>>>>>> officers coordination (closed
> >> subscription)"<Internal-l at lists.wikimedia.org>
> >>>>>>> Sent: Thu, November 11, 2010 12:01:48 PM Subject: [Internal-l]
>Looking
> >> for
> >>>>>>> stories of readers affected by Wikipedia Hi folks, Megan Hernandez
>on
> >> the
> >>>>>>> staff is looking out for me, for stories of readers whose lives
have
> >> been
> >>>>>>> impacted by Wikipedia or the other projects. (Donors often send us
> >> stories like
> >>>>>>> that, and I am often looking for stories to tell people about the
> >> projects. So
> >>>>>>> I've asked her to send good ones to me.) I was writing her a set
of
> >> criteria
> >>>>>>> for the kinds of stories I want, and it occurred to me that you
>might
> >>>>>>> yourselves have some good stories of exactly this kind. So I am
>sending
> >> along
> >>>>>>> the criteria here too :-) If you have stories that fit many/all of
> >> these
> >>>>>>> criteria, please send them to me, onlist or off. And please forgive
>my
> >>>>>>> cross-posting to several lists at once. Thanks, Sue * Ideally,
>they'd
> >> be
> >>>>>>> along the theme of "how Wikipedia made my life better." This might
>be
> >> an
> >>>>>>> anecdote, or bigger-picture (ie, 'how Wikipedia makes my life
better
> >> every
> >>>>>>> day'). * Ideally, they would be stories of people who
> >>>>>>> pre-exposure-to-Wikipedia would have had circumscribed access to
> >> information.
> >>>>>>> Because they grew up in a small town with no library, because their
> >> school
> >>>>>>> didn't stock certain kinds of books, because materials in their
> >> language are of
> >>>>>>> limited availability, because their government limits access to
>certain
> >> types
> >>>>>>> of information -- in general, because their
> >>>>>> economic/political/socio-cultural
> >>>>>>> circumstances somehow impede(d) easy access to information. *
>Ideally,
> >> the
> >>>>>>> information that Wikipedia gives them is important, and directly,
> >> immediately
> >>>>>>> useful. Like, it helped them better understand a health issue they
>were
> >> having,
> >>>>>>> or it equipped them to do some important task better; it helped
them
> >> understand
> >>>>>>> a new situation or some aspect of themselves, or enabled them to
>solve
> >> an
> >>>>>>> important problem. Maybe it helped them get a job they otherwise
> >> couldn't have
> >>>>>>> gotten, or enabled them to avoid some specific danger or risk. *
> >> And/or, the
> >>>>>>> information fed a general curiosity and desire to understand the
>world
> >> better.
> >>>>>>> It got them interested in going to college which nobody in their
>family
> >> had
> >>>>>>> done before, it helped them develop a more thoughtful position on a
> >> public
> >>>>>>> policy issue, it stimulated them to travel or read more widely, or
>to
> >> question
> >>>>>>> assumptions they had been making. * Ideally, their lives are
better
> >> today
> >>>>>>> because of the information they are exposed to via Wikipedia. Maybe
> >> this would
> >>>>>>> be better in some really specific way -- like, "Three months later
I
> >> persuaded
> >>>>>>> my doctor to let me try the new treatment, and it worked." Or, it
>might
> >> be much
> >>>>>>> more general. * It is fine if the information they found on
>Wikipedia
> >> might
> >>>>>>> otherwise have been kept from them, either deliberately or through
>lack
> >> of easy
> >>>>>>> opportunity. It is fine if the information is considered risky or
> >> controversial
> >>>>>>> in some way. Sue Gardner Executive Director Wikimedia
>Foundation
> >> 415 839
> >>>>>>> 6885 office 415 816 9967 cell Imagine a world in which every
single
> >> human
> >>>>>>> being can freely share in the sum of all knowledge. Help us make it
>a
> >>>>>>> reality!http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate
> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ Internal-l
mailing
> >> list
> >>>>>>> Internal-l at lists.wikimedia.org
> >>>>>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/internal-l
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ Internal-l mailing
>list
> >>>>>> Internal-l at lists.wikimedia.org
> >>>>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/internal-l
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> -- Jessie Wild Special Projects Manager Gloabl Development
>Wikimedia
> >>>> Foundation
> >>> -- Jessie Wild Special Projects Manager Gloabl Development Wikimedia
> >> Foundation
> >>
> >> --
> >> Jessie Wild
> >> Special Projects Manager
> >> Gloabl Development
> >> Wikimedia Foundation
> >>
> >>
>
> --
> Jessie Wild
> Special Projects Manager
> Gloabl Development
> Wikimedia Foundation
>
>
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