[Wikita-l] Fw: Qs regarding village school & WP

BalaSundaraRaman sundarbecse at yahoo.com
Thu Nov 25 02:56:11 UTC 2010


அடுத்த கட்ட நடவடிக்கைகளைத் தொடங்க வேண்டும். இலினக்சு குழமத்துடன் நாம் 
தொடங்கியுள்ள திட்டத்தோடு இணைத்து விடலாமா? இந்தத் திட்டங்களுக்குப் பொறுப்பாளராக 
செயல்பட ஒருவர் முன்வர வேண்டும். யாருக்கு விருப்பம் உள்ளது?

- சுந்தர்
 "That language is an instrument of human reason, and not merely a medium for 
the expression of thought, is a truth generally admitted."
- George Boole, quoted in Iverson's Turing Award Lecture



----- Forwarded Message ----
> From: Jessie Wild <jwild at wikimedia.org>
> To: BalaSundaraRaman <sundarbecse at yahoo.com>
> Cc: ravishankar.ayyakkannu at gmail.com
> Sent: Wed, November 24, 2010 11:44:17 PM
> Subject: Re: Qs regarding village school & WP
> 
> Sure - if you would like to begin the discussion on Village Pump that 
> would  be great! I think a lot of the questions we walked briefly through 
> are the  ones where some community support would be needed.   Specifically:
> 
> Immediate support:
> 1 - Selecting the articles/creating  collections of articles.
> 2 - Creating training materials on how to use WP and  how to incorporate 
> it into the classroom
> 3 - Working with government  officials on distribution policies
> 
> Future support:
> 4 -  Distributing/installing software
> 5 - Conducting teacher trainings
> 
> As  you probably suspect, I don't understand Tamil, so I'd love if you'd 
> just  keep me in the loop with what happens on the Tamil and village pump  :)
> 
> Jessie
> 
> On 11/24/2010 2:50 AM, BalaSundaraRaman wrote:
> >  Sorry for the delay on our part, Jessie.
> > The Kenyan project is a useful  project to learn from.
> >
> > Though we have a list at 
>https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikita-l,
> > we still use  the Village Pump to begin most of the discussions.
> > Perhaps we can start  a thread on the list or on meta and put a note at
> >  http://ta.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:VP?
> >
> > -  Sundar
> >
> >   "That language is an instrument of human reason,  and not merely a medium 
>for
> > the expression of thought, is a truth  generally admitted."
> > - George Boole, quoted in Iverson's Turing Award  Lecture
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----
> >>  From: Jessie Wild<jwild at wikimedia.org>
> >> To:  BalaSundaraRaman<sundarbecse at yahoo.com>
> >>  Cc: ravishankar.ayyakkannu at gmail.com
> >>  Sent: Tue, November 23, 2010 12:58:10 AM
> >> Subject: Re: Qs regarding  village school&  WP
> >>
> >> Thanks for the thorough  answers - it's so great you've thought through
> >> so  many of  these things so carefully.
> >>
> >> I'm not sure if you are  familiar with  the project in Kenya that is
> >> somewhat  comparable:
> >>  http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Kenya/Project_for_Kenyan_Schools
> >>
> >>  In  terms of next steps, I think you are right in suggesting to put up  a
> >> proposal on a wiki.  I think the approach the Kenyan  Wikimedians have
> >> taken to project planning is quite thorough and  consequently very
> >> helpful, and constructing something similar for  Tamil Nadu could
> >> likewise be beneficial.
> >>
> >> I  would suggest getting other members of the  Tamil community  onboard
> >> with the planning as soon as possible; is there a  list  serve that I
> >> should get on to follow the   conversations?
> >>
> >> Jessie
> >>
> >> On  11/18/2010 9:31 PM, BalaSundaraRaman  wrote:
> >>>> I  definitely agree that the offline versions will be useful,  and  the
> >> type of
> >>>> project you are describing  is  exactly the type of offline     work I am
> >>  helping
> >>>>   orchestrate - so yes: let's brainstorm and  work     together on  this!
> >>> Thanks a lot, Jessie.  :)
> >>>
> >>>> * For the Tamil  Wikipedia project,  is this the same project proposed
> >> back  in
> >>>>  2007,     or is it an extension of  it?  I am curious of  this ever got 
>off
> >>>>    the
> >>>>
> >>>> ground initially.
> >>> It  derives from the same  thought, but the earlier project did not  go
> >> anywhere.
> >>> At present, we  have more editors  and hence will be able to curate 
content
> >>>    easily.
> >>> We also have richer content on many interesting   topics.
> >>>
> >>>> * Also, I am curious what are you  thinking for the  collection of
> >> articles to
> >>>>  be included on  the CD.  Would you want the whole Tamil
> >>  Wikipedia/Wiktionary
> >>>> collection? Or would you go through  the  process     of screening the
> >> articles  to
> >>>> make  sure they were student appropriate      / of high academic  
quality?
> >>> We're only thinking of  releasing a selection of articles based  on 
quality
> >>  (we've
> >>> just started with a rating system),
> >>>    interestingness and suitability for students, and  comprehensiveness.
> >>>   WikiProject Indian Mammals and  articles on chemical elements form a 
good
> >>>   collection to  share with students.
> >>> The above are only examples, we can   select articles from across several
> >>>  categories.
> >>>
> >>>> * In  addition, in regards  to article selection (above point), would
> >> the
> >>>>  Tamil Nadu government need to approve the articles that  were      being
> >>>> distributed into schools?
> >>> Yes,   perhaps. Due to our prior engagement with them in the recently
> >>  conducted
> >>>   article writing contest sponsored by the  Government of Tamil Nadu,
> >> co-ordination
> >>> would be  easier. We have points of contact in the IT  department,  
>Department
> >> of
> >>> Translation, and the Department of  Education  in fairly senior levels. 
The
> >>> Director of Tamil  Virtual Academy is also a  keen supporter of Tamil
> >>  Wikipedia
> >>> (and an occasional   editor).
> >>>
> >>>> * Why CD? Why not USB? Just  curious!
> >>> I just  thought CDs are less expensive. We can  certainly evaluate USB
> >> storage.
> >>>
> >>>>  * How are you thinking of getting the CDs  to the different  schools?
> >> Who is
> >>>> going to  download the  materials onto the school computers?      Will 
>there
> >>  (or
> >>>> does there need to be) any training  involved?
> >>> We should  take the help of the School Education  department who have
> > existing
> >>>    channels.
> >>> Some amount of training will be required. The  Government  already trains
> >> selected
> >>> teachers in  each District on various skills and  then encourages them to
> >>  train
> >>> their colleagues. We can follow the same  model. It  might require us to
> > offer
> >>> training in approximately  40  locations.
> >>> Or we can do it at the zonal level, say, in  5-8  locations.
> >>>
> >>> Please suggest how we can  take this forward.
> >>>   Perhaps put up a proposal on an  appropriate wiki if we're satisfied 
with
> >> the
> >>>  skeleton?
> >>>
> >>> -  Sundar
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>     "That  language is an instrument of human reason, and not merely a 
>medium
> >>  for
> >>> the expression of thought, is a truth generally  admitted."
> >>> -  George Boole, quoted in Iverson's Turing  Award  Lecture
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> From:  Jessie Wild<jwild at wikimedia.org>
> >>>>  To:  BalaSundaraRaman<sundarbecse at yahoo.com>
> >>>>    Cc:ravishankar.ayyakkannu at gmail.com
> >>>>    Sent: Fri, November 19, 2010 4:45:14 AM
> >>>> Subject: Re: Qs  regarding  village school&    WP
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks,   Sundar.
> >>>>
> >>>> I definitely agree that the  offline versions  will be useful, and the
> >> type  of
> >>>> project  you are describing is exactly the type of  offline     work I am
> >> helping
> >>>>  orchestrate - so yes: let's brainstorm and work      together on  this!
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> A couple  questions to get  our conversations going:
> >>>> * For the  Tamil Wikipedia project, is this  the same project proposed
> >>  back in
> >>>>   2007,     or is it an extension of  it?  I am curious of this ever  got 
>off
> >>>>  the
> >>>>
> >>>> ground   initially.
> >>>>
> >>>> * Also, I am curious what are  you thinking  for the collection of
> >> articles  to
> >>>> be  included on the CD.  Would you want the  whole Tamil
> >> Wikipedia/Wiktionary
> >>>> collection? Or  would you go through the  process     of screening  the
> >> articles to
> >>>> make  sure they were  student appropriate     / of high academic   
>quality?
> >>>>
> >>>> * In addition, in regards to  article selection  (above point), would
> > the
> >>>>  Tamil Nadu government need to  approve the articles that were      being
> >>>> distributed into   schools?
> >>>>
> >>>> * Why CD? Why not USB?  Just  curious!
> >>>>
> >>>> * How are you  thinking of getting the CDs to  the different schools?
> >> Who  is
> >>>> going to download  the materials onto the school  computers?      Will 
>there
> >> (or
> >>>>  does there need to be) any training   involved?
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Sorry for  the many questions -  hopefully they'll push us closer to
> >  some
> >>>> productive  movement!
> >>>>  Jessie
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On  11/17/2010  7:05 PM, BalaSundaraRaman wrote:
> >>>> Hi  Jessie,
> >>>>> On  another note, we at Tamil Wikipedia  have been discussing
> >> ways to
> >>>>> publish an  offline edition (primarily  CD-based) of            selected
> >> articles
> >>>>   >from Tamil  Wikipedia and possibly the whole            of  Tamil
> >> Wiktionary. Will
> >>>>> you be  interested  in helping with             this?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>  This will be useful in  schools, because the TN government            
>has
> >> provided
> >>>>> almost  every school with a couple of  computers.            In fact, 
>they're
> >> also
> >>>>> training the teachers  (including my mom)            in basic  computer
> >> usage.  With
> >>>>> an offline  edition, students can            immediately  benefit 
>regardless
> >> of
> >>>>>   whether they  have access to           the   internet.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>  -  Sundar
> >>>>>
> >>> "That language is an  instrument of human reason,  and not merely          
>a
> >> medium
> >>> for the  expression of thought, is a  truth generally           admitted."
> >>>>> - George Boole, quoted in Iverson's Turing  Award   Lecture
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>    From: Jessie Wild<jwild at wikimedia.org>
> >>>>>>    To:sundarbecse at yahoo.com;ravishankar.ayyakkannu at gmail.com
> >>>>>>    Sent: Thu, November 18, 2010 12:56:55 AM
> >>>>>> Subject:  Qs  regarding village school&    WP
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>   Sundar /  Ravishankar -
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thanks  for  sharing this wonderful story below! What a
> >>  great
> >>>>>> example of how WP can be useful in   schools.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> So, I'm working  on the  development and deployment of
> >>>  offline
> >>>>>> Wikipedia, and  the areas we think will  be most                 
>effective
> >> to get
> >>>>>> into are schools in  areas without                consistent  access to
> >> Internet.
> >>>>>> To that end, hearing  this                story raised a  couple 
>immediate
> >>>>>>   questions in my mind  which               I  thought I'd ask  you:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> (1) What was  this  school's connection to the Internet?
> >> That  is,
> >>>>>> were they connecting to   Wikipedia/Wiktionary                 online?
> >>>>>> (2) What exactly is a "state-funded  free  education
> >> school"?    Does
> >>>>>> that just mean that students do not  have  to               pay to 
>attend,
> >>  or  is
> >>>>>> this a specific type of school                 (sorry, I am not  
>familiar
> >> with the
> >>>>>>   phrase so just  want to               make  sure I  understand!)?
> >>>>>> (3) Why did Mr. Jothimani choose  to  use
> >> Wikipedia/Wiktionary   over
> >>>>>> other  sources?
> >>>>>>   (4) Do we know if the students had  used Wikipedia prior              
>   to
> >> the
> >>>>>> launch of this   project?  Had the  teachers?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thank   you both so much; what an awesome story!
> >>>>>>    Jessie
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>  On 11/16/2010  8:15 PM, BalaSundaraRaman  wrote:
> >>>>>> Hi Sue,  I just got  reminded of  the following story about how 
students
> >> and   staff
> >>>>>> of a  village school  benefited from  Tamil Wikipedia. We found this 
>from
> >>  an
> >>>>>>   article in a magazine called "pudhiya  thalaimurai" (New  Generation) 
>and
> >>  another
> >>>>>> blogpost.[1] It is about how a  school  headmaster Mr.Jothimani 
>transformed
> >>  the
> >>>>>>   state-funded  free education school  at a village Mangudi near 
>Kumbakonam
> >> in
> >>>>>>  Tamil Nadu. Among  others, it includes a section on  how Tamil  
>Wikipedia
> >> and
> >>>>>> Wiktionary are being   used by  the students and staff. Subsequently, a
> >>  Tamil
> >>>>>> Wikipedian  Ravishankar Ayyakkannu  (User:Ravidreams) called  
>Mr.Jothimani
> >>  over
> >>>>>> phone and collected more information. He wrote  the  findings in the 
>Tamil
> >>>>>> Wikipedia  blogpost.[2]   Translation of some excerpts: * Students of
> >>  sixth,
> >>>>>> seventh,  and eighth standard (aged  ~11-13) use Tamil  Wikipedia.  * 
>One
> >>  class
> >>>>>> everyday is dedicated for Wikipedia during  school  hours. During this
> >> period,
> >>>>>>  students research about the  topics that they learned that day in  
>other
> >> classes
> >>>>>>   (examples below).  If they need to access the Wiki for their home 
>work,
> >>  writing
> >>>>>> or speaking contests, students spend time  online  during lunch or
> >>>>> after   hours.
> >>>>>> * They  find the information accessible  most of the time.  * Teachers 
>too
> >> find   it
> >>>>>> useful.  * They felt that they  could  use more of local information 
>about
> >>  their
> >>>>>>   district  and about Tamil Nadu and  India in general.  * Example use
> >> cases:   if
> >>>>>> the teacher gives a topic "statesmen",   students look  for Nehru,
> >>  Kamarajar,
> >>>>>> etc., If they give  a story writing  contest of the title "a  story of
> >> itself   told
> >>>>>> by River Cauvery", they search for  the  article on the river  and 
write
> >> the
> >>>>>>  details in  first person. They also go find other interlinked   
>articles on
> >> Coorg,
> >>>>>> Poombuhar, etc., and  get excited  about their findings. The  
headmaster
> >>  finds
> >>>>>> that the  students' creative expression  has clearly increased  after
> >>  introducing
> >>>>>> Tamil Wikipedia. A student who would  write 20  sentences on a  topic 
>now
> >>  writes
> >>>>>> 60 sentences.  *  They also use the  Tamil Wiktionary which has nearly 
>two
> >>  hundred
> >>>>>> thousand  entries including   technical glossaries donated by the Tamil
> >>  Virtual
> >>>>>>   Academy.   Given that typically  students in such remote villages do 
>not
> >>  have
> >>>>>> access to much  information, the utility  of this  exposure is immense.
> >> Also,  most
> >>>>>> of the  students of state-run schools come  from under-previleged and
> >> low-income
> >>>>>>  families. Given that, this helps to even out the  systemic bias
> >>  somewhat.  I've
> >>>>>> taken the liberty  to copy  Ravishankar who spoke to the headmaster.  -
> >>>    Sundar
> >>>>>> [1]   -http://infinityholes.blogspot.com/2009/10/blog-post.html  (in  
>Tamil)
> >> [2]  -
> >>>>>>    http://tamilwikipedia.blogspot.com/2009/10/blog-post_5826.html   (in
> >> Tamil)  "That
> >>>>>> language is  an  instrument of human reason, and not merely a medium 
for
> >>  the
> >>>>>> expression of thought, is a truth generally  admitted." -  George 
Boole,
> >> quoted  in
> >>>>>> Iverson's Turing  Award Lecture     ----- Original Message   ----
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> From: Sue  Gardner<sgardner at wikimedia.org>    To:  "Local Chapters, 
>board
> >> and
> >>>>>>>  officers coordination (closed
> >> subscription)"<Internal-l at lists.wikimedia.org>
> >>>>>>>    Sent: Thu, November 11, 2010 12:01:48 PM Subject: [Internal-l]  
>Looking
> >> for
> >>>>>>> stories of readers  affected by Wikipedia  Hi  folks,  Megan Hernandez 
>on
> >>  the
> >>>>>>> staff is looking out  for me, for  stories  of readers whose lives 
have
> >>  been
> >>>>>>> impacted by Wikipedia or the  other  projects.  (Donors often send us
> >> stories   like
> >>>>>>> that, and I am  often  looking  for stories to tell people about the
> >> projects.   So
> >>>>>>> I've  asked her to send good ones to  me.)   I was writing her a set 
of
> >>  criteria
> >>>>>>> for the kinds  of stories I want,  and it occurred to me that you   
>might
> >>>>>>>  yourselves have some good stories of exactly this  kind. So I am  
>sending
> >> along
> >>>>>>> the criteria here  too  :-) If you have stories that fit many/all of
> >>  these
> >>>>>>>   criteria, please send them to me,  onlist or off. And please forgive  
>my
> >>>>>>>  cross-posting to several lists at once.  Thanks,  Sue  *   Ideally, 
>they'd
> >> be
> >>>>>>> along the theme  of  "how Wikipedia made my life better."  This might 
>be
> >>  an
> >>>>>>> anecdote, or bigger-picture (ie, 'how  Wikipedia makes  my  life 
better
> >>  every
> >>>>>>> day').  * Ideally, they  would  be stories of people  who
> >>>>>>>    pre-exposure-to-Wikipedia would have had circumscribed access   to
> >> information.
> >>>>>>> Because they grew up  in a small town with  no  library, because their
> >>  school
> >>>>>>> didn't stock  certain kinds of  books,  because materials in their
> >> language are   of
> >>>>>>> limited availability,  because   their government limits access to 
>certain
> >>  types
> >>>>>>> of information --  in general,  because  their
> >>>>>>    economic/political/socio-cultural
> >>>>>>> circumstances  somehow  impede(d) easy access to information.  * 
>Ideally,
> >>  the
> >>>>>>> information that Wikipedia gives them is  important,  and directly,
> >>  immediately
> >>>>>>> useful. Like, it helped  them  better understand a health issue  they 
>were
> >>  having,
> >>>>>>> or it equipped them to  do some  important task better; it  helped 
them
> >>  understand
> >>>>>>> a new situation or  some aspect  of themselves, or  enabled them to 
>solve
> >>  an
> >>>>>>> important problem. Maybe it helped them get  a  job  they otherwise
> >> couldn't  have
> >>>>>>> gotten, or  enabled them to avoid some  specific  danger or risk.  *
> >> And/or,   the
> >>>>>>> information fed a general curiosity  and  desire  to understand the 
>world
> >>  better.
> >>>>>>> It got them interested  in  going  to college which nobody in their 
>family
> >>  had
> >>>>>>> done before, it helped  them develop a  more  thoughtful position on a
> >>  public
> >>>>>>> policy issue,  it  stimulated  them to travel or read more widely, or 
>to
> >>  question
> >>>>>>> assumptions they had  been  making.  * Ideally, their lives are  
better
> >>  today
> >>>>>>> because of the information they are  exposed to via  Wikipedia.  Maybe
> >> this  would
> >>>>>>> be better in some  really specific  way -- like, "Three months  later 
I
> >>  persuaded
> >>>>>>> my doctor to let me try the new  treatment, and  it worked."  Or, it 
>might
> >> be   much
> >>>>>>> more general.  * It is  fine if  the information  they found on 
>Wikipedia
> >>  might
> >>>>>>> otherwise have been kept from them,  either   deliberately or through 
>lack
> >> of   easy
> >>>>>>> opportunity. It is fine if  the   information is considered risky or
> >>  controversial
> >>>>>>> in some   way.     Sue Gardner Executive Director Wikimedia   
>Foundation
> >> 415  839
> >>>>>>> 6885 office 415 816 9967  cell   Imagine a  world in which every 
single
> >>  human
> >>>>>>> being can freely share in the sum of  all   knowledge.  Help us make it  
>a
> >>>>>>>    reality!http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate
> >>>>>>>    _______________________________________________ Internal-l   
mailing
> >> list
> >>>>>>> Internal-l at lists.wikimedia.org
> >>>>>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/internal-l
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>    _______________________________________________ Internal-l mailing   
>list
> >>>>>> Internal-l at lists.wikimedia.org
> >>>>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/internal-l
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>    --  Jessie Wild Special Projects Manager Gloabl Development   
>Wikimedia
> >>>> Foundation
> >>> --  Jessie Wild  Special Projects  Manager Gloabl Development Wikimedia
> >>  Foundation
> >>
> >> -- 
> >> Jessie  Wild
> >>  Special Projects Manager
> >> Gloabl Development
> >>  Wikimedia  Foundation
> >>
> >>
> 
> -- 
> Jessie  Wild
> Special Projects Manager
> Gloabl Development
> Wikimedia  Foundation
> 
> 



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