[Wikimedia Kenya] Fwd: what do you think?

Wed Apr 6 18:51:06 UTC 2011

Well said Abbas, specifically on the issue of board members representing the community.

So echoing Abbas, if we are to increase the number of board members, I don't see Oscar's reason as a valid one.

Regarding the Etherpad, yah, I can't do updates via phone :( I've always seen it as a good platform for collaborating on meeting schedules but since it's already up....

If you guys are up for a physical meetup, please confirm this by tomorrow and I'll request for space at ihub.

Cheers,
Alex.

On Wed Apr 6th, 2011 11:15 AM PDT Abbas Mahmood wrote:

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>OK, I'll tell Alex to arrange a possible meetup this weekend at iHub.On another note, I know this is slightly off-topic but I'll echo it here:I have been experiencing some problems accessing the etherpad today, presumably because of my internet sucks, so I'll put my comment here today:In the etherpad, oscar raised an issue regarding the adding more member(s) to the board so that the voice of the community is heard.My response: I do not agree with this statement simply because you are implying that the board is not part of the community and therefore it needs an extra person from the community to represent them. The board will comprise of people who come from the community, so I don't see why there is a need "of a voice from the community". Oscar also mentioned the factor of typical Kenyan boardrooms with a person/seat representing the members/community.My response: In my opinion, I don't find it logical to compare us with a typical Kenyan organization
 which has meetings in closed doors and therefore necessitating a seat to voice the community. On the other hand, Wikimedia is open. The meetings are open to all. It is only the decision-makers that are the board. This is not an organisation whose board will be made up of consultants who don't have a clue about what is happening in the community: the board is the community! I do not believe in a Wikimedia where there is a veil between the board and the community. And Oscar, you've been complaining about the low turnover of responses on the etherpad. I have received some reports claiming that people can't access the etherpad from their mobile phones, hence the low rate of replies. (Remember that we are in the Global South and mobile internet is ubiquitous :P)You also mentioned that 10 out of 50 people attend our meetups. I agree with you that that is not an impressive number. But we should remember that there are some members who are not interested in
 meeting up. (I think it was also mentioned in berlin that a number of editors as well were not interested in having face-to-face meetups)-- So don't worry about this: it's typical Wikipedian nature. Others are not interested in knowing who's the Chairperson of the Chapter. Others don't care about voting or selecting members of the Board. Others might be interested only in going to Nyeri. Or others might not have the fare to make it to the venue. It is important to realise that different people have different needs. So don't expect every Tom, Dick & Harry to be interested in the bylaws. Maybe it's just their character not to be interested in the actual paperwork but rather, they are concerned with fieldwork.Sincerely,
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>Abbas Mahmood
>t | +254722215101
>f | www.facebook.com/abbasjnr
>s | abbasjnr
>Wikimedia Kenya Member
> 
>"Imagine a world in which every single person on the planet is given free access to the sum of all human knowledge. That's our commitment."
> 
>Please donate: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate/Now/en
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>From: oliver_stegen at sil.org
>To: wikimediake at lists.wikimedia.org
>Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2011 13:14:34 +0300
>Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] Fwd:  what do you think?
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>Guys,
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>Please stay civil – it’s hard enough to
>agree when talking face to face, let alone electronically.
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>I also had problems entering the pad when
>I tried for the first few times. It’s not everybody’s cup of tea to discuss
>things online – we may need more regular meetings at iHub or suchlike.
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>On the whole though, I agree that we need
>to concentrate on the bylaws and registration as trust or limited company. How
>shall we go about coming to a consensus which type of registration to follow?
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>Best,
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>Oliver (aka BT)
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>From:
>wikimediake-bounces at lists.wikimedia.org
>[mailto:wikimediake-bounces at lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of Limoke Oscar
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>Sent: 05 April 2011 11:11
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>To: Wikimedia Kenya .
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>Subject: [Wikimedia Kenya] Fwd:
>what do you think?
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>On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 10:59 AM, Isaac K. Kosgei <kips8505izo at gmail.com>
>wrote:
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>Dear Oscar,
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>About the Etherpad issue you should have explained everything clearly,
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>thanks to stave am getting the password today.
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>  Kosgei,
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>I don't mean to be rude but I shared the password long time ago.Maybe
>you don't read your emails carefully.We already have existing bylaws and am not
>sure you have looked at them.We are doing something "simple and
>stupid"...why don't you come to the pad and air the pros and cons of your
>thought?
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>My point to you is Why don't register it as a company limited by
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>Guarantee? ---NOT FOR PROFIT MAKING:::look at it along those lines and
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>if you are OK with that Obadiah and I can assist in drafting the
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>constitution (MOA and AOA). at least we have managed to go through the
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>process and successful registered one of that Kind
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>On 05/04/2011, Limoke Oscar <oslimoke at gmail.com> wrote:
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>> Guys,
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>> I am not so happy with this empty talk of you guys.We need to forge ahead
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>> and focus on the Chapter.
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>> I shared the etherpad for discusiion of the By-lwas only a fistful of the
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>> "usual susspects" loged in and contributed to the same.So shame
>on you if
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>> you did not log into the same and you have your mouth wide open
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>> chanting-----well my apologies
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>> We need to focus on the bylwas and work on timelines.for instance we need
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>> say like after 14days after sharing the etherpad,the final discussions and
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>> contributions will be deemed binding to the whole Chapter.So lets show
>oour
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>> commitement and discuss the bylaws.its a shame that some of us have never
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>> even read the existing bylaws so it would be very difficult to make a good
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>> contribution....also read from other Chapters and make wise and learned
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>> contributions.....
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>> see
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>>    1. Wikimedia Chapters-
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>> http://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikimedia_chapters&diff=0&oldid=2472514
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>>    2. The Etherpad(password-wikimediakenya)----
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>>    http://oslimoke.ietherpad.com/1
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>>    3. WikimediaKE Bylaws--
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>>    http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Kenya/bylaws
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>> Regards,
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>> and see u at the pad.....
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>> On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 8:53 AM, Abbas Mahmood <abbasjnr at hotmail.com>
>wrote:
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>>>  let me repeat what I said earlier: we do NOT need TSLG to wire
>money into
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>>> a personal account. They could pay the expenses directly to the
>concerned
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>>> parties.
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>>>
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>>> And, to answer your question, when we receive a grant, whether it's
>from
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>>> the government or an institution, the grant is not tax-deductible so
>long
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>>> as
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>>> it is being utilised to fulfill a non-profit mission. For instance, if
>you
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>>> receive a grant to open up an M-Pesa shop, you are supposed to pay tax
>out
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>>> of it. But in our case, we are non-profit, so we are tax-exempt.
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>>>
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>>>     -------------------------------------
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>>> Abbas Mahmood
>
>>> t | +254722215101
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>>> f | www.facebook.com/abbasjnr
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>>> s | abbasjnr
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>>> Wikimedia Kenya Member
>
>>>
>
>>> "*Imagine a world in which every single person on the planet is
>given free
>
>>> access to the sum of all human knowledge. That's our
>commitment."*
>
>>> **
>
>>> Please donate: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate/Now/en
>
>>>
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>>>
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>>>
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>>>
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>>> ------------------------------
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>>> Date: Mon, 4 Apr 2011 22:37:11 -0700
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>>> From: bruceobwari at gmail.com
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>>>
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>>> To: wikimediake at lists.wikimedia.org
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>>> Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] what do you think?
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>>>
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>>> First let me say the case of TSL &G offers us opportunity to learn
>, i do
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>>> echo Abbas sentiments regarding the need to focus on by-laws,having
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>>> listened
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>>> to the guy ,it did make lots of sense that if we think of engaging
>others
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>>> we
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>>> need to have a formalized engagement ,his being a corporate body it
>was
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>>> crucial . point of correction ,the issue of money being deposited on
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>>> individual account and having people posing as wikimedians was
>extensively
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>>> used as an example to issue how we can run into serious legal issues
>if we
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>>> don't address the issue of formality,
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>>>      On a lighter note, somebody please educate
> me on this ,whats our tax
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>>> obligations when money is deposited in our accounts ,VAT , income tax,
>pay
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>>> as you earn /deposit ,zero rated tax, have a tax -free day ,won't you!
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>>>
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>>> On Mon, Apr 4, 2011 at 10:42 AM, stephen wanjau
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>>> <wanjaustev at gmail.com>wrote:
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>>>
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>>> personally,I think we should focus on the bylaws then form some legal
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>>> framework.It was part of the plan anyway.
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>>>
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><snip>
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