[Wikimedia Kenya] what do you think?

Tue Apr 5 08:52:05 UTC 2011

Abbas, thats well said we don't have any tax obligations when anon
registered group recieves grants for no-profit making business, lets bring
the matter of TLS &G  to rest i did like the arguement it elisted from both
off and on list.
   Oscar , don't get offended for this but kindly share the link and
password again to enable us fully participate on the matter of by laws with
the view of finding the way forward

On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 1:16 AM, Abbas Mahmood <abbasjnr at hotmail.com> wrote:

>  Hi Isaac,
>
> We (or at least I) haven't totally ruled out the "company limited by
> guarantee" option since that's what Wikimedia UK did.
>
>
>
>      -------------------------------------
> Abbas Mahmood
> t | +254722215101
> f | www.facebook.com/abbasjnr
> s | abbasjnr
> Wikimedia Kenya Member
>
> "*Imagine a world in which every single person on the planet is given free
> access to the sum of all human knowledge. That's our commitment."*
> **
> Please donate: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate/Now/en
>
>
>
>
> > Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2011 10:59:29 +0300
> > From: kips8505izo at gmail.com
>
> > To: wikimediake at lists.wikimedia.org
> > Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] what do you think?
> >
> > Dear Oscar,
> > About the Etherpad issue you should have explained everything clearly,
> > thanks to stave am getting the password today.
> > My point to you is Why don't register it as a company limited by
> > Guarantee? ---NOT FOR PROFIT MAKING:::look at it along those lines and
> > if you are OK with that Obadiah and I can assist in drafting the
> > constitution (MOA and AOA). at least we have managed to go through the
> > process and successful registered one of that Kind
> >
> > On 05/04/2011, Limoke Oscar <oslimoke at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Guys,
> > > I am not so happy with this empty talk of you guys.We need to forge
> ahead
> > > and focus on the Chapter.
> > > I shared the etherpad for discusiion of the By-lwas only a fistful of
> the
> > > "usual susspects" loged in and contributed to the same.So shame on you
> if
> > > you did not log into the same and you have your mouth wide open
> > > chanting-----well my apologies
> > >
> > > We need to focus on the bylwas and work on timelines.for instance we
> need to
> > > say like after 14days after sharing the etherpad,the final discussions
> and
> > > contributions will be deemed binding to the whole Chapter.So lets show
> oour
> > > commitement and discuss the bylaws.its a shame that some of us have
> never
> > > even read the existing bylaws so it would be very difficult to make a
> good
> > > contribution....also read from other Chapters and make wise and learned
> > > contributions.....
> > >
> > > see
> > >
> > > 1. Wikimedia Chapters-
> > >
> > >
> http://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikimedia_chapters&diff=0&oldid=2472514
> > > 2. The Etherpad(password-wikimediakenya)----
> > > http://oslimoke.ietherpad.com/1
> > > 3. WikimediaKE Bylaws--
> > > http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Kenya/bylaws
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > and see u at the pad.....
> > >
> > > On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 8:53 AM, Abbas Mahmood <abbasjnr at hotmail.com>
> wrote:
> > >
> > >> let me repeat what I said earlier: we do NOT need TSLG to wire money
> into
> > >> a personal account. They could pay the expenses directly to the
> concerned
> > >> parties.
> > >>
> > >> And, to answer your question, when we receive a grant, whether it's
> from
> > >> the government or an institution, the grant is not tax-deductible so
> long
> > >> as
> > >> it is being utilised to fulfill a non-profit mission. For instance, if
> you
> > >> receive a grant to open up an M-Pesa shop, you are supposed to pay tax
> out
> > >> of it. But in our case, we are non-profit, so we are tax-exempt.
> > >>
> > >> -------------------------------------
> > >> Abbas Mahmood
> > >> t | +254722215101
> > >> f | www.facebook.com/abbasjnr
> > >> s | abbasjnr
> > >> Wikimedia Kenya Member
> > >>
> > >> "*Imagine a world in which every single person on the planet is given
> free
> > >> access to the sum of all human knowledge. That's our commitment."*
> > >> **
> > >> Please donate: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate/Now/en
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> ------------------------------
> > >> Date: Mon, 4 Apr 2011 22:37:11 -0700
> > >> From: bruceobwari at gmail.com
> > >>
> > >> To: wikimediake at lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] what do you think?
> > >>
> > >> First let me say the case of TSL &G offers us opportunity to learn , i
> do
> > >> echo Abbas sentiments regarding the need to focus on by-laws,having
> > >> listened
> > >> to the guy ,it did make lots of sense that if we think of engaging
> others
> > >> we
> > >> need to have a formalized engagement ,his being a corporate body it
> was
> > >> crucial . point of correction ,the issue of money being deposited on
> > >> individual account and having people posing as wikimedians was
> extensively
> > >> used as an example to issue how we can run into serious legal issues
> if we
> > >> don't address the issue of formality,
> > >> On a lighter note, somebody please educate me on this ,whats our tax
> > >> obligations when money is deposited in our accounts ,VAT , income tax,
> pay
> > >> as you earn /deposit ,zero rated tax, have a tax -free day ,won't you!
> > >>
> > >> On Mon, Apr 4, 2011 at 10:42 AM, stephen wanjau
> > >> <wanjaustev at gmail.com>wrote:
> > >>
> > >> personally,I think we should focus on the bylaws then form some legal
> > >> framework.It was part of the plan anyway.
> > >>
> > >> On 4/4/11, lilian nyarera <lireshi at yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >> > Hey Abbas, its time we gave the bylaws a priority because i don't
> think
> > >> > there's any pressing issue at the moment. Again you know matters
> dealing
> > >> > with money must be delt with a lot of sensitivity so that the faster
> we
> > >> > develop a legal framework the better. We are constantly growing big
> and
> > >> soon
> > >> > the members, grantors/donors will require audited work with
> signatories.
> > >> > Thats just my thot. though. Regards.
> > >> >
> > >> > On Mon Apr 4th, 2011 10:12 AM PDT Abbas Mahmood wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> >>I propose that we now focus more on the bylaws and legal vehicle so
> that
> > >> we
> > >> >> can submit the final draft and get registered ASAP, lest we shall
> miss
> > >> >> this and many more partnerships to come.
> > >> >>
> > >> >>> Date: Mon, 4 Apr 2011 19:35:39 +0000
> > >> >>> From: sarahosano at gmail.com
> > >> >>> To: wikimediake at lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> >>> Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] what do you think?
> > >> >>>
> > >> >>> Hello Steve,
> > >> >>> I agree that we would require an account becouse at some point we
> will
> > >> be
> > >> >>> asking for grants,donations or something,and other than the
> > >> foundation,I
> > >> >>> dont think anybody else would be willing to deposit money in
> personal
> > >> >>> account.
> > >> >>> At this stage that we are still not a legal entity,I find it
> tricky to
> > >> >>> form such a partnership.It is a great idea though.
> > >> >>> Regards
> > >> >>>
> > >> >>> Abbas Mahmood <abbasjnr at hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >> >>>
> > >> >>> >I do not agree with the fact that ''money that enters into a
> personal
> > >> >>> > account must be taxed''. And who said we need money in the first
> > >> >>> > place?? I mean, they don't have to wire us the money: they could
> > >> >>> > directly pay the accommodation and other bills without the money
> > >> >>> > passing into our hands.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >Personnally, I'm also skeptical in forming such a partnershp at
> this
> > >> >>> > stage -- simply because we aren't registered as yet.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >Regarding our IDs, let's just say that the schools laid mutual
> trust
> > >> in
> > >> >>> > us, since after all, they were the sole beneficiaries and they
> had
> > >> >>> > nothing to lose. However, this current scenario is more complex,
> > >> since
> > >> >>> > it is a partnership and usually requires both parties signing an
> > >> >>> > official document, which I don't think we have the capacity to
> do
> > >> >>> > so.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >I remember talking to Sue (the Executive Director of WMF) while I
> was
> > >> in
> > >> >>> > Berlin regarding the grants process and she told me that the
> reason
> > >> why
> > >> >>> > the Foundation gives out grants to chapters is because they want
> us
> > >> to
> > >> >>> > make mistakes and learn from our mistakes, since the foundation
> is
> > >> >>> > softer, forgiving and has a sense of trust in us. However, when
> we
> > >> make
> > >> >>> > a mistake with TSLG, we have the law to answer.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >I'm not saying no to this partnership, but neither am I saying
> yes. I
> > >> >>> > remain skeptical and await to see other reactions.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >Date: Mon, 4 Apr 2011 18:29:07 +0300
> > >> >>> >From: wanjaustev at gmail.com
> > >> >>> >To: wikimediake at lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> >>> >Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] what do you think?
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >Just expounding on what Bruce just explained.The managing
> director Of
> > >> >>> > TSLG ,Mr. Arthur Olual main worry is security on our side and
> his
> > >> too
> > >> >>> > because his is already a company.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >He said that at some time back some guys went to a school and
> said
> > >> they
> > >> >>> > were sent by TSLG and then went ahead.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >to collect five computers that they said required servicing at
> 'their
> > >> >>> > station'.luckily the school called him and he told the school
> > >> >>> > administration that nobody has been mandated to collect
> computers
> > >> from
> > >> >>> > schools by TSLG!
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >About the money to carry on the project,he said he cannot deposit
> > >> money
> > >> >>> > into personal accounts because the auditors could quiz the same
> and
> > >> its
> > >> >>> > bad governance!Money into a personal account is income and
> should be
> > >> >>> > taxed.(probably our colleagues who take accounting know what
> that
> > >> >>> > means)
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >By the same token someone could go out and pose to be a
> wiki-median
> > >> and
> > >> >>> > do some harm out there then we would be in trouble with the law.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >In fact he asked us how we have been presenting/introducing
> ourselves
> > >> at
> > >> >>> > the schools we visited!
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >So I guess that this is a wake up call so that we lay down
> measures
> > >> >>> > to
> > >> >>> > register as a legal entity.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >Cheers,
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >On Mon, Apr 4, 2011 at 1:04 PM, BRANTON OBWARI <
> bruceobwari at gmail.com
> > >> >
> > >> >>> > wrote:
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >Steve and i have just met the TSL &G MD
> > >> >>> >we had a very
> > >> >>> >constructive discussion and among issues that came was the issue
> of a
> > >> >>> >formal engagement in the manner that he gets a formal
> communication
> > >> from
> > >> >>> > the Foundation ,or rather some official communication from the
> > >> chapters
> > >> >>> > heads i.e Abbas ,Oscar,
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> > He was of the view the earlier we formalize the better coz he
> > >> >>> >would be having a meeting with Ministry of Education in the next
> few
> > >> >>> >days and he wanted us to have some representatives in the same
> > >> meeting.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> > He also said that the next training for Nyeri teachers was
> scheduled
> > >> to
> > >> >>> > occur in the next two weeks and was requesting our participation
> if
> > >> we
> > >> >>> >are formally engaged.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> > He said we can engage him either by one, training his team and
> > >> >>> > giving them the content for them to for them to install OR by
> > >> >>> > incorporating two members from our team ,
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> > The bone of contention at the moment is the formal engagement so
> we
> > >> >>> > urge Abbas and Oscar to facilitate that,
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> > rgds ,
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> > Steve and Bruce.
> > >> >>> >- Show quoted text -
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >On Mon, Apr 4, 2011 at 1:00 PM, BRANTON OBWARI <
> bruceobwari at gmail.com
> > >> >
> > >> >>> > wrote:
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >Steve and i have just met the TSL &G MD
> > >> >>> >we had a very constructive discussion and among issues that came
> was
> > >> the
> > >> >>> > issue of a formal engagement in the manner that he gets a formal
> > >> >>> > communication from the Foundation ,or rather some official
> > >> >>> > communication from the chapters heads i.e Abbas ,Oscar,
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> > He was of the view the earlier we formalize the better coz he
> > >> >>> > would be having a meeting with Ministry of Education in the next
> few
> > >> >>> > days and he wanted us to have some representatives in the same
> > >> meeting.
> > >> >>> > He also said that the next training for Nyeri teachers was
> > >> >>> > scheduled to occur in the next two weeks and was requesting our
> > >> >>> > participation if we are formally engaged.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> > He said we can engage him either by one, training his team and
> > >> >>> > giving them the content
> > >> >>> >On Mon, Apr 4, 2011 at 9:04 AM, oscar okwero <
> oscar_okwero at yahoo.com>
> > >> >>> > wrote:
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >for a new entrant am impressed by that,lets do more to engage our
> > >> >>> > members.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >--- On Sat, 4/2/11, Alex Wafula <xelawafs at yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >From: Alex Wafula <xelawafs at yahoo.com>
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] what do you think?
> > >> >>> >To: wikimediake at lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> >>> >Date: Saturday, April 2, 2011, 5:22 PM
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >Hey Branton,
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >Seems like a great idea. So when do you plan to meetup with these
> > >> >>> > guys
> > >> >>> > next and get more details on this.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >Cheers,
> > >> >>> >Alex.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >_______________________________________________
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >WikimediaKE mailing list
> > >> >>> >WikimediaKE at lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> >>> >https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >_______________________________________________
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >WikimediaKE mailing list
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >WikimediaKE at lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >_______________________________________________
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >WikimediaKE mailing list
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >WikimediaKE at lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >--
> > >> >>> >Stephen Wathika WanjauJomo Kenyatta University of Agriculture And
> > >> >>> > Technology.Bsc. Mathematics (Statistics) and Computer
> > >> Science.Cell:+254
> > >> >>> > 722 238 165
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> > +254 736 429 517
> > >> >>> >Facebook: www.facebook.com/swanjau
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >Twitter: www.twitter.com/haha_wanjau
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >skype:stephenwanjau1
> > >> >>> >"changing how the world works"
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> >_______________________________________________
> > >> >>> >WikimediaKE mailing list
> > >> >>> >WikimediaKE at lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> >>> >https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
> > >> >>> >_______________________________________________
> > >> >>> >WikimediaKE mailing list
> > >> >>> >WikimediaKE at lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> >>> >https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
> > >> >>> _______________________________________________
> > >> >>> WikimediaKE mailing list
> > >> >>> WikimediaKE at lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> >>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
> > >> >>
> > >> >
> > >> > _______________________________________________
> > >> > WikimediaKE mailing list
> > >> > WikimediaKE at lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> Stephen Wathika Wanjau
> > >> Jomo Kenyatta University of Agriculture And Technology.
> > >> Bsc. Mathematics (*Statistics*) and Computer Science.
> > >> Cell:+254 722 238 165
> > >> +254 736 429 517
> > >>
> > >> Facebook: www.facebook.com/swanjau
> > >>
> > >> Twitter: www.twitter.com/haha_wanjau
> > >>
> > >> skype:stephenwanjau1
> > >>
> > >> "*changing how the world works*"
> > >>
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> WikimediaKE mailing list
> > >> WikimediaKE at lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> _______________________________________________ WikimediaKE mailing
> list
> > >> WikimediaKE at lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
> > >>
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> WikimediaKE mailing list
> > >> WikimediaKE at lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Limoke Oscar,
> > > mayenge.blogspot.com
> > > Freelancer,
> > > GeoInformatics and GIScience Student
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Isaac K. Kosgei.
> > Bachelor of Agribusiness Management
> > Egerton University,
> > Njoro Kenya.
> > (+254727553981)
> > www.linkedin.com/in/kipsizoo
> > Skype:Kipsizoo
> > Twitter:@Kipsizoo
> > *"You Must be the Change you wish to see in the world"-Mahatma Ghandi
> > *
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > WikimediaKE mailing list
> > WikimediaKE at lists.wikimedia.org
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
>
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