[Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself

[Lars Gardenius]

This is certainly not a question only for the English Wikipedia. I somewhat doubt that it even foremost has to do with the English Wikipedia. I have seen this problem primarily in smaller Wikis dominated by few people.

Regards,
Lars Gardenius



________________________________
 Von: Fred Bauder <fredbaud at fairpoint.net>
An: Wikimedia Mailing List <wikimedia-l at lists.wikimedia.org> 
CC: wikien-l at lists.wikimedia.org 
Gesendet: 13:28 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
 

At wikien-l at lists.wikimedia.org ? Perhaps, but hard to start over from
the beginning.

Fred

> Should not this discussion be held on he maillist for English wikipedia?
>
> There is not much, if any,  of what is being discussed that I can
> recognize from my home wp
>
> Anders
>
>
>
> Fred Bauder skrev 2013-09-05 13:18:
>> That was the purpose of the original arbitration committee. Finding a
>> mentor is kind of hard nowdays as there are so many users who might
>> help
>> but probably will not. On the other hand, many requests I have received
>> and looked into are from people who are making trouble themselves;
>> sometimes very serious trouble. Giving a second chance to someone who
>> has
>> been banned by the community after extended discussion seldom works out
>> well. But that's not a newbie who has run into serious trouble just for
>> making jokes about Windoze...
>>
>> Fred
>>
>>> It is very laudable if you, Peter, tries and help newbies and others
>>> that
>>> are harassed by other users.
>>>
>>> I however don't think it is enough in a worldwide organization that
>>> you
>>> have to rely on volunteers and that these will intervene.
>>>
>>> As I see it, if you start such an organization you must also take on
>>> the
>>> responsibilities that follows.
>>> You can't just duck and pretend that you can hand over all problems to
>>> the users.
>>>
>>> I still think that an international organization like the Wikis
>>> demands
>>> an instance to which mistreated and mobbed users can turn. An instance
>>> with the responsibility that normal rules in a society are upheld and
>>> with the authority to uphold them.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Lars Gardenius
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>>   Von: Peter Gervai <grinapo at gmail.com>
>>> An: Wikimedia Mailing List <wikimedia-l at lists.wikimedia.org>
>>> Gesendet: 10:50 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
>>> Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from
>>> itself
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 10:18 AM, Lars Gardenius
>>> <lars.gardenius at yahoo.de>
>>> wrote:
>>>> No I don't think it is being addressed. Not in a serious way.
>>> You mean it's not _solved_. Indeed.
>>>
>>> At least one problem was mentioned in the thread which is that the
>>> (honest, knowledgeable) newbies have unproportionally smaller
>>> debating/lobbying power than aboriginals, and they are very easy to
>>> oppress. This is an ongoing problem for the last decade or so and no
>>> good solution seem to exist.
>>>
>>> In theory there are (or could be) volunteers who could be called in
>>> cases of newbie oppression from the experienced troll^H^H^H^Heditors
>>> who would declare that they try to act as neutral as possible but they
>>> would possess more experience to handle obnoxious editors and other
>>> regual beings. Arbitration, mentoring, whatever we like to call it.
>>> Obviously it only worked if there's a free way to reject a request (if
>>> the volunteer believes the newbie has no merits, let's not call them
>>> outright trolls and vandals) and if it isn't an "official" cabal but a
>>> large catalog of helpful and experienced editors.
>>>
>>> I have often done it (and still occasionally do on Commons since it's
>>> a pretty harsh environment for newbies) and it's doable if there's
>>> enough volunteers and people don't try to do it too often, I mean, one
>>> in a week or month or so.
>>>
>>> The point is to have a group of random people who are not involved in
>>> the debate but could help to communicate with the members of the
>>> community. (Since they're uninvolved it's probably useless to call
>>> them biased, which is the easiest unargument I've seen in such
>>> debates.)
>>>
>>> g
>>>
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>>
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