[Wikimedia-l] Resignation announcement, and a parting remark to everyone

Tue Apr 30 22:53:33 UTC 2013

Le 4/30/13 11:22 AM, Jan-Bart de Vreede a écrit :
> Hey Florence
>
> On Apr 30, 2013, at 1:12 AM, Florence Devouard <anthere9 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Le 4/30/13 12:04 AM, Nathan a écrit :
>>>
>>>
>>> It's not logical to assume that because the WMF has funds it should in
>>> some way equitably distribute those funds around the world.
>>
>> What happens to the idea according to which the funds belong to the Wikimedia mouvement rather than to Wikimedia Foundation ?
>
> Please note that you are disagreeing with Nathan, not with others (like me and as far as I know the entire board) who have supported the idea of the FDC because it is a great way to ensure that the funds are distributed amongst the movement in the interest of the movement. The funds are those of the movement, and although we might disagree on how the funds are divided we agree on that. I am happy to see that the FDC as a body (and the community review process as a important addition) ensures much more transparent processes.

No worry there. I know the board is largely (or unanimously ?) 
supporting the concept of FDC. My question was definitly to Nathan...

>>
>> Supporting
>>> chapter operations, and funding offices and staff in dozens of
>>> countries, is not the chief object of the money raised from donors. We
>>> need to get away from the belief that chapters are unquestionably the
>>> best use of movement resources. There is a place for outreach,
>>> publicity, and targeted educational programs. But the WMF is best
>>> situated to supplement the efforts begun by volunteers, in the same
>>> way the WMF itself was created and has grown.
>>
>> I would object to the idea that WMF is best situated to supplement efforts started by volunteers and that statement parts from the decision made some months ago to deflate WMF role.
>> But we may agree to disagree on this.
>
> I would agree with you here. I think that the WMF is in a good position to help certain initiatives and that in several cases there are better alternatives. This is why I am so excited about chapters helping chapters and all affiliations being able to join the wikimedia conference in Milan this year. It is that kind of exchange of experience which is perfect for all involved, and lets remember that what works for some might not work for others.
>
>>
>> Additionnaly... I must add that when WMF was precisely at the current stage of most chapters (with no staff and no office), it was run in a rather creative fashion that would make everyone cough today in comparison to the requirements and obligations made mandatory to chapters. Uh. You may have a slightly more ideal view of the past :)
>
> True, but just because things used to be "bad" is no reason that they should be "bad" now if we can prevent it (I was there with you, and we are both happy that we outgrew that phase with a minimal of damage and a LOT of luck in finding the right ED)  the scale of the organisation now makes it impossible to tolerate that kind of "creativity" when not absolutely necessary.

True. But I would argue that's in good part because we had so little 
that things were operated in a "bad" way. And it is not because WMF was 
so tight on money for its first 3-4 years of operations that we should 
somehow make it so that all organizations should also go through such 
pains.

>> It would be a poor use
>>> of movement funds indeed if the WMF decided to pour money into infant
>>> chapters with minimal development and fuzzy strategic goals. That's a
>>> recipe for, at an absolute minimum, good-faith mismanagement and waste
>>> of scarce donor resources. Avoiding this path was a very wise decision
>>> by the trustees, and I only hope they remain resolute despite
>>> criticism and Sue's impending departure.
>>
>> I mostly hope that they stay consistant with their own past decisions (=we were sold the fact that the money collected belong to the mouvement, not to the entity collecting it. If so, decisions of allocations should not become WMF ones).
>
> Agreed, which is why I think the FDC's advice is so important and I hope to never have to question it (although the board does have to have a final say in these matters as a matter of governance)
>
>>
>> In any cases... I know not if WM HK should have been funded or not. What I know is that the mouvement need happy and rested and humanly treated volunteers to stay healthy.
>
> True, but volunteers also have to ensure not to force themselves into positions of "make or break" and thereby put themselves at risk.

Yup :)
Which is why I stepped down at last year elections on WM FR board. I am 
really glad I did it. I knew this year was going to be really tough. And 
it is not deceiving me.... annus horribilis :(

>
>>
>> We keep talking about editors decrease. Maybe in the future, we'll talk about irl volunteers (as in "chapter members") decrease as well.
>
> I think we should, and I think that some of that discussion took place in Milan. As we know there are different kind of volunteers who organise affiliates (because the problem is not limited to chapters) and it takes different ways to keep motivated. These are important topics to discuss and keep track of. But lets not fall into the trap of blaming the "big bureaucratic body of the WMF" for all the problems we have. Volunteers burn out because of lots of reasons and we should all take care to fix those problems that are within our reach to control, and try to reduce the risk of burnout for all those involved (and again: meeting each other physically and exchanging experiences is a really good way of recharging)...

I do not think WMF bureaucracy is to blame in this case.

>> In the past years, we have seen several times organizers of Wikimania plain disappear after the event. Burn-out. I do not think it is a good outcome. For no-one.
>> And I do not think it is a good idea to slap a chapter organizing Wikimania this year with words such as "infant, minimal development, fuzzy strategic goals" whose funding would be "at an absolute minimum, mis-management and waste of donor resources".
>
> I would never characterise it that way, but I would also not
>>
>> Organizing Wikimania is an effort which deserve a little bit more respect than this. Either we trust the chapter to host Wikimania or we do not. I do.
>
> I do trust them for organising Wikimania (its looking to be great!) , but I think that their FDC proposal was too optimistic in growth and share the other criticism of the FDC and the community on the talk page. The two are not isolated, but they are not the same either.
>
> And to be clear: I think that WMHK should reapply to the GAC (because I do think we need to fund them as a movement) with a modest proposal (and reading Asaf's long mail it seems to me that this is a much better place for their proposal… I just wonder how we can ensure that affiliates apply to the right funding the first time around. Of course a condition to any funding is being in compliance.

Yeah, but the rules of the GAC probably need to be refreshed so that it 
can cover administrative costs which would not be directly related to a 
specific project but would be more general support to an organization 
(this organization would still need to show decent programming of 
course). Admin stuff is probably what is right now toughest for most 
organizations.

I was thinking of the numerous (quite successful) associations in 
France, which are simply made of entrepreneurs wishing to do things 
together (from networking, to training, to visits, conferences etc.). 
Most of those associations have only one staff member, a long-term hired 
secretary who takes care of secretarial work. The rest of the 
association activity is 100% taken care of by the volunteer 
entrepreneurs (usually through an extended board of volunteer members).
In many cases, the secretary is paid with sponsorship and membership 
fees. Oftenly, the city or the region offers a free-of-charge office 
corner in a public building. With only one full time or 50% time 
secretary knowing all details of the association, the members of these 
associations do miracles because they are relieved of the burden of 
doing paperworks, renting spaces, giving phone calls, sending general 
assemblies invitation, sending receipt, cashing checks and doing doodles 
to organize meetings. In most cases where I have seen this secretary 
position missing, the association is suffering because members get stuck 
in simple paperwork stuff. That's sad. Just a stable position of the 
sort can change things dramatically and balance the turnover of members.

But this recipe which I think is generally a good practice amongst such 
associations is not possible for our organizations through the GAC 
system and pushes them toward the FDC at a much too early stage of 
development.

Compliance or lack there-of is a different issue.

Flo

> Jan-Bart
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> Wikimedia-l at lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l
>