<div dir="ltr">That is indeed very interesting, so thanks for posting! I wasn't actually talking about that measurement however. I was wondering if it was possible to catch the number of uploads using the specific easy upload link from a Wikipedia page, rather than one from a WLM website (which is where the banner takes you). So for example I know that in the Dutch Wikipedia, the "easy upload link" is only available in September and is used on certain Wikipedia pages (mostly the monuments lists). If most of the uploads that come through are coming from these pages, then the effect of the banner may not be as great as we think.</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Aug 24, 2015 at 2:31 PM, Estermann Beat <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:beat.estermann@bfh.ch" target="_blank">beat.estermann@bfh.ch</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="FR-CH" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Dear Jane, Richard, et al.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="FR-CH" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">We measured this in the 2013 participants’ survey:<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><a href="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d6/WLM2013_Frequencies_and_Basic_Statistics_per_Country_20140227.pdf" target="_blank">https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d6/WLM2013_Frequencies_and_Basic_Statistics_per_Country_20140227.pdf</a><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Italy:<u></u><u></u></span></p><p><u></u><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><span>-<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman""> </span></span></span><u></u><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">49% of WLM participants were new to Wikimedia projects (average across all countries: 45%)<u></u><u></u></span></p><p><u></u><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><span>-<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman""> </span></span></span><u></u><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">9% were not new, but had only participated in other photo contests before (avg. across all countries: 6%)<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Thus, Italy was slightly above average in attracting new users with their WLM contest.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Our data also show that the site notice effect is indeed not negligible at all: 60% of all participants found out about WLM through the banners on Wikipedia or other Wikipedia projects. The second most important channel concerned only 21% of participants who said that they were a “member of the organizing team / organization”, followed by “I just remembered from last year” (17%) ; social media (16%); “Somebody I know told me about the competition (10%). <u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">So you would probably lose about half of your participants (mostly new contributors) if you didn’t have banners at all. Whether you would also lose half of the contributions is a completely different story, as people tend to contribute with varying intensity. I didn’t look into this. Also, it’s not so clear how to ponder quantity against quality…<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Cheers,<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Beat<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> <a href="mailto:wikilovesmonuments-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org" target="_blank">wikilovesmonuments-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:wikilovesmonuments-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org" target="_blank">wikilovesmonuments-bounces@lists.wikimedia.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Jane Darnell<br><b>Sent:</b> Montag, 24. August 2015 13:29<br><b>To:</b> Wiki Loves Monuments Photograph Competition<br><b>Cc:</b> Wikimedia Mailing List<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Wiki Loves Monuments] [Wikimedia-l] Wiki Loves Monuments in Italy largely blocked by WMF fundraising<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">Not sure how to measure this, but it would be interesting for our stats if we COULD measure this. I define a casual uploader as someone who comes to the upload wizard through the WLM easy upload link from a Wikipedia page rather than some other way.<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">On Mon, Aug 24, 2015 at 1:11 PM, Richard Symonds <<a href="mailto:richard.symonds@wikimedia.org.uk" target="_blank">richard.symonds@wikimedia.org.uk</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">I am not sure how the Italian WLM works, but I believe they do still attract newbies to the competition. I am not sure about their p<span style="font-size:9.5pt">roportion of "casual<br>uploaders/experienced uploaders" but we haven't seen figures either way there.</span><u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><br clear="all"><u></u><u></u></p><div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Richard Symonds<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">Wikimedia UK<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">0207 065 0992<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:6.0pt;margin-left:0cm;line-height:14.4pt;background:white"><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. Registered Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London EC2A 4LT. United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the Wikimedia Foundation (who operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).</span><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p><p style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:6.0pt;margin-left:0cm;line-height:14.4pt;background:white"><b><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal control over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.</span></b><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p></div></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">On 24 August 2015 at 12:08, Jane Darnell <<a href="mailto:jane023@gmail.com" target="_blank">jane023@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">I think you misunderstand me. What I meant to say is that though the impact<br>of no banner might be great, it is not so great as it would be for those<br>countries who can attract newbies to the competition. The Italian situation<br>is so complicated that I don't think their proportion of "casual<br>uploaders/experienced uploaders" is the same as for other countries, ergo,<br>the banner would be less of an issue, though still an issue.<br><br>On Mon, Aug 24, 2015 at 12:54 PM, Romaine Wiki <<a href="mailto:romaine.wiki@gmail.com" target="_blank">romaine.wiki@gmail.com</a>><br>wrote:<u></u><u></u></p><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><br>> Hi Jane,<br>> Yes, Italy is one of those odd countries without freedom of panorama. The<br>> copyright on photos of monuments is held by local governments. Wikimedia<br>> Italy has as large task to get permission from these hundreds/thousands<br>> local administrations for the photos uploaded. Therefore organising Wiki<br>> Loves Monuments in Italy is a very very heavy and extensive task in<br>> comparison with other countries. The Italian Wiki Loves Monuments team does<br>> a great job in getting all the permissions.<br>><br>> You can't derive from the situation that there is no FoP, that thus the<br>> impact won't be too great. Te kort door de bocht.<br>><br>> Romaine<br>><br>> 2015-08-24 12:19 GMT+02:00 Jane Darnell <<a href="mailto:jane023@gmail.com" target="_blank">jane023@gmail.com</a>>:<br>><br>>> Isn't Italy one of those odd European countries that won't allow freedom<br>>> of panorama? Surely the impact won't be too great, considering that the<br>>> type of people who can participate are at least savvy enough to understand<br>>> the oddities of the Italian monuments situation & Commons. Italy was late<br>>> to join the WLM party for this reason, and I understand it is only specific<br>>> municipalities that take part now.<br>>><br>>> On Mon, Aug 24, 2015 at 11:31 AM, Romaine Wiki <<a href="mailto:romaine.wiki@gmail.com" target="_blank">romaine.wiki@gmail.com</a>><br>>> wrote:<br>>><br>>>> Giving Wiki Loves Monuments the worst possible situation is certainly<br>>>> not a compromise, but a situation in what users from the community are<br>>>> crushed under the weight of the foundation. A compromise is, according to<br>>>> the dictionary, a situation in what both parties concede something. In this<br>>>> case, WLM concedes everything and WMF nothing.<br>>>> I have seen already users asking if this will be the next big clash<br>>>> between WMF and the community, after the VisualEditor, MediaViewer,<br>>>> Superprotect and other issues. I personally hope not.<br>>>><br>>>> You are of course free to think how much negative impact it will have,<br>>>> but I base my numbers on the statistics from the past years. We have seen<br>>>> each time a big influence from conflicting banners or outage. We have<br>>>> followed the statistics and the impact of past years and we have learned<br>>>> from the past that it has a big impact we certainly should not<br>>>> underestimate.<br>>>><br>>>> And I disagree with your statement that there always will be a clash<br>>>> somewhere. There is no need for a clash if people work together on the<br>>>> planning. September is not the only month in autumn, and not all countries<br>>>> are occupied by Wiki Loves Monuments. Suggesting otherwise are fairy tales.<br>>>> This is one of the strongest examples of bad planning I have seen in all<br>>>> the years. Of every country that organises Wiki Loves Monuments, they have<br>>>> picked the worst possible country.<br>>>><br>>>> You reduce this problem to just a "number of emotive emails", with what<br>>>> you make clear you missed the essence of this case.<br>>>><br>>>> Romaine<br>>>><br>>>> 2015-08-24 10:53 GMT+02:00 Chris Keating <<a href="mailto:chriskeatingwiki@gmail.com" target="_blank">chriskeatingwiki@gmail.com</a>>:<br>>>><br>>>>> Hi Romaine,<br>>>>><br>>>>> > And the outcome is ridiculous. This is not a compromise. The Italian<br>>>>> WLM<br>>>>> > team has been crashed under the weight and preponderance of the<br>>>>> Wikimedia<br>>>>> > Foundation.<br>>>>><br>>>>> Well - it *is* a compromise. It isn't what you want and I think I<br>>>>> understand your reasons for thinking it will have a very big impact. I<br>>>>> know<br>>>>> from plenty of past experience of being a volunteer disagreeing with WMF<br>>>>> staff how frustrating this is (though actually I think the impact on<br>>>>> WLM<br>>>>> will be less than you expect in this case).<br>>>>><br>>>>> But it is plainly not the case that the WMF has just blundered ahead<br>>>>> with<br>>>>> what it was going to do anyway. And even if WMF were not involved at all<br>>>>> and there were some other method of allocating banner space, if Autumn<br>>>>> has<br>>>>> the peak fundraising potential and is when WLM happens, there will<br>>>>> always<br>>>>> be some kind of clash somewhere, and someone or other will not get what<br>>>>> they want. No number of emotive emails will change that.<br>>>>><br>>>>> Regards,<br>>>>><br>>>>> Chris<br>>>>> _______________________________________________<br>>>>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:<br>>>>> <a href="https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines" target="_blank">https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines</a><br>>>>> <a href="mailto:Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org" target="_blank">Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org</a><br>>>>> <<a href="https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/GuidelinesWikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org" target="_blank">https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/GuidelinesWikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org</a>><br>>>>> Unsubscribe: <a href="https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l" target="_blank">https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l</a>,<br>>>>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org" target="_blank">wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org</a>?subject=unsubscribe><br>>>>><br>>>><br>>>><br>>>> _______________________________________________<br>>>> Wiki Loves Monuments mailing list<br>>>> <a href="mailto:WikiLovesMonuments@lists.wikimedia.org" target="_blank">WikiLovesMonuments@lists.wikimedia.org</a><br>>>> <a href="https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikilovesmonuments" target="_blank">https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikilovesmonuments</a><br>>>> <a href="http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org" target="_blank">http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org</a><br>>>><br>>><br>>><br>>> _______________________________________________<br>>> Wiki Loves Monuments mailing list<br>>> <a href="mailto:WikiLovesMonuments@lists.wikimedia.org" target="_blank">WikiLovesMonuments@lists.wikimedia.org</a><br>>> <a href="https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikilovesmonuments" target="_blank">https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikilovesmonuments</a><br>>> <a href="http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org" target="_blank">http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org</a><br>>><br>><br>><br>> _______________________________________________<br>> Wiki Loves Monuments mailing list<br>> <a href="mailto:WikiLovesMonuments@lists.wikimedia.org" target="_blank">WikiLovesMonuments@lists.wikimedia.org</a><br>> <a href="https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikilovesmonuments" target="_blank">https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikilovesmonuments</a><br>> <a href="http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org" target="_blank">http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org</a><br>><br>_______________________________________________<br>Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: <a href="https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/GuidelinesWikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org" target="_blank">https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines<br>Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org</a><br>Unsubscribe: <a href="https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l" target="_blank">https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l</a>, <mailto:<a href="mailto:wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org" target="_blank">wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org</a>?subject=unsubscribe><u></u><u></u></p></div></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p></div><p class="MsoNormal"><br>_______________________________________________<br>Wiki Loves Monuments mailing list<br><a href="mailto:WikiLovesMonuments@lists.wikimedia.org" target="_blank">WikiLovesMonuments@lists.wikimedia.org</a><br><a href="https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikilovesmonuments" target="_blank">https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikilovesmonuments</a><br><a href="http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org" target="_blank">http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org</a><u></u><u></u></p></div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p></div></div></div><br>_______________________________________________<br>
Wiki Loves Monuments mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:WikiLovesMonuments@lists.wikimedia.org">WikiLovesMonuments@lists.wikimedia.org</a><br>
<a href="https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikilovesmonuments" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikilovesmonuments</a><br>
<a href="http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org</a><br></blockquote></div><br></div>