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</head><body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">Jane, you are quite right,
and this illustrates a clear distinction between what at least the UK
organisers considered 'valuable' and what the Foundation is focusing on.<br>
<br>
One of the main aims of the UK contest was to <span><meta
http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">encourage
the collection, development, promotion and distribution of open
knowledge. This was done by uploading photographs to Wikimedia Commons
in line with Commons' open knowledge aims [1] of </span>providing a
media file repository:<span><meta http-equiv="content-type"
content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
<ul><li>that makes available public domain and freely-licensed
educational media content to all, and</li><li>that acts as a common
repository for the various projects of the Wikimedia Foundation.</li></ul></span><span>The
WMF evaluation addresses only the second of these open knowledge aims,
which may be understandable from the Foundation's perspective, but was
never our main purpose.<br>
<br>
In most countries I suspect that the narrow focus of "improving
Wikipedia"</span> was not the reason for running the contest. It has
been known for some time that WLM is not a particularly effective way to
achieve that specific goal. The goal of <span><span>improving
Wikipedia</span> </span>is of course useful in its own right, and indeed
may be something we will consider next time. It will not be tackled
through the WLM contest, though.<br>
<br>
Michael (WLM-UK organiser)<br>
<br>
[1] <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Project_scope">https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Project_scope</a><br>
<blockquote style="border: 0px none;"
cite="mid:CAFVcA-GvRvLG6W4ndSBM_hrchyB9+XRq4CkTv-geEu+UZo1m-A@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div style="margin:30px 25px 10px 25px;" class="__pbConvHr"><div
style="display:table;width:100%;border-top:1px solid
#EDEEF0;padding-top:5px"> <div
style="display:table-cell;vertical-align:middle;padding-right:6px;"><img
photoaddress="jane023@gmail.com" photoname="Jane Darnell"
src="cid:part1.08010806.04020006@maggs.name" name="postbox-contact.jpg"
height="25px" width="25px"></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;width:100%">
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:jane023@gmail.com"
style="color:#737F92
!important;padding-right:6px;font-weight:bold;text-decoration:none
!important;">Jane Darnell</a></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;">
<font color="#9FA2A5"><span style="padding-left:6px">2 May 2015 13:20</span></font></div></div></div>
<div style="color:#888888;margin-left:24px;margin-right:24px;"
__pbrmquotes="true" class="__pbConvBody"><div dir="ltr">I was a bit
surprised to learn that Wikimedia Commons files are only "valuable" if
they are explicitly used to illustrate Wikipedia articles. Though of
course that is important, there are lots and lots of Wikipedia articles
that link out to Commons categories too. One of the most admirable parts
of the whole WLM concept is the ability of the campaign wizard to
pre-sort the image files into such categories for further categorization
by volunteers. That time investment would be seen as having zero value,
according to the article</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br></div>
<div>_______________________________________________<br>Wiki Loves
Monuments mailing list<br><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:WikiLovesMonuments@lists.wikimedia.org">WikiLovesMonuments@lists.wikimedia.org</a><br><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikilovesmonuments">https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikilovesmonuments</a><br><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org">http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org</a></div></div>
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style="display:table;width:100%;border-top:1px solid
#EDEEF0;padding-top:5px"> <div
style="display:table-cell;vertical-align:middle;padding-right:6px;"><img
photoaddress="samat78@gmail.com" photoname="Samat"
src="cid:part2.05050703.05030201@maggs.name"
name="compose-unknown-contact.jpg" height="25px" width="25px"></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;width:100%">
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:samat78@gmail.com"
style="color:#737F92
!important;padding-right:6px;font-weight:bold;text-decoration:none
!important;">Samat</a></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;">
<font color="#9FA2A5"><span style="padding-left:6px">2 May 2015 13:09</span></font></div></div></div>
<div style="color:#888888;margin-left:24px;margin-right:24px;"
__pbrmquotes="true" class="__pbConvBody"><div dir="ltr"><div><div>I
aggree with both of you, these are the main goals :)<br><br></div>(Personally
I prefer Lodewijk's approach, I think community building and outreach
is more important than simple content creation, at least for us.)<br><br></div>Samat<br><div
class="gmail_extra"><br><br></div></div>
<div>_______________________________________________<br>Wiki Loves
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<div style="margin:30px 25px 10px 25px;" class="__pbConvHr"><div
style="display:table;width:100%;border-top:1px solid
#EDEEF0;padding-top:5px"> <div
style="display:table-cell;vertical-align:middle;padding-right:6px;"><img
photoaddress="lodewijk@effeietsanders.org" photoname="Lodewijk"
src="cid:part2.05050703.05030201@maggs.name"
name="compose-unknown-contact.jpg" height="25px" width="25px"></div> <div
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<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:lodewijk@effeietsanders.org"
style="color:#737F92
!important;padding-right:6px;font-weight:bold;text-decoration:none
!important;">Lodewijk</a></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;">
<font color="#9FA2A5"><span style="padding-left:6px">2 May 2015 13:02</span></font></div></div></div>
<div style="color:#888888;margin-left:24px;margin-right:24px;"
__pbrmquotes="true" class="__pbConvBody"><div dir="ltr">I think this is a
clear demonstration that WLM is a diverse project :) You identify that
having a picture for each monument is the main goal, but as you know I
disagree with that: for me the competition is and will always be a tool
to get more people on board, to get people aware of the fact they can
contribute, and help them over the threshold. For many local
competitions, it is more important however to use WLM as a community
building tool. I have seen great outcomes in this field in the Middle
East, where communities work together in real life for one of their
first main projects, and after that continue to organize other
activities as well. <div><br></div><div>Best,<br>Lodewijk</div></div><div
class="gmail_extra"><br><br></div>
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<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:romaine.wiki@gmail.com"
style="color:#737F92
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<font color="#9FA2A5"><span style="padding-left:6px">2 May 2015 12:54</span></font></div></div></div>
<div style="color:#888888;margin-left:24px;margin-right:24px;"
__pbrmquotes="true" class="__pbConvBody"><div dir="ltr"><div><div>The
focus of the evaluation is very much biased. <br><br></div>The focus is
too much on money, it gives me a horrible feeling, the
community/participants are not a
factory plant in what every employee needs to work a minimum number of
hours. The goal of Wiki Loves Monuments is to get all monuments with a
good picture on Wikipedia, not just of the most popular or easy
monuments. The first time a contest as such is organised
the low hanging fruits are done first, but they forget to mention that
getting the low hanging fruits is not the core
goal of Wiki Loves Monuments. The goal of Wiki Loves Monuments is to
get a photo of every monument. The more monuments get a picture, it
becomes much harder to ge a picture of the other monuments. It are too
much
easy thoughts without thinking it through. It is failing in
describing the actual situation and misses totally what Wiki Loves
Monuments is about.<br><br></div>WMF has set some objectives for itself,
and now the evaluate those objectives/goals, even while Wiki Loves
Monuments has a different focus. <br><div><br></div><div>To me the
evaluation is a signal that WMF is too far away from the actual
community.<br><br></div><div>Romaine<br></div><div><br></div></div><div
class="gmail_extra"><br><br></div>
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