[WikiEN-l] Legal obligation to report Wikipedia editorunder UCMJ (Mike G weigh in?)

Fri Jan 4 00:45:21 UTC 2008

Unfortunately, the evidence by Theresa knott
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration/Jim62sch/Evidence#Evidence_presented_by_Theresa_Knott
and my own experience with Jim62sch and OrangeMarlin does not lead me
to believe it was a polite warning.  Rather than simply stating that
they have to do it, and following through, they repeated the threat
(one example: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Incidents&diff=prev&oldid=181415533
).

I read this as an attempt to drive off an opponent in a content
dispute, pure and simple.
Sxeptomaniac

> On Thu, 3 Jan 2008 17:43:19 -0500, Nathan <nawrich at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> There are many, many different professions with affirmative reporting
> requirements. I've been using the word 'warning' instead of 'threat'
> because threat implies a particular tone that is entirely different. A
> warning might be "You've mentioned you work in the Air Force, but
> please be aware that if you provide more completely identifying
> information about yourself I or others may have to report you." Now,
> thats polite, isn't a threat and is issued in a situation where "just
> go ahead and do it" doesn't apply.
>
> The reason the "whole conversation has been about the former" in this
> case is because that is most closely what happened (between OM and VO)
> *and* it is the situation with policy implications. (On-wiki
> incivility is dealt with by policy, off-wiki non-harassing incivility
> is irrelevant). I'm satisfied with what Mike Godwin wrote, which is
> that if politely issued it is wrongheaded to construe policy as
> prohibiting warnings of a legal obligation.
>
> For examples of some professions who must report information in
> various situations: Physicians, lawyers, judges, psychologists, school
> administrators, teachers, social workers, guidance counselors,
> essentially all law enforcement, military personnel. This class
> obviously includes many millions of people, so it makes sense to
> adjust the policy to account for the affirmative reporting requirement
> issue.
> Nathan
>
> On Jan 3, 2008 5:15 PM, Josh Gordon <user.jpgordon at gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Jan 3, 2008 2:00 PM, Chris Howie <cdhowie at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > (Unless you were told to make the threat in exchange for your family's
> > > life?  ... Yes, I'm being facetious. :) )
> > >
> >
> > It still wouldn't be ethical. It might be necessary, but it wouldn't be
> > ethical.
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > --jpgordon ????
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > WikiEN-l at lists.wikimedia.org
> > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit:
> > http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2008 17:47:37 -0500
> From: Anthony <wikimail at inbox.org>
> Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Notability etymology and history (was Re:
>         WP:EPISODE)
> To: "English Wikipedia" <wikien-l at lists.wikimedia.org>
> Message-ID:
>         <71cd4dd90801031447x656bce6ck4fa66b148456e728 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> On 1/3/08, Chris Howie <cdhowie at gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Jan 3, 2008 9:19 AM, Anthony <wikimail at inbox.org> wrote:
> >
> > > I also thought of something while waiting for your response.  If
> > > maintenance is the problem, wouldn't protection be better than
> > > deletion?  Instead of deleting 80% of articles on "universities" to
> > > reduce the maintenance load, why not protect them on a rotating
> > > schedule where 20% are unprotected each day during a five day period?
> > >
> >
> > WP:CREEP aside, sounds like a maintenance nightmare, unless it could be done
> > by bots.  IMHO it would be better to coordinate maintenance in a useful way
> > rather than skipping a coordination attempt and going right to protection.
> >
> It'd definitely have to be done by bots, if not coded into the
> software.  And yeah, doing a better job of maintenance would be a much
> better solution.  I only presented protection as a better solution
> than deletion for dealing with problems of vandalism.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2008 18:06:24 -0500
> From: gwern0 at gmail.com
> Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Interesting fact
> To: kmw at armory.com, English Wikipedia <wikien-l at lists.wikimedia.org>
> Message-ID: <20080103230624.GC10702 at localhost>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> On 2007.12.30 11:03:14 -0600, Kurt Maxwell Weber <kmw at armory.com> scribbled 0.7K characters:
> > On Sunday 30 December 2007 07:33, Daniel R. Tobias wrote:
> > > On Sun, 30 Dec 2007 11:58:39 +0000, "Thomas Dalton"
> > >
> > > <thomas.dalton at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > On 26/12/2007, Nachman <nachman.chayal at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > The quote was "Hello, we found your name on Wikipedia. You're the new
> > > > > CIA job fair representative."
> > > >
> > > > That would be an extremely stupid policy... so it's probably true.
> > >
> > > After all, the "intelligence" in their name doesn't refer to the sort
> > > that is measured by IQ tests.
> >
> > Has it ever occurred to you all that perhaps people whose life work is
> > intelligence gathering might actually know more about it than a bunch of
> > random jokers on the Internet?
> > --
> > Kurt Weber
> > <kmw at armory.com>
>
> [[Open Source Intelligence]].
>
> No. No, not really. I suspect I dropped that idea somewhere along the line - although I couldn't tell you whether it was the cyborg cats, the remote viewing, the MKULTRA and more covert programs, the sponsorship of heroin and cocaine criminal syndicates (to say nothing of the right-wing dictatorships), the poisoned cigar and wetsuits, or what which specifically disabused me of that idea.
>
> --
> gwern
> OIR man transfer Meade ADIU Team VGPL DST plutonium MD5
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2008 18:27:14 -0500
> From: "Chris Howie" <cdhowie at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Legal obligation to report Wikipedia editor
>         under   UCMJ (Mike G weigh in?)
> To: "English Wikipedia" <wikien-l at lists.wikimedia.org>
> Message-ID:
>         <3d2f29dc0801031527o2fa10d63m30c82b0baafa8c61 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> You guys do know that I was just introducing that scenario as an obnoxious
> joke, right?
>
> On Jan 3, 2008 5:40 PM, Thomas Dalton <thomas.dalton at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On 03/01/2008, Josh Gordon <user.jpgordon at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > On Jan 3, 2008 2:00 PM, Chris Howie <cdhowie at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > >
> > > > (Unless you were told to make the threat in exchange for your family's
> > > > life?  ... Yes, I'm being facetious. :) )
> > > >
> > >
> > > It still wouldn't be ethical. It might be necessary, but it wouldn't be
> > > ethical.
> >
> > You have strange ethics... I think it would be perfectly ethical to
> > choose your family's lives over being nice to someone.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > WikiEN-l mailing list
> > WikiEN-l at lists.wikimedia.org
> > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit:
> > http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Chris Howie
> http://www.chrishowie.com
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Crazycomputers
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2008 18:29:43 -0500
> From: gwern0 at gmail.com
> Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Year articles
> To: English Wikipedia <wikien-l at lists.wikimedia.org>
> Message-ID: <20080103232943.GE10702 at localhost>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> On 2008.01.02 00:08:43 +1100, Steve Bennett <stevagewp at gmail.com> scribbled 1.1K characters:
> > On 12/31/07, Andrew Gray <shimgray at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Some time ago, we discussed the various articles on years, which are
> > > invariably bald timelines of births, deaths and events; the
> > > possibility of fleshing them out into prose was tossed around.
> > >
> > > I've just been told someone finally did one of them :-)
> > >
> > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1345
> > >
> > > with the old content at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1345_timeline
> > >
> > > Thoughts?
> >
> > Interesting. IMHO, it's a bit *too* specific. Most of the interesting
> > things in history don't happen in one year, they take a few. So I'd
> > expect to find lots of little boxes like this:
> >
> > War of blah: |1290.........1345...1360|
> >
> > or something.
> >
> > An article that lists all the events that happened in one year strikes
> > me as almost like trivia. It also doesn't really work as a
> > navigational aid, because you can't readily click to find out what
> > happened next n whatever sequnce of events.
> >
> > I'm also thinking that if we have so much manpower that we can afford
> > to produce articles as detailed as this on the years, why not just
> > spend that manpower on the historic event articles themselves?
> >
> > Steve
>
> A brilliant idea. The logical next step is to start deleting all the video game and pop culture articles like Pokemon - we can then channel all the spare editor energy into sprucing up the year articles once the events are all cleaned up.
>
> It's a win-win situation.
>
> --
> gwern
> OIR man transfer Meade ADIU Team VGPL DST plutonium MD5
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