[WikiEN-l] (Offtopic) Very wrong things to use Mediawiki for...

[Monahon, Peter B.]

>>> Earlier: "...anything that isn't a
>>> wiki shouldn't be running on Mediawiki..."

>> Response: ...please don't "should" on us.

>> Reply: Why not?

Peter Blaise responds: It's a philosophical thing.  "Should" happens.
Some of our contributions are full of "should".  Don't step in the
"should".  The word "should" sounds so much like that other "sh..."-word
that it's all I hear when someone's "shoulds" on me!  I think you
understand.  As Albert Einstein is reported to have said, 

"Example isn't just another way to teach. Example is the only way to
teach." -- Albert Einstein

In other words, we shouldn't "should" on each other, so to speak!  If we
think someone else "should" do something, all we can do is set an
example of how we do it, and hope they learn from our example.  When was
the last lecture you paid attention to?  Me neither!

Also, it's not really up to anyone else what is or is not a wiki.  Wiki
is in the eye of the beholder (just as "should" is on the shoes of the
be-stepper?).  Me?  I see a wiki as a quick way for a community to build
something, and I see both elements as, well, elemental: the community,
and the something built.  Others see only the community, while some
others see only the something built, I guess.  

I can also understand that all wikis may need to be different in some
essential way.  I have one-page wikis, I have wikis with thousands of
pages that only one person can edit, but all visitors can discuss.  Each
wiki seems to be the unique product of the community that built it, even
a community of one.  Will we ever find "the" truth about what is a wiki?
Let me quote Albert Einstein again:

"Measured objectively, what a man can wrest from Truth by passionate
striving is utterly infinitesimal.  But the striving frees us from the
bonds of the self and makes us comrades of those who are the best and
the greatest." -- Albert Einstein

So, I guess the meta-message here is to keep on trying, just don't
expect any result other than maintaining the perpetual process of
trying, itself.

==

> Earlier: "...Technically, Wikipedia is (and
> almost certain, always will be) a wiki..."

Peter Blaise responds:  We disagree (and I do not expect to convince you
to change your mind).  For me, a wiki is a free and open community
gathered for a purpose.  I see elitists, the deletionists, and banners
as anti wiki when they delete and ban anything BUT spam and vandals,
that is, when they review content and pass judgment.  I suggest that
they improve what they read (EDIT - what a concept!), or, move on and
let someone else pitch in, but stop getting in the way.  I believe that
even people who write pretty lame stuff may come back and clean up their
own stuff - given time, and given positive examples.  Regardless, biting
somebody's heads of and spitting them out because we don't like what
they wrote is anti wiki, in my book.

> Earlier: "...Do you mean the Wikimedia 
> Foundation? There is no 
> MediaWiki Foundation..."

Peter Blaise responds: Oops, I can never keep those trademarks clear no
matter how hard I try.  Of course I know there's:

- the software: MediaWiki

- the web site: Wikipedia

- the company: Foundation

I just can't remember the Foundation's name:

- MediaWiki Foundation
- Wikipedia Foundation
- Mediapedia Foundation
- Wediapicki Foundation ...

... I know they've spent thousands of dollars on trademark registrations
(look at my email address - doh!) but I just can't keep 'em straight!

> Earlier: :...but Wikipedia was the main 
> reason-to-be for the MediaWiki 
> Foundation, and they don't seem to know 
> what they've got, nor remember 
> how it got there..."

Peter Blaise explains:  To reiterate, I find that what I consider to be
the elitist exclusivity, deletionist, and banning attitudes as practiced
at Wikipedia.org, and at MediaWiki.org, and at
whatever-the-name-of-the-Foundation-is.org, to me, are anti wiki.  To
me, it smells like now they want to claim glory and limelight for
something other than what made them famous: customer service, wiki
style, come one, come all, hey, it's a wiki, edit every page!

Not.