[WikiEN-l] [Fwd: Re: The hard work of NPOV]

[Fred Bauder]

I think we all need to work on developing the ability to recognize a
"bandwagon" when we see it, and take care that the contrarian point of
view is appropriate expressed. For example, note that contrarian is a word
used in financial circles, did we adequately treat the housing boom BEFORE
the sub-prime crisis?

Fred

> "Giving extra weight due to or own suspicions" is common sense, not OR
> in the WP meaning of it. . It will always take research in some sense to
> determine what sources to use and what constitutes proper weight--that
> is not what is meant by NOR. Research on the ground, yes that's OR in
> the NOR sense.
>
> Encyclopedia editing is like journalism--it needs to be informed by the
> facts in the real world. it's not a mechanical process, though some of
> the botmasters for the bots used to make WP pages from public domain
> sources may think otherwise, You need to know what to look for, how to
> recognize it, and how to put it together. NPOV means doing this
> objectively, in recognition of all the particular views, and with
> judgment for what needs to be said about them.
>
>
> On Dec 6, 2007 1:23 PM, Fred Bauder <fredbaud at fairpoint.net> wrote:
>
>> I aspire to more, but did we even satisfy the requirements of NPOV?
>>
>> Fred
>>
>> > Even if we gave little weight to such claims that isn't our fault.
>> Giving extra
>> > weight due to or own suspicions or looking at the facts on the
>> ground would almost certainly constitute [[WP:OR|original
>> research]]. Not our job.
>> >
>> > Quoting Fred Bauder <fredbaud at fairpoint.net>:
>> >
>> >> -------- Original Message --------
>> >> Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] The hard work of NPOV
>> >> From: "Fred Bauder" <fredbaud at fairpoint.net>
>> >> Date: Thu, December 6, 2007 12:15 pm
>> >> To: <dgoodmanny at gmail.com>
>> >>
>> >> I was in an evil mood and confess to trolling; there are a lot of
>> good thoughts at http://yudkowsky.net/virtues/ besides the sentence
>> I seized on. We have published a "consensus of the most widespread
>> error" from time to time, particularly in the run-up to the Iraq
>> War. (I was one of the parties in error). Especially with current
>> events, it is hard to know when you are doing that as our favored
>> sources, in my case The New York Times, are fostering the error.
>> >>
>> >> It would be interesting to go back and look at the development of
>> those articles and see how much "air time" we gave to the view that
>> there were no weapons on mass destruction. Some modesty is in
>> order. Even some intelligence services were taken in. We can aspire
>> to do better then they, but without good sources on the ground, and
>> willingness to use what they might tell us, which is their failing
>> too, we cannot expect to surpass them.
>> >>
>> >> Fred
>> >>
>> >>> perhaps we should redefine it our goal, as the nearest practical
>> approach to truth the wiki process can obtain, obtained at in a
>> spirit of impartiality. That's what people reasonably expect from
>> us, not a consensus of the most widespread error.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Dec 6, 2007 9:17 AM, Fred Bauder <fredbaud at fairpoint.net>
>> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> > http://yudkowsky.net/virtues/
>> >>>> >
>> >>>> > Please discuss.
>> >>>> >
>> >>>> >
>> >>>> > - d.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> "If you fail to achieve a correct answer, it is futile to protest
>> that you acted with propriety."
>> >>>>
>> >>>> NPOV is a measure of propriety, not of truth.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Fred
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> _______________________________________________
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>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> --
>> >>> David Goodman, Ph.D, M.L.S.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
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>> >
>> >
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>
>
>
> --
> David Goodman, Ph.D, M.L.S.