[WikiEN-l] Fair use issues; we need serious help

[Gwern Branwen]

On  0, Ray Saintonge <saintonge at telus.net> scribbled:
> Gwern Branwen wrote:
>
> >On  0, George Herbert <george.herbert at gmail.com> scribbled:
> >
> >
> >>On 7/12/07, Zoney <zoney.ie at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>Of course, the simple option would simply be not to use images on en
> >>>Wikipedia under a fair use rationale. That rationale (excusing the publisher
> >>>from copyright/licence violation) is not valid everywhere, nor are the
> >>>parameters the same.
> >>>
> >>>If Wikipedia is supposed to be a free encyclopaedia, freely usable not just
> >>>in the USA and other places with similar fair use rationale, why complicate
> >>>matters with fair use images? Sure they can be stripped out prior to
> >>>publishing elsewhere in another medium, but the problem is that with fair
> >>>use images being allowed, plenty of article content will depend on such
> >>>images.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>We have the dichotomy between the goal of building the best
> >>encyclopedia possible, and building all-free content.
> >>
> >>If these two goals did not collide, we would have no problem.
> >>Unfortunately, they do, and in doing so cause untold misery.
> >>
> >>Some things, such as album covers, screen caps for games, frames from
> >>movies/anime... these have no possibility of replacable content.  The
> >>content we seek to illustrate is by nature copyrighted.  Either we, as
> >>a project, chose to do without such illustration, or we must accept
> >>some copyrighted content under fair use justifications.
> >>
> >>So far, policy is that we do so minimally.  The fuzzy grey line around
> >>"minimally" is becoming a war zone.
> >>
> >>--
> >>-george william herbert
> >>
> >>
> >
> >I think you're understating the case here. It's not just a few things like album covers or video game screen captures that requires fair use. It's basically anything to do with commercial popular culture since 1923, just for starters and in the realm of images.
> >
> WRONG!  US material that was published before 1989 required a copyright
> notice.  Pre 1989 publicity shots that did not have a copyright notce
> are in the public domain.  Anything published in the US before 1964
> whose copyright was not renewed is in the public domain.

From [[United States copyright law]]:

"Copyrightable works created before 1978 that had not entered the public domain in 1978 received protection for the § 302 term above with the exception that those copyrights would not expire before 2003. Prior to 1978, works had to be published or registered to receive copyright protection. Upon the effective date of the 1976 Act (1 January, 1978) this requirement was removed and these works received protection despite having not been published or registered. However, Congress intended to provide an incentive for these authors to publish their unpublished works. To provide that incentive these works, if published before 2003, will not have their protection expire until 2048."

As for the pre-1964 stuff: precisely what notable material wasn't renewed?

> >And even if we manage to solve images, the real lurking issue here is of *text*. How much fair use text do we have in Wikipedia? I can go to 10 random articles, find 2 or 3 fair use images - but find a multiple of that of quotes and paraphrases. And it's worse than with images, because at least with images we know images of pre-1923 matters to be public domain, regardless of whether they were taken in the English-speaking world or no. But how many of our quotes of, say, Sappho or the Dead Sea Scrolls, are *not* fair use (even though the original long predates the first glimmerings of copyright)?
> >
> Obviously fair use doesn't apply to Sappho and the Dead Sea Scrolls
> because they are in the public domain.  Translations, however, may still
> be copyright.  Where are you trying to go with these claims?
>
> Ec

It's not particularly useful for the *English Wikipedia* if those are copyrighted. Perhaps professors of ancient Greek and Aramaic don't care about the copyright restrictions on Sappho's fragments and the Dead Sea Scrolls, but the rest of us should care.

--
gwern
Halibut USCODE intelligence Kilderkin ISEP domestic Flintlock Thanatos Amherst 50MZ
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